Member Review McClellan's War, by Ethan S. Rafuse

after discussing the matter with some of the generals of the AoP realized that in the emergency, no one but Mac could pull the army back together. In this Lincoln was probably correct.

I agree with Lincoln. Under the circumstances, with that army, McClellan was the only real choice.

Had Mac's ego been more in line with his abilities he could have been useful in a "relief pitcher" role, and probably stellar at organizing and training new units.
 
I agree with Lincoln. Under the circumstances, with that army, McClellan was the only real choice.

Had Mac's ego been more in line with his abilities he could have been useful in a "relief pitcher" role, and probably stellar at organizing and training new units.
And if his abilities were in line with his ego, he probably could have won the war single handedly! :giggle:
 
Nice work JerryD.
About Mac's generalship, meaning as you mentioned, "But if you accept that moderation in conducting a war was the correct approach, as Rafuse seems to do, then I guess you can see why his methodical approach makes sense"
My question for the author would be....to what end? What is the bottom line of this method? What was ever accomplished?
With Grant, his hammer blows in fact destroyed an army. At Fort Henry and Donelson, he demonstrated that destroying armies was not always the objective.
With Sherman's March, he showed very clearly the might of his army could enforce the will of the Federal government with all its economic, pyschological, political, etc, etc ramifications.

The point of those egs was to show those generals accomplished something through a very clear method. You don't see that with McClellan's so-called methods to "let em down easy" before the war is ever over!? This is a very strange method.
I will say from having read Rafuse's blog, he cites Grant as the best Union general, so I don't think he was necessarily issuing an unqualified endorsement for McClellan's approach here. (He is also generally pro-Radical Republican)
 
Thanks for this review. I finally got around to start reading this book on the power of your recommendations. That says a lot about how much I appreciate all of the suggestions and reviews on this board.

I am finding that it's not my cup of tea. Way too much about McClellan's politics. I recognize my bias there, but it's just ughhhhh. Some of the explanation about whiggism etc I agree could be summed up @JerryD. It sounds like apologia from the start.

I'll power through to get to the civil war stuff and hopefully it gets more interesting. I am afraid though that I am in the camp of just not liking his personality and not being able to get past it.

I do think McClellan had an incredibly difficult task and that particular point is the one motivating me to power through the book. I have come to understand so much more the effect of politics and interference with the military. This is a different subject, but the problem was out of control in the McClellan era. I think there's a lot that I can benefit from a different perspective etc. I'll come back around ti this thread when I am through.
 
Thanks for this review. I finally got around to start reading this book on the power of your recommendations. That says a lot about how much I appreciate all of the suggestions and reviews on this board.

I am finding that it's not my cup of tea. Way too much about McClellan's politics. I recognize my bias there, but it's just ughhhhh. Some of the explanation about whiggism etc I agree could be summed up @JerryD. It sounds like apologia from the start.

I'll power through to get to the civil war stuff and hopefully it gets more interesting. I am afraid though that I am in the camp of just not liking his personality and not being able to get past it.

I do think McClellan had an incredibly difficult task and that particular point is the one motivating me to power through the book. I have come to understand so much more the effect of politics and interference with the military. This is a different subject, but the problem was out of control in the McClellan era. I think there's a lot that I can benefit from a different perspective etc. I'll come back around ti this thread when I am through.
Yeah, I almost gave up reading the book in the first two chapters because the whole Whig political theory stuff just seemed overblown. And I agree, it does reek of apologia. I'd encourage you power through. I did appreciate getting a different perspective on Mac, but in the end I am with you. I just really don't like the guy and have to work hard to get over to critically assess his generalship. You are right about the politics of the time he had to deal with (and to be honest, that he somewhat made a decision to dabble in). He also had the disadvantage of getting Lincoln as CiC when Lincoln was still learning how to fight that war. In the end he was probably a better than average general but was never going to have the killer instinct to carry the war through to victory.
 
