Fighting Men

[Ara Oko]

I was wondering who the top ten blood and thunder battlefield fighting men were. I'm thinking of Rufus Dawes of the Iron brigade as one such.
This is about raw fighting ability. We often rank generals and whatnot, but who would be the worst man you can imagine to get in a fight with on the battlefield?

 

[SoAlaNorthGeorgian]

I don't know his name, but, he's 5' 3" tall and made of leather.

 

[wbull1]

Bedford Forrest.

 

[Ara Oko]

Bedford Forrest.

Was he the one that had, I dunno, 25 or so confirmed hand-to-hand kills?

 

[Booner]

"Bloody Bill" Anderson.

 

[wbull1]

Was he the one that had, I dunno, 25 or so confirmed hand-to-hand kills?

Certainly enough to send me hightailing it outta' there.

 

[leftyhunter]

I was wondering who the top ten blood and thunder battlefield fighting men were. I'm thinking of Rufus Dawes of the Iron brigade as one such.
This is about raw fighting ability. We often rank generals and whatnot, but who would be the worst man you can imagine to get in a fight with on the battlefield?

Newt Knight was able to live to a ripe old age in Jones County Mississippi and openly defied the miscegenation laws and no one touched him. Knight during the ACW openly killed a Confederate Major at his home plus other Confederates and lived amongst them for decade's afterwards right until the 1920s and no one got in his face.
Leftyhunter

 

[Ara Oko]

Newt Knight was able to live to a ripe old age in Jones County Mississippi and openly defied the miscegenation laws and no one touched him. Knight during the ACW openly killed a Confederate Major at his home plus other Confederates and lived amongst them for decade's afterwards right until the 1920s and no one got in his face.
Leftyhunter

He must have been a really scary guy.

 

[leftyhunter]

Was he the one that had, I dunno, 25 or so confirmed hand-to-hand kills?

Per Hursts biography Forrest offed 30 Yankee's.
Leftyhunter

 

[diane]

There were some tough, well-trained fighters during the war but I do think the most formidable and skilled would have to be Forrest. Extremely few opponents lived to evaluate him! His hand-to-hand combat kills were 31 - this is the number recorded in the reports of battles he was in. How many as part of an attacking force - who knows! - but he was reckoned to be an excellent shot. Before and after the war there were some deaths as well, probably half a dozen. For scare factor - definitely has no rivals!

 

[diane]

"Bloody Bill" Anderson.

There's the runner-up! What was Bloody Bill's tally, Booner? Good scare factor, too - wouldn't want to meet him down a dark alley, that's for sure.

 

[zburkett]

I have to go with Forrest in fearsome combat but I wouldn't have wanted to make Jack Hinson mad at me.

 

[Booner]

There's the runner-up! What was Bloody Bill's tally, Booner? Good scare factor, too - wouldn't want to meet him down a dark alley, that's for sure.

I suspect that when the boys in blue realized they were up against either Forrest or Anderson, the water flowed, if you know what I mean. But the two men were not the same. Both were hard men, but Forrest kept his humanity about him; Anderson became a mad dog killer. If you were a Union soldier and your only option was surrendering, you stood a better chance of living if you surrendered to Forrest. This wouldn't be true if you surrendered to Anderson. You would be killed, and maybe scalped.

Anderson had three younger sisters that were imprisoned in a jail in Kansas City. The jail collapsed killing one of his sisters, and wounding the other two, disabling one for life. This supposedely unhinged Anderson, and from that day on whenever he went into battle, he'd go in wild-eyed and frothing at the mouth. He supposedly kept a silk cord on his body and whenever he'd kill someone he'd add another knot to the cord. At Lawrence, (which happened shortly after the jail collapse), he added something like 13 or 14 knots. By the time he was killed in the fall of 1864, a silk cord was found on his body with over 50 knots on it.

I would love the meet a psychiatrist whose hobby was the study of Missouri guerrillas so I could better understand what was going on in the mind of some of these men. Did Anderson feel responsible for what happened to his sisters? And as the war went on, he became more vicious. I think He had become surrounded by so much killing and death that I don't think he expected to live though the war. I don't mean to say that he had a death wish, but I do think he was consumed with so much hate and revenge that he couldn't see an end to it, and death was his only way out.

 

[archieclement]

I suspect that when the boys in blue realized they were up against either Forrest or Anderson, the water flowed, if you know what I mean. But the two men were not the same. Both were hard men, but Forrest kept his humanity about him; Anderson became a mad dog killer.

Anderson had three younger sisters that were imprisoned in a jail in Kansas City. The jail collapsed killing one of his sisters, and wounding the other two, disabling one for life. This supposedely unhinged Anderson, and from that day on whenever he went into battle, he'd go in wild-eyed and frothing at the mouth. He supposedly kept a silk cord on his body and whenever he'd kill someone he'd add another knot to the cord. At Lawrence, (which happened shortly after the jail collapse), he added something like 13 or 14 knots. By the time he was killed in the fall of 1864, a silk cord was found on his body with over 50 knots on it.

