Captain William C. Quantrill, CSA

[hanna260]

Patrick, you are one of the most knowledgeable people about Missouri here at CWT, and you are a great resource to us all. I appreciate your continually taking the time to write thoughtful, substantial posts to share the knowledge you've gained over the years.

I would agree that Quantrill was not purely evil, if for no other reason than that I doubt any human being can be purely evil.

As I was reading your post, I couldn't help thinking of Hezbollah, in Lebanon. They keep local people's loyalty partly if not mostly through intimidation, but they also gain allies through services they provide the local population such as clinics and schools.

I also am reminded once again that one of the worst things about war is that, besides the organized violence, it sets loose the worst elements in society. A certain percentage of the population, including in peacetime, is sociopaths and psychopaths. Societies in good condition can limit the scope of the damage these sick individuals can do. But when society's stabilizing structures are destroyed by war, these elements are set loose.

One of Owen Parry's Civil War mysteries (the third book in his series of six), Call Each River Babylon, offers a tremendously disturbing picture of what psychos and sickos can do when the chaos of war removes all the usual inhibitions.

Most folks here on the site turn up their nose at the movie Shenandoah, but the most horrifying scene in the movie (to me, at least) -- the thug ascending the stairs to rape and murder the young mother -- depicts something that happens in every war.

I don't know enough to say whether Quantrill was as bad as the people I just described, but I think we can say that he and/or some of his men were closer to that Shenandoah thug on the spectrum than they were to Robert E. Lee.

Agreed. His knowledge and willingness to share it is a boon for this board.

 

[Buckeye Bill]

Agreed. His knowledge and willingness to share it is a boon for this board.

I had the privilege to meet Pat in person last October. He resides in the same town as my little sister. He is a very kind soul....

 

[hanna260]

I had the privilege to meet Pat in person last October. He resides in the same town as my little sister. He is a very kind soul....

That is so neat. I'll bet as he's always been exceptionally kind to me, too. Nice to know you two got to meet each other.

 

[Awanita]

Thanks so much for your work! That's a lot of very good stuff. I'd read that Anderson had gotten Quantrill arrested for the murder of one of his (Anderson's) men and that led to their final and permanent parting of the ways. I don't remember the circumstances of the problem, or even if anyone was killed, but I did find Quantrill was briefly arrested for something by McCullough. (sp?) Perhaps it was harking back to some of those charges you mention?

