McClellan Re-evaluating George McClellan

In the sense that the York and James were opened up to Union shipping, I would concur with reservations. Any offensive against Richmond that doesn't rely on a completely impractical amount of effort to secure rail lines stretching dozens of miles through central Virginia against any Confederate offensive relies on the York and James being opened up, and once that was done the primary remaining questions for a Union offensive against Richmond were whether they'd be willing to put in enough men to play the numbers game in the Overland - or willing to support the amphibious approach with the men needed to succeed, which is a smaller number of men than Overland.

I'm not so sure about the offensive operations in the West, though they do make significant progress. What I keep running into is that the Confederacy can afford to trade space for time repeatedly in the West, and they simply cannot in the East, so the loss of Forts Henry and Donelson and the loss of Corinth is merely painful.


The manpower cost of the Seven Days-Second Bull Run-Antietam sequence is separate and not all in the first half of 1862, but it does seem to have permanently reduced the maximum size of the army the Confederates could support in the field.
The losses in the west were absolutely devastating. The Confederacy simply could not afford to lose vast areas which were vital to the war effort. It was the basic catch-22 which the Davis Administration confronted.
 
This is the relevant text of the March 20, 1864 letter to Breck:

"Fond du Lac, Wis March 20th 64
Major,

In answer to your Circular of February 17th 64. asking for my Military history since March 4th 61, I submit the following narrative. I was appointed Colonel of the 3rd Regiment Wisconsin Volunteers,my Commission bearing date May 11th 61. I was mustered into the United States Service, with my Regiment 1000 Strong, for three years Service on the 30th day of June 1861, at Fond du Lac Wisconsin.On the 12th of July following, under orders from Lieut Genl. Scott the Regt. left Wisconsin to report to Major Genl. Patterson, and reached Sandy Hook Md on the 18th of the same month. I was at once assigned by Genl. Patterson to the Command of Maryland Heights & Sandy Hook. On the 5th of August following I was Confirmed as Brigadier General of Volunteers, with rank from May 17th 61, and was at once assigned to the Command of the 3d Brigade Banks Division. I was in command of this Brigade until March 15th 62, and in Command of the Joint Brigade of Genl. A. S.Williams and the Division of Brig Genl. Shields at the head of which forces I Entered Winchester Va on the 15th of Mch. I was releived Mch 15th 62 by Maj Gen McClellan, & ordered to Alexandria Va & assigned to the Command of 3d Div, 3 Army Corps (Heintzelmans) which I embarked on the 17th for the Peninsula and reached Hampton on the 18th, On the 13th of April following while in front of Yorktown, I sought permission of Gen McClellan to storm the Enemys lines. It is proper to say that in pursuance of McClellans timid policy, the request was not granted. I remained in command
until the 2d of May following, when I was releived by order of McClellan, on the specious plea of disrespect, in Entering an Earnest protest against the inhuman overworking of my division, while the troops of Fitz John Porter were Comparatively idle. I was ordered to report in person to the Adjt Genl. of the Army at Washington. ...."
Here is the May 15th, 1862 letter sent to Lincoln, and signed by dozens of congressmen, to reinstate Hamilton:

"He was removed from his command without any sufficient reason."

 
Oh, you bet it is. You may have noticed that I wasn't first to rely on a newspaper report ...

And on and on and on it goes. McClellan makes Mother Teresa look like a self-infatuated narcissist. As for that better "team player" Kearney, show me where Hamilton accused McClellan in unvarnished terms of "cowardice" and "treason".

Please, post a copy of Hamilton's letter...
 
This is from Civil War to the Bloody End, The Life & Times of Major General Samuel P. Heintzelman, by Jerry D Thompson:

View attachment 520819

Here is the note:
View attachment 520823

So if this is right, Hamilton became angry because after he had seen a vulnerability in the confederate line and he had asked permission to attack, and McClellan had refused. It would be interesting to read the letters he sent to Washington that were "deemed disrespectful." I suspect it was about McClellan's lack of aggressiveness, and perhaps about the favoritism shown Porter.

