McClellan Was George McClellan Well Liked/Loved

[dlavin]

You hear it all the time, or read about it all the time. Soldiers really liked Lil' Mac. Even after his removal after the 7 days battles, and back again after Second Manassas it is said that the troops really liked him.

What was it about him that they liked? That he could maintain order? And group an army together? Because when it came to battlefield tactics, he sure had his share of issues there. I would have thought that after the 7 Days, troops would have seen through him, yet they are said to have cheered loudly when he was returned to command after 2nd Manassas. Did soldiers recognize that it had to be slim pickin's if he was the best they had?

Reminds me of the saying "fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice..." Maybe I put too little stock in the ability to craft an army for war, and more on what happens on the battlefield?

 

[brass napoleon]

He was very good at organizing and at developing esprit de corps, which garnered a sense of pride among the men. He was also very careful not to throw their lives away recklessly (too careful, most would say). The soldiers knew that and appreciated it. Contrasting these characteristics with the other leaders of the AoP during this time of the war played well to Little Mac's advantage.

 

[Yankeedave]

For all his weirdness Mac was loved. There was something we miss that the men responded to.
Does the lost cause promote the skewing of this man's reputation. Lee said Mac was always a worry. This is beyond Grant.
In desperate times the army will respond positively to rumors that Mac is in command.
He was a peace democrat leading an army in hard republican times. He will get burned heading out the door.

 

[67th Tigers]

Whilst you can always find quotes from the minority that didn't like him, yes, he was loved by his men. Although he was a solid War Democrat and proposed compensated emancipation he ends up being dogged as a Peace Democrat who eskewed emancipation.

McClellan was probably one of the best field commanders the US produced. This was essentially widely understood by the majority of his troops. They blamed Lincoln for the failure of the attempt to seize Richmond, and they hated Lincoln for taking McClellan away during his successful operations in the Loudon Valley and giving them Burnside.

A contemporary song from late 1862:

 

[Yankeedave]

He was his own worst friend. Some sort of paranoia that manafested itself in a messiah complex. Other than that he his competant. Nothing brilliant but can motovate men which has a value beyond political measure.

 

[Bruce Vail]

For all his weirdness Mac was loved. There was something we miss that the men responded to.
Does the lost cause promote the skewing of this man's reputation. Lee said Mac was always a worry. This is beyond Grant.
In desperate times the army will respond positively to rumors that Mac is in command.
He was a peace democrat leading an army in hard republican times. He will get burned heading out the door.

I think you are misunderstanding the meaning of 'Peace Democrat." McClellan wasn't a Peace Democrat, he was a War Democrat. He supported a war to restore the union. He did not support abolition, or Lincoln.

 

[Bruce Vail]

You hear it all the time, or read about it all the time. Soldiers really liked Lil' Mac. Even after his removal after the 7 days battles, and back again after Second Manassas it is said that the troops really liked him.

What was it about him that they liked? That he could maintain order? And group an army together? Because when it came to battlefield tactics, he sure had his share of issues there. I would have thought that after the 7 Days, troops would have seen through him, yet they are said to have cheered loudly when he was returned to command after 2nd Manassas. Did soldiers recognize that it had to be slim pickin's if he was the best they had?

Reminds me of the saying "fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice..." Maybe I put too little stock in the ability to craft an army for war, and more on what happens on the battlefield?

Soldiers rarely love the hard-driving aggressive generals who produce a lot of casualties. They tend to love the generals that look out for the welfare of the rank and file with food, supplies, rest, etc. They especially appreciate the generals who are careful with the lives of the men.

I had a friend years ago who was a veteran of the war in Europe 1944-45. He said the soldiers despised Patton and loved Bradley and Clark. Bradley and Clark seemed to care whether the grunts lived or died.

 

[Yankeedave]

I think you are misunderstanding the meaning of 'Peace Democrat." McClellan wasn't a Peace Democrat, he was a War Democrat. He supported a war to restore the union. He did not support abolition, or Lincoln.

I guess i was being generic. My point was he fought to bring peace with the south. This put him at odds with the admin over him. I think once Lincoln saw Mac's cards, Mac's plight was sealed. Even at the expense of the Peninsula Campaign.
And my dad's brother fought under Patton, lost an arm and hated the guy.

 

[Carronade]

McClellan was known and liked for his role in organizing and training the army, and he had commanded it in its greatest successes prior to July 1863. He had led them to the gates of Richmond, and the troops don't seem to have blamed him for the failure of that campaign. He had won at Antietam, an imperfect victory but the highlight of the AofP's first couple of years. Under other commanders they had had Bull Run, Second Manassas, Fredericksburg, the Mud March, and Chancellorsville. Is it that surprising that their view of Little Mac was different from history's?