Quantrill was well educated and followed in his father's footsteps, becoming a schoolteacher at the age of sixteen. In 1854, his abusive father died of TB, leaving the family with a huge financial debt. Quantrill's mother had to turn her home into a boarding house in order to survive. Quantrill helped support the family by working as a schoolteacher but left home a year later and headed to Mendota, Il. Here, Quantrill took up a job in the lumberyards, unloading timber from rail cars. One night while working the late shift, he shot a man to death. Authorities briefly arrested Quantrill, who claimed self-defense. Since there were no eyewitnesses and the victim was a stranger who knew no one in town, William was set free. But police strongly urged him to leave Mendota. Quantrill continued his career as a teacher, moving to Ft.Wayne In. in February 1856. And although the district was impressed with Quantrill's teaching abilities, the wages remained meager. Quantrill journeyed back home to Canal Dover that fall, with no more money in his pockets than when he had left.
Quantrill spent the winter in his family's dumpy shack in the impoverished town, growing restless. It was around this time that many Ohioans began to migrate to Ks. Territory in search of cheap land and opportunity. This included Henry Torrey and Harmon Beeson, two local men hoping to build a large farm for their families out west. Although they didn't trust the 19-year old William, Bill's mother's pleadings persuaded them to let her son accompany them to Kansas in an effort to get him to turn his life around. The party of three departed in late February 1857. Torrey and Beeson agreed to pay for Quantrill's land in exchange for a couple of months' worth of work. They settled at Marais des Cygnes, but things did not go as well as planned. After about two months, Quantrill began to slack off when it came to working the land, and he spent most days wandering aimlessly about the wilderness with a rifle. A dispute arose over the claim, and he went to court with Torrey and Beeson. The court awarded the men what was owed to them, but Quantrill only paid half of what the court had mandated. His relationship with Beeson was never the same, but he remained friends with Torrey.
Shortly afterwards, Quantrill accompanied a large group of hometown friends in their quest to start a settlement on Tuscarora Lake. But soon neighbors began to notice Bill stealing goods out of other people's cabins, so they banished him from the community in January 1858.
He signed on as a teamster with the U.S. Army expedition heading to Salt lake City Utah in the spring. Little is known of Quantrill's journey out west, except that he excelled at the game of poker. He racked up piles of winnings by playing the game against his comrades at FT. Bridger but flushed it all on one hand the next day, leaving him dead broke.
Quantrill then joined a group of Missouri ruffians and became somewhat of a drifter. The group helped protect Missouri farmers from the Jayhawkers for pay and slept wherever they could find lodging. Quantrill traveled back to Utah and then to Colorado, but returned in less than a year to Lawrence, KS, in 1859. It was at this time that his political views started to take shape, and his attitude towards the slavery issue began to form.
Before 1860, Quantrill's political view appeared to support the anti-slavery side. He wrote to his good friend W.W. Scott in January 1858 that the Lecompton Constitution was a "swindle" and that James H. Lane, a Northern sympathizer, was "as good a man as we have here." He also called the Democrats "the worst men we have for they are all rascals, for no one can be a democrat here without being one."
One year later, in 1859, he was back in Lawrence, Kansas where he taught school until it closed in 1860. He then took up with brigands and turned to cattle rustling and anything else that could earn him a dollar. He also learned the profitability of capturing runaway slaves and devised treacherous plans to use free black men as bait for runaway slaves, whom he captured and returned to their masters in exchange for reward money.
His new lifestyle may have been the reason for his change of political views. In February 1860, Quantrill wrote a letter to his mother expressing his views on the anti-slavery supporters. He told her the pro-slavery movement was right and that he now detested Jim Lane. He said that the hanging of John Brown had been too good for him and that, "the devil has got unlimited sway over this territory, and will hold it until we have a better set of man and society generally."

During the war, Quantrill met thirteen-year-old Sarah Katherine King at her parents' farm in Blue Springs Mo. They married and she lived in camp with Quantrill and his men. At the time of his death, she was seventeen.

That is a few things I found floating out on the internet.

 

[rhettbutler1865]

Bloody murderer. But he wasn't the only one. Neither side was what you would call...gentle during the war.

My sentiments, exactly...

 

[Northern Light]

Patrick, you are one of the most knowledgeable people about Missouri here at CWT, and you are a great resource to us all. I appreciate your continually taking the time to write thoughtful, substantial posts to share the knowledge you've gained over the years.

I would agree that Quantrill was not purely evil, if for no other reason than that I doubt any human being can be purely evil.

As I was reading your post, I couldn't help thinking of Hezbollah, in Lebanon. They keep local people's loyalty partly if not mostly through intimidation, but they also gain allies through services they provide the local population such as clinics and schools.

I also am reminded once again that one of the worst things about war is that, besides the organized violence, it sets loose the worst elements in society. A certain percentage of the population, including in peacetime, is sociopaths and psychopaths. Societies in good condition can limit the scope of the damage these sick individuals can do. But when society's stabilizing structures are destroyed by war, these elements are set loose.

One of Owen Parry's Civil War mysteries (the third book in his series of six), Call Each River Jordan, offers a tremendously disturbing picture of what psychos and sickos can do when the chaos of war removes all the usual inhibitions.

Most folks here on the site turn up their nose at the movie Shenandoah, but the most horrifying scene in the movie (to me, at least) -- the thug ascending the stairs to rape and murder the young mother -- depicts something that happens in every war.

I don't know enough to say whether Quantrill was as bad as the people I just described, but I think we can say that, on a moral spectrum, he and/or some of his men were closer to that Shenandoah thug than they were to Robert E. Lee.

That scene in Shenandoah, really is haunting. The first time I saw the movie, I knew little about such people, and it was bad enough, but now knowing much more about them, it makes the scene so much more horrible. As you say, the breaking down of normal society surely lets the "baddies and crazies" come to life!