"never recognizes that the true key to winning the war was the destruction of CSA armies and not merely capturing key cities"

I don't understand why this gets repeated so often uncritically. Grant used the capture of key strategic points to force the Confederates to meet him on the field of battle. If going head-to-head with armies was the correct strategy, then Grant should have gone straight for Columbus instead of Donelson, straight to Vicksburg instead of Jackson, stayed north of the James instead of extending west south of Petersburg, ordered Sherman to attack Dalton head on etc etc

Armies and strategic points were both of value, but of the two, the capture of strategic points yielded the more important results.
 
"never recognizes that the true key to winning the war was the destruction of CSA armies and not merely capturing key cities"

I don't understand why this gets repeated so often uncritically. Grant used the capture of key strategic points to force the Confederates to meet him on the field of battle. If going head-to-head with armies was the correct strategy, then Grant should have gone straight for Columbus instead of Donelson, straight to Vicksburg instead of Jackson, stayed north of the James instead of extending west south of Petersburg, ordered Sherman to attack Dalton head on etc etc

Armies and strategic points were both of value, but of the two, the capture of strategic points yielded the more important results.
At the risk of getting this topic off the rails, I guess we will have to disagree on that one. Yes, strategic points are important, but as long as an army is in the field the war goes on. Americans lost their capital cities a couple times during the American Revolution, but as along as Washington was able to keep an army in the field, the Brits had to keep on fighting. Russians lost Moscow to Napoleon, but ultimately the Russians were able turn the tide and effectively bleed the Grand Armee down to a twig.

If you really want to pursue this topic, though, I suggest you start a thread. "Which was more important to win the war, capturing the ANV or capturing Richmond?"
 
At the risk of getting this topic off the rails, I guess we will have to disagree on that one. Yes, strategic points are important, but as long as an army is in the field the war goes on.
Sure, but how do they remain in the field if you sever the army from its resources?

The capture of Donelson and move to Corinth threatened the supply lines of every army in the western theater and forced Johnston to abandon Kentucky and most of Tennessee and attack Grant on ground of his choosing at Shiloh. How do you achieve those kind of results under the strategy of going head to head against armies?
 
His harshest criticism of Mac is in terms of his handling of the army during the Seven Days and how he effectively abandoned the army during Glendale and spending the afternoon on the Galena while the battle was fought by subordinates, and then nearly did the same thing by spending a good deal of time on the Galena on the morning of Malvern Hill. It was only due to CSA delays that permitted Mac to return to the battlefield in time for the battle.

I've had this thrown at me many times. "Even Rafuse says..."

The problem is, Rafuse accepted what Sears wrote at face value, and makes no attempt at investigation on his own. Had he simply gone to the OR reports, huge chunks of Sears thesis fall away.

FWIW: The Galena didn't even arrive off Malvern Hill until around 1400.



He also concludes that Mac held back troops during Second Manassas in order to destroy his rival, Pope. I would think this was an even greater crime than Mac's conduct during Glendale, but Rafuse, while admitting Mac arguably committed a crime of the highest order, does not chastise Mac for his decision.

The issue here is Rafuse again took existing secondary sources, mainly Sears and Hennessey, with a little of Cozzens. Hennessey was not writing about McClellan but rather Pope, and so missed out a lot of stuff. See here for the last time I replied to this (and the time before).



Rafuse also admits that during Antietam Mac had a great chance to destroy Lee's army if he had only committed his reserves, but explains away his failure to do so by saying that, given Mac's view that he was facing overwhelming numbers, it was prudent, from a Whig perspective, to keep the reserve in case that unaccounted for 100,000 troops should suddenly show up. He does not really assess whether it was reasonable for Mac to think he was facing such overwhelming numbers.

Rafuse was a student of Harsh's and adopts Harsh's views. He points out McClellan did not have a large reserve (pg 325) although it appears Rafuse was unaware that at that point of the battle the reserve consisted of a single brigade, Barnes.

In general, Rafuse is good, but the book is a rounding out of his PhD thesis using mainly secondary sources. He misses several opportunities to examine controversies like those mentioned here.
 