Except he didn't. We have the communications, which went to Heintzelman on the morning of the 17th, who sent to McClellan that Hamilton believed the works were abandoned. McClellan sent an engineer officer to perform a recce, who was killed by a shell from the "abandoned" works.

Hamilton was simply wrong, and this reflects poorly on his judgement.

Hamilton's complaints, referenced by Marvel, started before this, as there is a 14th April message from McKeever to Williams.
 
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Wait, are you saying that Rosecrans didn't fumble the pursuit?

When McPherson arrived at the end of the battle, Rosecrans gave him an order to "have your men formed on the road by first light and ready to pursue." The men formed and stood in the road for hours. When Rosecrans stumbled upon them mid-morning and asked why they had not begun the pursuit, McPherson simply pulled out the order and read it back to him. 😂
Alright, I will respond extremely quickly if you really want me to.

What you stated here in this post is unfortunately simply categorically inaccurate. The pursuit opened at daylight. The supposed encounter between Rosecrans and McPherson occurred before daylight on the 5th, if it occurred. The pursuit opened at daylight, or within a few minutes of daylight. U.S. forces did not wait for hours to receive orders to move. The plan was to move at daylight, which is basically exactly what happened. There is some to criticize in the pursuit, but this is just not accurate.

We have to formulate conclusions on the basis of a fair and judicious examination of the evidence, not formulate the conclusion and then merely try to support it (and in this case, your statement regarding what the available source states is inconsistent with what it actually states).
 
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Except he didn't. We have the communications, which went to Heintzelman on the morning of the 17th, who sent to McClellan that Hamilton believed the works were abandoned. McClellan sent an engineer officer to perform a recce, who was killed by a shell from the "abandoned" works.

Hamilton was simply wrong, and this reflects poorly on his judgement.

Hamilton's complaints, referenced by Marvel, started before this, as there is a 14th April message from McKeever to Williams.
Except anyone can see that he did. He proposed an attack to be coordinated with an artillery bombardment. His 1864 letter faulted McClellan's timidity as to why it was denied.

Considering that you haven't provided evidence of your earlier detailed account of Hamilton's behavior, I've got to assume that it was just made up.
 
Except anyone can see that he did. He proposed an attack to be coordinated with an artillery bombardment. His 1864 letter faulted McClellan's timidity as to why it was denied.
So I'd like to make sure that I understand what, in your argument, Hamilton was actually saying.


So Hamilton's argument is that his divisional guns bombarding Wynn's Mill resulted in those works being temporarily abandoned by the enemy, and by abandoned here what is meant that the enemy position was abandoned apart from a few men to work the guns.

Let's suppose that this is true, and that Hamilton's guns (amounting to no more than 18 pieces) drove the enemy infantry from the works into the woods in the rear. What this means is that the situation is as follows:

1726063401161.png

Position of Hamilton's front line is approximate.

Under bombardment by artillery, the Confederate infantry have abandoned their works, moving back no more than about 100 yards into the woods. They have also abandoned their barracks, moving back out of direct fire.

Under the circumstances that then obtained, this is a pretty reasonable course of action. Moving the infantry out of the direct line of fire and out of the works means that they are not opposed to attritional casualties - the Confederates are thus not taking the occasional casualty for no return.

More importantly, they have the means to react swiftly if Hamilton actually does try to take Wynn's Mill. The 15 mins marked is at marching pace (1 yard per second); if Hamilton advances, the Confederates have every opportunity to react and re-man the parapets.

In failing to realize this possibility, Hamilton is committing a failure of anticipation. He is failing to recognize the reason behind the enemy's actions (i.e. to avoid taking casualties for no purpose) and that they could modify that behaviour if it turned out that Hamilton was actually attacking, because they would see his infantry advancing over the clear terrain for a quarter of an hour before Hamilton reached the works.

In order for Hamilton's assessment to be correct, that he could take the position with a single brigade, it would probably need to be the case that the Confederates had actually abandoned the works and that this continued after the bombardment had halted. This is because that would be the natural result if the Confederates placed no value on holding the works with infantry in the face of possible artillery bombardment.
The only other way in which Hamilton's assessment could be correct is if the Confederates were so unwilling to take artillery casualties (in their strong artillery works, which are as strong as the heaviest works at Dam #1 - the ones which meant that the troops sheltering in them took only a single-digit number of casualties from a long bombardment by the artillery of Smith's division) that they would leave the works unoccupied despite having means and opportunity to occupy them as Hamilton's division approached.