 

[ole]

Quantrill et. al. give meaning to "Let loose the dogs of war."

 

[Tumbleweed]

Quantrill et. al. give meaning to "Let loose the dogs of war."

Expired Image Removed

When I read about the terror that Quantrill and his men instilled in the civilian population, this depiction probably wouldn't have been too far off in their minds.

 

[Boonslick]

Regarding the Anderson death photos, I believe they were sort of a visual record, but also to display his body as a sort of trophy. A guerrilla named Stuart was killed in south Howard County roughly the same time, his corpse was brought to Boonville and similarly photographed. They didn't even wipe the blood off Stuart's face (not that I am outraged by that, or anything of the kind). My point is simply that the captors/killers saw no particular reason to respect the body of a hated person. Most people were glad to be rid of these two guys by the time they died.

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The bloody postmortem image of Captain William Stewart was taken on November 18, 1864, by the Boonville, Mo. photographer, O.D Edwards. Edwards interviewed some 30 years later stated that he could vividly remember Stewart being horse-dragged to his studio for the photograph. Following the "shoot", he said that the dead guerilla was dragged in a rough manner down his stairs and the sound of 'ol Bill's head bonking down each step resounded in his head the rest of his life. Stewart was again horse dragged through town and out to the old City Cemetery (Sunset Hills) where he was buried in an unmarked grave. Edwards commercially produced and sold a number of the images as a souvenir .

Attachment 1 is a copy of the original cdv, given to me by a descendent of the lady who owned the "hotel" where Stewart met his demise.

Attachment 2 is an original cdv portrait of O. D. Edwards

 

[Buckeye Bill]

Today is the anniversary of the Lawrence, Kansas Massacre.

http://www.civilwaronthewesternborder.org/content/quantrill’s-raid-lawrence

 

[Patrick H]

Today is the anniversary of the Lawrence, Kansas Massacre.

http://www.civilwaronthewesternborder.org/content/quantrill's-raid-lawrence

Thank you, Bill. That's a pretty good article on the raid. The only part of it that I'm not sure about is the discussion of Order Number 11 near the end. The author says that Gen. Ewing accurately thought this would make it harder for the guerrillas to obtain supplies from friends and relatives in the affected counties. There's no doubt that the counties were most de-populated, but I don't think the guerrillas had much difficulty finding supplies in the area. I'm sure fresh horses would have been a problem. However, I've read a number of assertions that a lot of livestock was simply run off, and remained in the woods and fields. They were known to have cached other supplies like powder and bullets. On the other hand, the guerrillas became more active in central Missouri after Lawrence, so maybe supplies factored in.

One of the most interesting accounts of Order Number 11 comes from (of all people) John Newman Edwards. He condemned Lane for the order, but more or less defended Ewing on the grounds that Ewing was a good officer obeying Lane's orders. I would have expected Edwards to say nearly anything but that!

I still have a hunch (which I can never prove) that the brutality of the raid was mostly due to Anderson, Todd and their men. I think that Quantrill conceived it mostly as a strike on Redlegs, Jayhawkers, Lane, a few people with whom he had grudges and whatever troops and militia might have been stationed there. He planned it well and achieved surprise. The raid became senselessly murderous in a hurry. I'm not convinced Quantrill himself planned to kill so many civilians, but he was in overall command so he ultimately gets to bear the responsibility. I think it correlates remarkably with the infamous raid on the village of My Lai 4 in Vietnam--in which the raiders went in to strike against Viet Cong. Many of them very quickly got out of control and started shooting and burning anything and anyone who moved.

 

[Buckeye Bill]

I'm not convinced Quantrill himself planned to kill so many civilians, but he was in overall command so he ultimately gets to bear the responsibility.

Just like Nathan Bedford Forrest at Fort Pillow.

 

[Buckeye Bill]

The Lawrence Massacre (Captain William Quantrill's Raid) occurred on this day in 1863. This raid was a Confederate guerrilla attack during the American Civil War by Quantrill's Raiders on the Federal town of Lawrence, Kansas. The attack targeted Lawrence due to the town's long support of abolition and its reputation as a center for Jayhawkers and Redlegs, which were free-state militia and vigilante groups known for attacking and destroying farms and plantations in Missouri's pro-slavery western counties.