Yeah, I almost gave up reading the book in the first two chapters because the whole Whig political theory stuff just seemed overblown. And I agree, it does reek of apologia. I'd encourage you power through. I did appreciate getting a different perspective on Mac, but in the end I am with you. I just really don't like the guy and have to work hard to get over to critically assess his generalship. You are right about the politics of the time he had to deal with (and to be honest, that he somewhat made a decision to dabble in). He also had the disadvantage of getting Lincoln as CiC when Lincoln was still learning how to fight that war. In the end he was probably a better than average general but was never going to have the killer instinct to carry the war through to victory.
As we know, the following is always wise. When using reviews of a proven, well-regarded historian like Rafuse, those by uncredentialed internet posters with an established agenda are "for entertainment purposes only". l
 
Sure, but how do they remain in the field if you sever the army from its resources?

The capture of Donelson and move to Corinth threatened the supply lines of every army in the western theater and forced Johnston to abandon Kentucky and most of Tennessee and attack Grant on ground of his choosing at Shiloh. How do you achieve those kind of results under the strategy of going head to head against armies?
Again, this getting way off topic, but its a very rare strategic point that supplies 100% of resources to an army.
 
As we know, the following is always wise. When using reviews of a proven, well-regarded historian like Rafuse, those by uncredentialed internet posters with an established agenda are "for entertainment purposes only". l
Are you implying I have an established agenda? If so, I'd love to know what it is.
 
I've had this thrown at me many times. "Even Rafuse says..."

The problem is, Rafuse accepted what Sears wrote at face value, and makes no attempt at investigation on his own. Had he simply gone to the OR reports, huge chunks of Sears thesis fall away.

FWIW: The Galena didn't even arrive off Malvern Hill until around 1400.





The issue here is Rafuse again took existing secondary sources, mainly Sears and Hennessey, with a little of Cozzens. Hennessey was not writing about McClellan but rather Pope, and so missed out a lot of stuff. See here for the last time I replied to this (and the time before).





Rafuse was a student of Harsh's and adopts Harsh's views. He points out McClellan did not have a large reserve (pg 325) although it appears Rafuse was unaware that at that point of the battle the reserve consisted of a single brigade, Barnes.

In general, Rafuse is good, but the book is a rounding out of his PhD thesis using mainly secondary sources. He misses several opportunities to examine controversies like those mentioned here.
Unless you are inside Rafuse's head, I would suggest its rather incredulous that you claim to know what sources a well respected historian like Rafuse looked at and relied on. I seriously doubt he is merely parroting the opinions of others, but rather the more likely scenario is that after a thorough review of all available sources, he has arrived at his own considered opinions which, not surprisingly, often match that of other highly qualified historians.
 
Unless you are inside Rafuse's head, I would suggest its rather incredulous that you claim to know what sources a well respected historian like Rafuse looked at and relied on. I seriously doubt he is merely parroting the opinions of others, but rather the more likely scenario is that after a thorough review of all available sources, he has arrived at his own considered opinions which, not surprisingly, often match that of other highly qualified historians.

I can read the references. I know what information he used. The problem is, it is incomplete.
 
Yeah, I almost gave up reading the book in the first two chapters because the whole Whig political theory stuff just seemed overblown. And I agree, it does reek of apologia. I'd encourage you power through. I did appreciate getting a different perspective on Mac, but in the end I am with you. I just really don't like the guy and have to work hard to get over to critically assess his generalship. You are right about the politics of the time he had to deal with (and to be honest, that he somewhat made a decision to dabble in). He also had the disadvantage of getting Lincoln as CiC when Lincoln was still learning how to fight that war. In the end he was probably a better than average general but was never going to have the killer instinct to carry the war through to victory.

I have enjoyed the background history the author gave of Mac's time at West Point. It added to my understanding of the West Point conservatism and mentality. Still the academy and the politics explain Mac's preferences, but not his personality and the personality of a senior level commander is one of the most important attributes he needs to succeed. That's ultimately why I am not convinced by any of this background, although it's interesting and helpful for context about a group of men that were significant in steering things at the time.