And if Hamilton's assessment is incorrect on that second possibility, but a commitment is made as if the assessment was correct, the result is a failed assault that runs into a heavily defended parapet after advancing over half a mile under enfilading artillery fire.


What I'm saying here is that, even if Hamilton meant for an assault combined with an artillery bombardment, what he had actually seen is not sufficient to demonstrate that the bombardment would have made the assault easy. He is imputing Confederate panic (or abandonment of the works regardless of the situation) when the information he has can equally well be explained by the Confederates wanting to deny him attritional casualties.
 
Except anyone can see that he did. He proposed an attack to be coordinated with an artillery bombardment. His 1864 letter faulted McClellan's timidity as to why it was denied.

Considering that you haven't provided evidence of your earlier detailed account of Hamilton's behavior, I've got to assume that it was just made up.

No. Read what Heintzelman sent to McClellan.

"Gen Hamilton reports that no guns are visible this morning [17th April] on the enemys works in his front[,] the guns having been withdrawn from the embrasures. A few men are visible along their line of entrenchments. A few shells have been thrown into their works this morning. Genl Hamilton thinks he can carry the works to his front with small loss."

Hamilton stated the works were abandoned and he could occupy them with one brigade. It's a nonsense, which is why you're trying to talk around the issue.

McClellan, for his part, sent someone to do a recce to see if this, frankly incredible, claim was true. It wasn't.
 
No. Read what Heintzelman sent to McClellan.

"Gen Hamilton reports that no guns are visible this morning [17th April] on the enemys works in his front[,] the guns having been withdrawn from the embrasures. A few men are visible along their line of entrenchments. A few shells have been thrown into their works this morning. Genl Hamilton thinks he can carry the works to his front with small loss."

Hamilton stated the works were abandoned and he could occupy them with one brigade. It's a nonsense, which is why you're trying to talk around the issue.

McClellan, for his part, sent someone to do a recce to see if this, frankly incredible, claim was true. It wasn't.
No, read what Hamilton wrote. That's the relevant dispatch. And it's obvious that you are trying to ignore it.
 
I don't really think that anyone knows precisely why Hamilton was relieved and transferred. It can be claimed by people that they do, but I don't think that there is really any definitive answer on that.
 
This is from Civil War to the Bloody End, The Life & Times of Major General Samuel P. Heintzelman, by Jerry D Thompson:

View attachment 520819

Here is the note:
View attachment 520823

So if this is right, Hamilton became angry because after he had seen a vulnerability in the confederate line and he had asked permission to attack, and McClellan had refused. It would be interesting to read the letters he sent to Washington that were "deemed disrespectful." I suspect it was about McClellan's lack of aggressiveness, and perhaps about the favoritism shown Porter.
Since we've been given a reference to what Marvel said regarding the Hamilton incident in Radical Sacrifice, let's look at everything Marvel said about that. (Perhaps the Kindle version isn't as "complete" as the hard copy book).

According to Marvel at p. 117, Hamilton wasn't the only officer complaining about Porter's actions as "Director of the Siege". At p. 118 Marvel states that the "grumbling" about Porter involved three generals in III Corps; that one suggested the only way he could gain recognition "would be to change his name to Porter"; and that this "probably" was Hamilton, whom McClellan "sent home the next day."

While we're using Marvel and Radical Sacrifice as an authoritative source, it bears mention that at p. 172 he describes McClellan's mental state during the Seven Days as "hobbled" and dependent on Porter. This is not inconsistent with Andrew Humphreys' July 1862 assessment of McClellan's mental condition during the Seven Days nor with Rafuse's modern assessment.
 