* History Channel

 

[LtRusell]

Why?

Native American "collection" leads back to the French and Indian War. The more scalps brought back the better bounty they made. It was much like the Samurai collecting heads... or the CIA's Tony Po's men in Loas collecting noses and ears. During the Vietnam war, and this can be verified by a simple google search, one can find troops on both sides with heads, necklaces made of ears, ETC.

I think Quantrill gets the rap that he does because he fought guerrilla, hit and run tactics. He would be considered the ISIS today by the US, or if on our side possibly a highly decorated Ranger. One thing people fail to see is that total war was not invented by just Sherman. Total war was rampant through out all the theaters of the war.

If one were to consider Sherman's bombardment of Atlanta, and very real possibility that he could and would be the first man held accountable in a international war crimes tribunal it pales to Quantrill.

IMO? He was a man with some sense of justice. Anderson and Clement did not. So they say. I have poured over information about that era and era following and it's tough separate yourself from your time frame.

War isn't always honorable or the causes noble unless you win. Until we can admit as humans that "black hats" need to be worn at times then this conversation will continue ad nauseam for the rest of us to pick over.

 

[diane]

Native American "collection" leads back to the French and Indian War. The more scalps brought back the better bounty they made. It was much like the Samurai collecting heads... or the CIA's Tony Po's men in Loas collecting noses and ears. During the Vietnam war, and this can be verified by a simple google search, one can find troops on both sides with heads, necklaces made of ears, ETC.

I think Quantrill gets the rap that he does because he fought guerrilla, hit and run tactics. He would be considered the ISIS today by the US, or if on our side possibly a highly decorated Ranger. One thing people fail to see is that total war was not invented by just Sherman. Total war was rampant through out all the theaters of the war.

If one were to consider Sherman's bombardment of Atlanta, and very real possibility that he could and would be the first man held accountable in a international war crimes tribunal it pales to Quantrill.

IMO? He was a man with some sense of justice. Anderson and Clement did not. So they say. I have poured over information about that era and era following and it's tough separate yourself from your time frame.

War isn't always honorable or the causes noble unless you win. Until we can admit as humans that "black hats" need to be worn at times then this conversation will continue ad nauseam for the rest of us to pick over.

I had to look back to see what you were quoting - I wasn't asking because I didn't know. There's my some odd great uncle's bow finger necklace. There's a difference in collecting such things for bounty and doing the same for cultural or religious reasons - it all adds up to gruesome whatever the reason.

No I still haven't made up my mind about Quantrill. I think he had a screw that worked loose as the war went on but it wouldn't have if life had gone on normally. That's the ugly nature of war - it derails and diverts an otherwise good life. Kind of think the same about Anderson, but with him it was already loose - if the war hadn't triggered him the odds are good something else would have.

It's interesting to compare the 'howling' done about Sherman's march when all of the Trans-Mississippi was sitting on the back burner boiling over and bubbling all over the place.

 

[Patrick H]

There's something else about Quantrill that seems inconsistent with the usual image portrayed of him: On his deathbed, he converted to Roman Catholicism. He was attended by a priest and would have received at least four of the sacraments before his death. Of course, we have no way of knowing his sincerity in this conversion. Nevertheless, we have no real reason to doubt his sincerity. This all seems to me to be the action of a person with a moral conscience, with a strong sense of right and wrong, and with a strong urge to atone for his past transgressions. As I've said, there was a duality about the man.

 

[1NCCAV]

I vote murderer and opportunist but he wasn't the only one. And the Union had them too. It's somewhat odd that we refer to The War Between the States as The American Civil War. Sometimes not much was civil about the "Late Unpleasantness." Ain't no fight nastier than a brother fight.

Something else that's somewhat odd and hard for some people to reconcile: sometimes murderers are not cowards; they can be quite brave, even if it's in a desperate kind of way. This is well documented and also portrayed in some scenes of Ride With The Devil.

The clips below show, what is referred to in military circles, as a "Breakout From Encirclement." Starts at a bout 6:00 in the first clip and continues into the second clip:

Stuff like that really happened. Northfield, Minnesota is another example. The Jameses and Youngers might have been scoundrels but they were not cowards fighting their way out of that town.