You know who actually has given me a different perspective on Mac, Halleck, Buell, and specially Grant, etc? Clausewitz ironically, or maybe not so ironically. I recommend the very short introduction published by the Oxford University Press and written by Michael Howard. It made understanding "On War" easier.

"Jomini believed that there was a common formula underlying the successes of both Napoleon and Frederick the Great that could be summarized as 'directing the mass of one's forces successively on the decisive points in the theatre of war, and as far as possible against the communications of the enemy without disrupting one's own': an object that could best be achieved by the mastery of what he termed (as everyone else has ever since) 'interior lines'. Clausewitz denied the validity of such formulations, not so much because they were oversimplifications, but because they ignored what he saw as the essence of war. They aim at fixed values; but in war everything is uncertain, and calculations have to be made with variable quantities.

They direct the inquiry exclusively towards physical quantities, whereas all military action is intertwined with psychological forces and effects. They consider only unilateral action, whereas war consists of a continuous interaction of opposites. (p. 136) No theory could be of any value, he maintained, that did not take account of these interconnected elements - the uncertainty of all information, the importance of moral factors, and, lending emphasis to both of these, the unpredictable reactions of the adversary. The element of uncertainty arose very largely from the impossibility of gauging enemy intentions and reactions, something that was particularly difficult when there were no overmastering political incentives to determine his military decisions. At best one could only work on probabilities, and in doing this, however good one's judgement, there would always be a substantial element of sheer luck. Even the best generals were successful gamblers who had the nerve to back their judgement. No amount of theory could, in a moment of crisis, tell them what to do."


————-
Clausewitz is fascinating, maybe you'll read it and see different generals reflected in a passage, almost like Clausewitz was talking about one or another of them. I could cite a few more but won't do so here because my post is already too long and I may just do a separate post about this at some future point because I'm so immersed in this.

A different topic that your original post had me thinking about was — although Rafuse never gets into this as you point out, because it's a topic more proper for military theory than history — Would the right amount of kid gloves have worked out? There's a fallacy inherent on that, because what the Union was doing in 1862 was already not kid gloves. The escalation had already started when the Union, after a defeat at Bull Run decided to enlist, equip, and train a huge army and navy to forcefully subdue the rebellion.

Was it possible to win without ending slavery? This is possibly the point where we'd be engaged in exchanges of opinion that ultimately are just interesting from a military theory POV. My guide in these kind of issues is understandably General Grant because not only was he the victorious general but he lived in those times. Even though his opinions can only be speculation about the different results of different actions. If he or Halleck had acted differently we don't know how things would have changed afterwards, but in his view:

"My opinion was and still is that immediately after the fall of
Fort Donelson the way was opened to the National forces all over
the South-west without much resistance. If one general who would
have taken the responsibility had been in command of all the troops
west of the Alleghanies, he could have marched to Chattanooga,
Corinth, Memphis and Vicksburg with the troops we then had, and as
volunteering was going on rapidly over the North there would soon
have been force enough at all these centres to operate offensively
against any body of the enemy that might be found near them. Rapid
movements and the acquisition of rebellious territory would have
promoted volunteering, so that reinforcements could have been had
as fast as transportation could have been obtained to carry them to
their destination. On the other hand there were tens of thousands
of strong able-bodied young men still at their homes in the
South-western States, who had not gone into the Confederate army in February, 1862, and who had no particular desire to go. If our
lines had been extended to protect their homes, many of them never
would have gone. Providence ruled differently
. Time was given the
enemy to collect armies and fortify his new positions; and twice
afterwards he came near forcing his north-western front up to the
Ohio River."

Excerpt From Personal Memoirs of U. S. Grant, Ulysses S. Grant.

I think equally McClellan could say that had he been allowed to do as he thought and continue to proceed against Richmond he could have eventually captured it and destroyed the confederacy will to fight. Those things will forever remain on the what if, speculative world. I noticed how Grant used the words "Providence ruled differently." It wasn't to be.

Someone else pointed out maybe it was in a different thread that the more the armies advanced south they were already encountering slave fugitives. The issue was unavoidable, Ultimately for me that war would kill slavery was a fact the longer it went on.
 
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