How would you rate Rosecrans?

How do you rate Rosecrans?

  • on a scale of one to 10 10 being the best

    Votes: 1 1.7%
  • Rosecrans was the best Union Commander

    Votes: 2 3.4%
  • Rosecrans was a good general but he drooped the ball at Chickumaga big time

    Votes: 48 82.8%
  • Rosecrans was just a little bit better then the drunk guy in command at the battle of the Crater

    Votes: 7 12.1%

  • Total voters
    58
This is begging for the introduction of this topic of the individual who I think is the real "villian" of the Rosecrans story: his two-faced chief-of-staff Brig. Gen. James A. Garfield. His relation to the topic has been discussed pretty fully in threads here before, but briefly he was the culprit who encouraged Rosecrans to return to Chattanooga and take charge of the fugitives while he (Garfield) sought out Thomas to inform him of the disaster. Before then, Rosecrans had decided to do that himself as commanding general and had actually already turned back when he met Garfield on the road. Things were all well and good until once back in Chattanooga the faithless Garfield then sent dispatches to Stanton and conspired with Stanton's agent to "smear" Rosecrans for "running away". Ever since finding this out I've always thought it was poetic justice that later as president Garfield got it in the back!
That's an interesting point that I never read before. If it was not for Garfield Rosecrans would of stayed on the field and not had the shame of the white feather. I would like to see others comment in on that.
Leftyhunter
 
That's an interesting point that I never read before. If it was not for Garfield Rosecrans would of stayed on the field and not had the shame of the white feather. I would like to see others comment in on that.
Leftyhunter
Perhaps he did manipulate the excitable Rosecrans, but he was the commanding General. To flee the field under any circumstance while substantial resistance continued, to me is unconscionable and certainly a sign of poor leadership.
 
Perhaps he did manipulate the excitable Rosecrans, but he was the commanding General. To flee the field under any circumstance while substantial resistance continued, to me is unconscionable and certainly a sign of poor leadership.
Certainly Stanton felt that way. Good point.
Leftyhunter
 
That is a quote from Alfred Hough's Soldier in the West. I have posted about the problems with the quote on other threads on this site. Basically it was from an autobiography that was written from 1875 to 1890. The complication is that Hough wrote letters to his wife in 1863. In those letters he doesn't discuss Rosecrans' mental or physical condition. This is not to say that what he wrote in the quote above was incorrect but it is still not as trustworthy as something written shortly after the events. One can learn more about Hough and his papers -many of which were destroyed- via this link: http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015005159283;view=1up;seq=158
It is one of the surprisingly few negative assessments of Rosecrans after Chickamauga that I have come upon in my research.
There is the JD Cox retelling of what he says Garfield told him but that is secondhand and wasn't published until 1900.
There are Charles Dana's telegrams sent to Washington but his first few telegrams after Chickamauga were optimistic about Rosecrans and the future of the AotC. Dana later wrote Rosecrans that what he wrote in 1863 may have been misinformed and unfair.
There was an anonymous letter written by an officer of the AotC (possibly William Hazen) that was published in a number of newspapers.
Newspaperman Wm Shanks also wrote negatively about Rosecrans.
There were also newspaper opinion pieces that accused Rosecrans of opium eating among other thing.
That is what I have found. I would be interested in seeing other negative assessments made by people who were there and written relatively close in time to the events.
You might find this analysis interesting. "The American Civil War This mighty scourge of War Gary Gallagher, Stephen Engle,Robert Krick ,Joseph Galatthaar Osprey Publishing p.133 ."..Well liked by his men and a brilliant strategist. Rosecrans was known for heavy drinking, profuse language ,and hot temper. and his soldiers dubbed him"Old Rosey". Has for the aftermath of Chicumaga this book takes the same view has Einholf and McPhearson.
Leftyhunter
 
Perhaps he did manipulate the excitable Rosecrans, but he was the commanding General. To flee the field under any circumstance while substantial resistance continued, to me is unconscionable and certainly a sign of poor leadership.
Certainly Stanton felt that way. Good point.
Leftyhunter

Judas Garfield's "angle" he used to persuade his chief was supposedly that because Rosecrans was the commanding General it was necessary for him to return and impose the authority Garfield or anyone else would have lacked to stop the rout and begin to untangle the confusion.
 
