1. Welcome to the CivilWarTalk, a forum for questions and discussions about the American Civil War! Become a member today for full access to all of our resources, it's fast, simple, and absolutely free!
Dismiss Notice
Join and Become a Patron at CivilWarTalk!
Support this site with a monthly or yearly subscription! Active Patrons get to browse the site Ad free!
START BY JOINING NOW!

Lorenz ramrod?

Discussion in 'Civil War Weapons and Ammunition' started by FiremarshalBill, Feb 19, 2017.

  1. FiremarshalBill

    FiremarshalBill Private

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2016
    Messages:
    106
    Can anyone post a link or a picture of the correct ramrod that would have been issued with the Model 1854 Austrian Lorenz rifle-musket? Particularly the cupped end that would have been inserted into the bore to ram a round down the barrel. Also, what is the correct length of this ramrod and were .54 and .58 caliber Lorenz ramrods the same? I don't think mine is correct and would like to find an original. Thanks.
     

  2. (Membership has it privileges! To remove this ad: Register NOW!)
  3. johan_steele

    johan_steele Colonel Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    Messages:
    13,728
    Location:
    South of the North 40
    They are the same ramrod for either .54 or .58 but were replaced as needed. I've seen both Springfield & Enfield ramrods as replacements. As to length... I believe Lodgewood had an original Lorenz ramrod in their online selection.
     
  4. Don Dixon

    Don Dixon Private

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2008
    Messages:
    233
    Location:
    Fairfax, VA, USA
    The ramrod for the Muster 1854 System Lorenz rifle is 37 inches long. The head of the ramrod has a brass sleeve around it to reduce bore wear. The head is cupped for a conical bullet with a threaded hole drilled in the base of the cup. There is another unthreaded hole drilled crosswise through the head below the brass sleeve for the pulling pin of the soldier's combination tool. As stated, weapons bored out to .58 caliber used the same ramrod as the Austro-Hungarian Army standard .547 rifles.

    Regards,
    Don Dixon

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2017
  5. FiremarshalBill

    FiremarshalBill Private

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2016
    Messages:
    106
    Looking for a well used one for my "wall hanger" Lorenz.
     
    originalrebelyell likes this.
  6. Jobe Holiday

    Jobe Holiday First Sergeant

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2010
    Messages:
    1,561
    Location:
    The Perpetually Frozen North
    Mr. Dixon - I give up, what is the threaded hole in the ram rod cup to be used for?
    J.
     
  7. johan_steele

    johan_steele Colonel Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    Messages:
    13,728
    Location:
    South of the North 40
    The Lorenz rod was as much a cleaning rod as a ram rod. The various threaded holes and such allowed various attachments to be used. Good lord that makes no sense... time for sleep and alcohol I think.
     
    James N., Package4 and Jobe Holiday like this.
  8. originalrebelyell

    originalrebelyell Corporal

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2015
    Messages:
    412
    Lest see some photos of your wall hanger Lorenz.
     
  9. Camp Randall Armory

    Camp Randall Armory Private

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2014
    Messages:
    119
    Location:
    Minnesota
    The Austrian worm had a male end that would work for it
     
  10. FiremarshalBill

    FiremarshalBill Private

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2016
    Messages:
    106
    Not very good photos but here it is... IMG_0942.jpg IMG_0943.jpg
     
  11. Story

    Story First Sergeant

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2011
    Messages:
    1,083
    Location:
    SE PA
    Looks to be in better shape than a "wall hanger"
     
  12. Jobe Holiday

    Jobe Holiday First Sergeant

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2010
    Messages:
    1,561
    Location:
    The Perpetually Frozen North
    Camp Randall - I don't think so, because the threaded hole in the head of the ram rod is much smaller in diameter, and with much finer threads, than the cleaning tools provided in the oil cloth packet with the Lorenz.
    J.
     
    Camp Randall Armory likes this.
  13. originalrebelyell

    originalrebelyell Corporal

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2015
    Messages:
    412
    Great looking rifle, looks great it looks well used. very nice sword also.
     
  14. johan_steele

    johan_steele Colonel Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    Messages:
    13,728
    Location:
    South of the North 40
    There is a purpose for that threaded hole & it has something to do with the musket tool specifically but I'll be cussed if I can remember or find my notes on the subject. Part of the problem is there were at least five different musket tools for the Lorenz and they weren't the same. I've seen several ramrods sans that particular threaded hole and wonder why some had it and others didn't.

    Lorenz Musket Tools.JPG
     
    Jobe Holiday likes this.
  15. Don Dixon

    Don Dixon Private

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2008
    Messages:
    233
    Location:
    Fairfax, VA, USA
    The left most of Mr. Steele's tools is the standard Austro-Hungarian Army combination tool for the Muster 1854 System Lorenz Type I and II rifles. The pointed arm of the tool is the pulling pin that goes into the unthreaded hole in the head of the ramrod.

    The small end of the ramrod was threaded with large threads for the bullet puller, wiper, and worm.

    The fine threaded hole in the head of the ramrod was, I'm told, used for the brush. But, I've never seen one of the brushes used with the system. A natural fiber brush would be a pretty perishable part of the cleaning system.

    Regards,
    Don Dixon
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2017
  16. Jobe Holiday

    Jobe Holiday First Sergeant

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2010
    Messages:
    1,561
    Location:
    The Perpetually Frozen North
    Thank you, Mr. Dixon! Now I have something else to look for......
    J.
     
  17. FiremarshalBill

    FiremarshalBill Private

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2016
    Messages:
    106
    Any help locating a ramrod for my Lorenz?
     
  18. johan_steele

    johan_steele Colonel Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    Messages:
    13,728
    Location:
    South of the North 40
    I believe Lodgewood still has an original Lorenz ramrod in stock.
     
  19. FiremarshalBill

    FiremarshalBill Private

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2016
    Messages:
    106
    I've found Lodgewood does have reproduction ramrods for my Lorenz (thanks Johan) but I was wondering how would someone defarb a ramrod? Short of having it buried in the back yard for a few years, how can a ramrod be made to look as old as the original rifle?
     
  20. Jobe Holiday

    Jobe Holiday First Sergeant

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2010
    Messages:
    1,561
    Location:
    The Perpetually Frozen North
    I knew an individual years ago who would "age" reproduction ram rods by sticking them in the Privit Hedges around his house for a few months!
    J.
     
  21. johan_steele

    johan_steele Colonel Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    Messages:
    13,728
    Location:
    South of the North 40
    Gunderson Militaria has an original Lorenz ramrod.
     

(Membership has it privileges! To remove this ad: Register NOW!)

Share This Page


(Membership has it privileges! To remove this ad: Register NOW!)