I would love the meet a psychiatrist whose hobby was the study of Missouri guerrillas so I could better understand what was going on in the mind of some of these men. Did Anderson feel responsible for what happened to his sisters? And as the war went on, he became more vicious. I think He had become surrounded by so much killing and death that I don't think he expected to live though the war. I don't mean to say that he had a death wish, but I do think he was consumed with so much hate and revenge that he couldn't see an end to it, and death was his only way out.

I would have to consider Sam Hildebrand, he had 80 notches on Kill-Devil, and had a single minded determination once you were on his list. As he said ""I make no apology to mankind for my acts of retaliation; I make no whining appeal to the world for sympathy. I sought revenge and I found it; the key of hell was not suffered to rust in the lock while I was on the war path."

 

[diane]

I suspect that when the boys in blue realized they were up against either Forrest or Anderson, the water flowed, if you know what I mean. But the two men were not the same. Both were hard men, but Forrest kept his humanity about him; Anderson became a mad dog killer. If you were a Union soldier and your only option was surrendering, you stood a better chance of living if you surrendered to Forrest. This wouldn't be true if you surrendered to Anderson. You would be killed, and maybe scalped.

Anderson had three younger sisters that were imprisoned in a jail in Kansas City. The jail collapsed killing one of his sisters, and wounding the other two, disabling one for life. This supposedely unhinged Anderson, and from that day on whenever he went into battle, he'd go in wild-eyed and frothing at the mouth. He supposedly kept a silk cord on his body and whenever he'd kill someone he'd add another knot to the cord. At Lawrence, (which happened shortly after the jail collapse), he added something like 13 or 14 knots. By the time he was killed in the fall of 1864, a silk cord was found on his body with over 50 knots on it.

I would love the meet a psychiatrist whose hobby was the study of Missouri guerrillas so I could better understand what was going on in the mind of some of these men. Did Anderson feel responsible for what happened to his sisters? And as the war went on, he became more vicious. I think He had become surrounded by so much killing and death that I don't think he expected to live though the war. I don't mean to say that he had a death wish, but I do think he was consumed with so much hate and revenge that he couldn't see an end to it, and death was his only way out.

I have wondered if Anderson had a glitch in his brain, just a grenade that may or may not have had its pin pulled by the war. Comparing Forrest and Anderson isn't really possible, as you note! Forrest had a great deal of loss similar to what Bloody Bill had - Sherman made the war very personal in west Tennessee. Forrest had a great deal of control, even when it looked as if he didn't - I'm not all that sure Anderson had any control. Forrest was a real machine when it came to personal combat - he was a skilled swordsman, an excellent shot with any fire arm, knew exactly what to do with a bowie knife, and was physically very powerful. But he was always in control no matter how much adrenaline was pumping - in fact, it cleared his mind like nothing else. That doesn't seem to be true with Anderson. As you say, he was operating on pure hate and a desire to kill as many enemies as he could before they killed him. I wonder what he would have been like after the war, had he lived. I don't think he would have been able to settle down to a peaceful life! As Forrest said after the war, "I never wanted to kill anybody except in defense of my own life or my country." Bloody Bill couldn't say that, nor would he. He may have been like one of our tribe's war chiefs - whole family and most of his people wiped out so he and his remaining sons went to killing every white man, woman or child they could find. That was not going to solve the problem or bring back the dead, but there would be dead enemies. The tribe had to kill him and his sons to stop them!

 

[Ara Oko]

Per Hursts biography Forrest offed 30 Yankee's.
Leftyhunter

Wow!

 

[Ara Oko]

This is turning out to be a fascinating thread, and thanks for adding context and numbers.
It might allow us to discern the single most lethal soldier of the entire war.
It makes me wonder what might have happened if these guys had personally faced off together on a battlefield. Quite a show I suspect.

 

[Stone in the wall]

I have to go with Forrest in fearsome combat but I wouldn't have wanted to make Jack Hinson mad at me.

I was thinking that same thing.

 

[Stone in the wall]

John Mobberly Company A of Whites 35th Va Battalion. With $1,000 on his head he is assassinated by shots from the Potterfield barn. Years later one of these men (Jacob Boyer) returns and has just finished a cool drink from the Pottersfield well. The GHOSTLY HAND of Mobberly reaches out and Boyer drops dead beside the well. None of the other assassins are ever brave enough to revisit the Pottersfield farm.

 

[Ara Oko]

John Mobberly Company A of Whites 35th Va Battalion. With $1,000 on his head he is assassinated by shots from the Potterfield barn. Years later one of these men (Jacob Boyer) returns and has just finished a cool drink from the Pottersfield well. The GHOSTLY HAND of Mobberly reaches out and Boyer drops dead beside the well. None of the other assassins are ever brave enough to revisit the Pottersfield farm.

I might be dead boys, but boy, I'm still in the fight!