You might find this analysis interesting. "The American Civil War This mighty scourge of War Gary Gallagher, Stephen Engle,Robert Krick ,Joseph Galatthaar Osprey Publishing p.133 ."..Well liked by his men and a brilliant strategist. Rosecrans was known for heavy drinking, profuse language ,and hot temper. and his soldiers dubbed him"Old Rosey". Has for the aftermath of Chicumaga this book takes the same view has Einholf and McPhearson.
Leftyhunter
Some one who knows him described Gary Gallagher as a "Grant rehabilitationist" to me.
I've seen little to no evidence of him being a hard drinker.
He once said he was profane not never blasphemed.
That quote also is from a general history which means it is broad but not deep history.
 
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Judas Garfield's "angle" he used to persuade his chief was supposedly that because Rosecrans was the commanding General it was necessary for him to return and impose the authority Garfield or anyone else would have lacked to stop the rout and begin to untangle the confusion.
Not a convincing reason to run out on your men.
 
Not a convincing reason to run out on your men.

Consider that two-thirds of the army was no longer on the field, making it more correct to say it was they who had already done most of the running!
 
Consider that two-thirds of the army was no longer on the field, making it more correct to say it was they who had already done most of the running!
So turn tail and run? History has judged and it is not kind to Rosecrans. In an era where many General officers were KIA bravely leading their troops or attempting to stem a rout he does not inspire admiration.
 
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Consider that two-thirds of the army was no longer on the field, making it more correct to say it was they who had already done most of the running!

"I can testify to the conspicuous and steady gallantry of Rosecrans on the field. He made all possible efforts to rally the broken columns; nor do I see that there was any fault in the disposition of his forces." Charles A Dana Sept 20, 1863

Letter by a soldier who was at Chickamauga to his brother:
""Old Rosey" has left us, and sorry indeed we all were to have him go, for we "swear by him"- To be sure he was beaten in his last move, but never, even for a moment has he lost the confidence of his Army. The last we saw of him on that eventful Sunday (Sept 20th) was when he was attempting to rally his troops in a perfect hail-storm of shot, shell, and "Minie" balls, and if you could have heard the remarks of the men, after we had fallen back, and the whole army was supposed to be in retreat, you would have learned something of the reliance we placed on our brave commander."

"You have probably got a pretty good idea of what I think about Rosecrans. I judge from what you write that there is a report of his being intoxicated in the battle. I am very much surprised at that, there is no such report as that here nor have I ever heard a breath of the kind. I saw him myself in the very thickest of the fight he was not in the least excited, as a man under the influence of liquor would certainly have been at such a time (for it was when things looked darkest on the right) but rode along with perfect calmness saying what he did in an ordinary tone-- As he passed us he stopped and said "Now boys, rally, and make one charge for me". Such an accusation against him can be nothing but the vilest slander.
http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?ammem/mal:@field(DOCID+@lit(d2752600))
 
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That's an interesting point that I never read before. If it was not for Garfield Rosecrans would of stayed on the field and not had the shame of the white feather. I would like to see others comment in on that.
Leftyhunter
Garfield's relationship with Rosecrans is complex. I think he genuinely liked Rosecrans, he wrote "he loved every bone in his body" but he was a politician first and a soldier second. He did give a speech praising Rosecrans on the floor of the House of Representatives in 1864. The two had a falling out in 1880 and never reconciled. I think Dana did more harm to Rosecrans but I also think Rosecrans was set up for failure by political powers in Washington. Garfield, and others,believed that to be the case.
 
"I can testify to the conspicuous and steady gallantry of Rosecrans on the field. He made all possible efforts to rally the broken columns; nor do I see that there was any fault in the disposition of his forces." Charles A Dana Sept 20, 1863

But that was "on the field". At the time that Dana wrote that, Rosecrans was already off the field, while Thomas was still holding it. It's also worth noting that Dana still refers to the situation as "our disaster". Here's the message in its entirety:

https://books.google.com/books?id=b5QtAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA193
 
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Most of what you're calling "spade work" was begun under Rosecrans and continued to fruition under Grant - BUT the actual conception and completion of it seems to have been the inspiration of engineer William F. "Baldy" Smith. Grant only deserves credit for leaving the plan in place and Smith (who he knew previously from either West Point or Mexico - or both) alone to finish the job. Smith is another of those interesting and virtually unknown characters of the war: a failure or at least disappointment under McClellan he was shunted west to a lackluster job which he performed admirably. His reward from Grant was corps command, in which he again proved a disappointment and so he became largely "lost" to history.
A board of officers was convened in 1900-01 to determine who came up with the plan to open the Cracker Line and they concluded it was Rosecrans. The conclusion is on page 20
https://archive.org/stream/reportofboardofa00unit#page/20/mode/2up
 

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