 

[Yankeedave]

And there is the beleif that Mac was relieved and reinstated. He commanded the AoP from it's inception to the fall of '62. He was relieved as every armies commander.
Second Bull Run was Pope leading the Valley and Northern Va troops with support from troops sent by Mac to D.C.
Mac isn't reinstated prior to Antietam, he is reunited with his army, and the ambiguity of the Lincoln admin for who is in charge really only extend to some troops of Pope's army. Mac has the freedom to send his 3rd Corps and the valley's old troops in the form of the 11th Corp's to rebuild in D. C.'s environs. And he is given the stone around his neck of burnside.

 

[dlavin]

Interesting reading thus far. To most folks who casually know about the civil war, if they were asked to sum up their thoughts of McClellan in under 5 words, I think you would hear words like "slow, cautious, scared, playing not to lose, etc..." But when digging deeper you may hear, "organizing, well-liked, etc..."

 

[amweiner]

I think there's always a danger of trying to categorize any person - not just Mac - as one thing that's a dichotomy from one other thing: competent/incompetent, organized/hot-cup-of-mess, etc.

As we know when dealing with modern folk, people are rarely that simple. Mac, like pretty much anyone else, had strengths and weaknesses. It's when we take the time to appreciate all of his sides that we can appreciate who he was more fully, and what he brought to the table. Whether you're a Mac fan or not, I think it's safe to say he left a deep impression on the War and those that fought it.

Just a thought,
Adam

 

[captaindrew]

I think Mac gets a bad rap. Maybe not the best in battle but he built the AoP into the machine it was and should be given a lot more credit for it's later success.

 

[dlofting]

Soldiers rarely love the hard-driving aggressive generals who produce a lot of casualties. They tend to love the generals that look out for the welfare of the rank and file with food, supplies, rest, etc. They especially appreciate the generals who are careful with the lives of the men.

I had a friend years ago who was a veteran of the war in Europe 1944-45. He said the soldiers despised Patton and loved Bradley and Clark. Bradley and Clark seemed to care whether the grunts lived or died.

....and yet this was exactly what Lee was, an aggressive general who produced a lot of casualties. His men loved him and would try to do anything for him.

 

[shermans_march]

I think Mac gets a bad rap. Maybe not the best in battle but he built the AoP into the machine it was and should be given a lot more credit for it's later success.

Getting the Army of the Potomac into a drilled fighting force is the one good thing he did. Most historians give him credit for that. Everything else is what people have issues with.

 

[wausaubob]

George McClellan's mainly bloodless campaign in West Virginia was brilliant. He accomplished a good deal without expending resources.
He took all the initial steps in organizing a professional army.
His attempt to get south of the James River was correct. He did not have the ability to convince Stanton and Lincoln that it was the right move. Therein lies a significant problem. He was moved to the top very fast and did not fully earn his promotion. They did not trust him.
He had Ambrose Burnside working for him at Antietam. Burnside was never better than adequate.
George McClellan was a pro slavery Democrat. After the initial Emancipation Proclamation it was going to be very difficult for Lincoln to work with McClellan or his friend Don Carlos Buell. Both were relieved.

 

[OldBrainsHalleck]

What were McClellan's best qualities?

 

[67th Tigers]

George McClellan was a pro slavery Democrat. After the initial Emancipation Proclamation it was going to be very difficult for Lincoln to work with McClellan or his friend Don Carlos Buell. Both were relieved.

McClellan was a born again Christian (and a fatalistic Calvinist) who personally abhorred slavery. He wanted that issue disentangled from southern independence as he believed a declaration of radical intent would solidify support for the Confederacy. He personally was delighted that whereever the armies went slavery collapsed and went as far as proposed compensated emancipation in the border states. When the army faced a revolt in September-October 1862 over the Emancipation Proclamation it was McClellan who quashed the pro-slavery advocates in the upper officer corps and reminded the army of their place under the President.

 

[67th Tigers]

What were McClellan's best qualities?

Extremely good strategist and one of the best operational commanders of the war. The downside was that he was a pure soldier and didn't have much political sense. He'd ride roughshod over the political classes to pursue military aims, and made a lot of enemies.

 

[wausaubob]

No political sense? Uhhh, he ran for President on a major party ticket in the middle of a Civil War.
So he was either a political idiot, or he disagreed with President Lincoln about nearly everything and was willing to give slavery back to the secessionists in order to have peace.
And I think he did that without resigning his commission.