The word "pets" is from Lincoln's May 9, 1862 letter to McClellan regarding McClellan's disregard of the three corps commanders in favor of Porter and Franklin - he refers to "pamper[ing] one or two pets". [OR XI Part 3 at 154-155].
I am aware. You and I have even spoken on that before. That doesn't really change anything as far as the above users comment is concerned. It isn't an accurate or fair description of Porter, who was a highly skilled and deeply capable professional solider and it is a term which the above user throws around all over the place.
 
I don't really think that anyone knows precisely why Hamilton was relieved and transferred. It can be claimed by people that they do, but I don't think that there is really any definitive answer on that.
That is probably correct, because McClellan never specified the grounds. That includes the initial claim in these posts that Hamilton was relieved because he "disobeyed orders". Under the doctrine of relief for cause McClellan wasn't required to do so absent a court of inquiry, so we have to try to figure it out. As an aside, we've been told that McClellan didn't do so because of a Messiah-like compunction against "embarrassing" Hamilton. That same noble approach was somehow missing in his May 8, 1862 message to Stanton referring to "incompetent" corps commanders at the Battle of Williamsburg [OR XI Part 3 at 153-154]. Only a complete dullard would be unable to figure out who he was describing.
 
I am aware. You and I have even spoken on that before. That doesn't really change anything as far as the above users comment is concerned. It isn't an accurate or fair description of Porter, who was a highly skilled and deeply capable professional solider and it is a term which the above user throws around all over the place.
We can discuss Porter in detail in another thread. One irony related to this thread is the assertions made about Hamilton's alleged undermining of Porter. Whatever the merits of that - and I'm not reaching a conclusion either way because the record is unclear - it is well known that even when the Schofield Board exonerated Porter of the charges brought by Pope (as it should have), it also sternly rebuked Porter for his comments about Pope, suggesting that they played a role in what followed. But Porter should be another thread.

Lincoln's statement was clearly intended as a criticism of Mcclellan and not of Porter or Franklin.
 
Since we've been given a reference to what Marvel said regarding the Hamilton incident in Radical Sacrifice, let's look at everything Marvel said about that. (Perhaps the Kindle version isn't as "complete" as the hard copy book).

According to Marvel at p. 117, Hamilton wasn't the only officer complaining about Porter's actions as "Director of the Siege". At p. 118 Marvel states that the "grumbling" about Porter involved three generals in III Corps; that one suggested the only way he could gain recognition "would be to change his name to Porter"; and that this "probably" was Hamilton, whom McClellan "sent home the next day."

While we're using Marvel and Radical Sacrifice as an authoritative source, it bears mention that at p. 172 he describes McClellan's mental state during the Seven Days as "hobbled" and dependent on Porter. This is not inconsistent with Andrew Humphreys' July 1862 assessment of McClellan's mental condition during the Seven Days nor with Rafuse's modern assessment.
It isn't all that difficult to see some of the mental stress which McClellan was enduring from the correspondence. The Confederate Army had been permitted to consolidate to roughly parity with his Army in numerical strength (and he believed to a size nearly double that of how own Army), with the recruiting stations having been closed and vast resources not being utilized. He certainly had some right to feel as he did and the stress is understandable.

What isn't particularly useful is the psychoanalysis regarding the Galena incident, or lots of other examples, in which others ascribe motives and explanations to his actions which they were not necessarily in a position to judge that way and go well beyond what is actually known.
 
We can discuss Porter in detail in another thread. One irony related to this thread is the assertions made about Hamilton's alleged undermining of Porter. Whatever the merits of that - and I'm not reaching a conclusion either way because the record is unclear - it is well known that even when the Schofield Board exonerated Porter of the charges brought by Pope (as it should have), it also sternly rebuked Porter for his comments about Pope, suggesting that they played a role in what followed. But Porter should be another thread.

Lincoln's statement was clearly intended as a criticism of Mcclellan and not of Porter or Franklin.
And I agree with the conclusion of the Schofield Commission that Porter's comments to Burnside were probably not appropriate for an officer to be stating about the commanding general (Pope).
 
And I agree with the conclusion of the Schofield Commission that Porter's comments to Burnside were probably not appropriate for an officer to be stating about the commanding general (Pope).
Has it ever been stated or theorized that Burnside's promotion was for tattling on the McClellan clique?
 

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