But back to Quantrill. Was he commissioned a captain or self appointed?

 

[Patrick H]

I vote murderer and opportunist but he wasn't the only one. And the Union had them too. It's somewhat odd that we refer to The War Between the States as The American Civil War. Sometimes not much was civil about the "Late Unpleasantness." Ain't no fight nastier than a brother fight.

Something else that's somewhat odd and hard for some people to reconcile: sometimes murderers are not cowards; they can be quite brave, even if it's in a desperate kind of way. This is well documented and also portrayed in some scenes of Ride With The Devil.

The clips below show, what is referred to in military circles, as a "Breakout From Encirclement." Starts at a bout 6:00 in the first clip and continues into the second clip:

Stuff like that really happened. Northfield, Minnesota is another example. The Jameses and Youngers might have been scoundrels but they were not cowards fighting their way out of that town.

But back to Quantrill. Was he commissioned a captain or self appointed?

There is disagreement about that very question. He did go to Richmond to seek an official commission. When he returned, he claimed he was a colonel. There is even a portrait of him (retouched clumsily by hand) showing him in a colonel's coat. You'll run into people who argue this point both ways, and I don't know the answer. If he was truly commissioned, there ought to be a record of it somewhere.

 

[LtRusell]

I had to look back to see what you were quoting - I wasn't asking because I didn't know. There's my some odd great uncle's bow finger necklace. There's a difference in collecting such things for bounty and doing the same for cultural or religious reasons - it all adds up to gruesome whatever the reason.

No I still haven't made up my mind about Quantrill. I think he had a screw that worked loose as the war went on but it wouldn't have if life had gone on normally. That's the ugly nature of war - it derails and diverts an otherwise good life. Kind of think the same about Anderson, but with him it was already loose - if the war hadn't triggered him the odds are good something else would have.

It's interesting to compare the 'howling' done about Sherman's march when all of the Trans-Mississippi was sitting on the back burner boiling over and bubbling all over the place.

If not for money, or cultural/religious reason, then maybe it just plain fear. Sometimes the "Fear of God" tactic works. I hate to keep using him as an example, but Sherman was using POWs to look for torpedoes (IEDs) in the roads his troops walked on. He was shooting POWs for men he lost to the torpedoes as well. Showing a perfect example that both sides had moved to war of attrition and terror.

But ya know, Lincoln gave them a wide berth. The war for union had to be won. At all costs. So great nationalist, lousy on the whole Constitution thing.

Also, Anderson was already unstrung and his sister's death and the mangling of the others lead him to tears on the way into combat. He might have been crazy, but either way was sending a message. Which why they hunted him down as they did. If the north had found out just how it was out there, they would have sued for peace.

There was obviously official sanction as the CS Army used Quantrill and Anderson's men as scouts and skirmishers during combat operations. They did exactly told and performed perfectly.

We look at a bridal full of scalps as bad, evil. CIA does it in the 50s/60s, it's mildly distasteful depending on your political view. In WW2, we killed Japanese soldiers wholesale on every island we hopped to. Just as the Japanese killed our troops on Bataan. They killed those with red hair, saving scalps and heads, and killed people tattoos as they might have belonged to "secret societies". They also culled those pieces of flesh.

War is terrible thing. Everyone who went out, or goes out to fight will get a little more blood on their hands than they like. And yes, some to this day still like.

(end rant)

(but I'm racking up those trophies!)

 

[archieclement]

Dutchy summed it up in the clip "wherever we find true Missouri men we form our own army"

I think the definition of true Missouri men changed as it went on, If you was a Unionist in May 61 you were a true Missouri man

However after seeing our legally assembled MVM attacked, after watching germans that had been illegally armed fire into a crowd killing women and children, after being denied an elected government or the basic rights and protection of a US citizen, after watching communities like Osceola, West Point, Dayton, Rose Hill, Chapel Hill and huge parts of entire counties burned.......If you was true Missouri man I'd imagine your enthusiasm for the union had waned like dutchy's

though I always liked this scene of some of Q's men portrayed