Lookup needed

[John Winn]

I'd be most obliged if somebody could see if a military record could be found for:

Iltlid William Thomas
b. 1838 in Wales
d. 1917 in Jackson County, OR

reported to have served in the Confederate service in Georgia (as per his obituary). I can't find him using the Park Service database although there are a number of Williams and a few with just I.

He's buried in the historic cemetery where I volunteer and, as far as we know, is the only Confederate veteran we've got. We like to know about such folk so it would be appreciated by a number of people. And yes, that really is his first name.

Thanks for your time.

 

[lelliott19]

Having a hard time with this one.... Since "Iltlid" was probably really hard to pronounce, could be anything that sounds remotely similar. Im guessing they gave him a shortened version or nick name? Any idea where in Georgia he was living at the time?

Ok. I found him in the 1870 US Census. His Find A Grave Memorial links to a son - Josiah Anderson Thomas b. 1869 in TN to Iltlid and Catherine Keith Thomas - so I checked the TN Census for a "Thomas" born in Wales and there he was in Household #71 Family #80 Hamilton County, Chattanooga Ward 1. Listed as "Illeid W Thomas" age 30 born in @1839 in Wales with wife "Kate K. Thomas" age 25 born in @1844 in Tennessee and son, "Jasiah A Thomas" age 1 born in @1868 in TN. http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/695326755/Illeid-W-Thomas

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DTX3-TZR?i=9&cc=1438024
So next door, in household #72 you see "Arthur Thomas" age 24? And the elder "William A Thomas" age 80? Interestingly there is a record in 1860 in Georgia for that William A Thomas along with children - none named Iltlid but let me pull it up for you. Hang on let me see if I can find it again.

EDIT TO ADD: Ok, so in the 1860 US Census, Wm A Thomas is listed in Chattanooga District, Walker County, Georgia. Listed as William A Thomas age 70 b. @1790 in South Wales. Also in the household, we have D D Thomas, age 24 Male born @1836 in South Wales; Caroline Thomas, Female age 24 b. @1836 in GA; Archy D Thomas, male age 17 b. @1843 in South Wales; and "Arther" Thomas, male age 15, b@1845 in South Wales. Unfortunately, there is no link to the original, but here's the link to indexed info. http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/747417270/Wm-A-Thomas

Still no Iltlid but were getting closer. And I bet he enlisted somewhere near Chattanooga.

EDIT AGAIN: Heres the 1900 US Census record in Oregon http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/471119686/Iltid-W-Thomas

 

[donna]

Great finds. I thought of looking on find a grave but was gone all day yesterday.

 

[bdtex]

@lelliott19 Great work. That's good stuff.

 

[Bruce Vail]

Having a hard time with this one.... Since "Iltlid" was probably really hard to pronounce, could be anything that sounds remotely similar. Im guessing they gave him a shortened version or nick name? Any idea where in Georgia he was living at the time?

Ok. I found him in the 1870 US Census. His Find A Grave Memorial links to a son - Josiah Anderson Thomas b. 1869 in TN to Iltlid and Catherine Keith Thomas - so I checked the TN Census for a "Thomas" born in Wales and there he was in Household #71 Family #80 Hamilton County, Chattanooga Ward 1. Listed as "Illeid W Thomas" age 30 born in @1839 in Wales with wife "Kate K. Thomas" age 25 born in @1844 in Tennessee and son, "Jasiah A Thomas" age 1 born in @1868 in TN. http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/695326755/Illeid-W-Thomas
View attachment 141630
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DTX3-TZR?i=9&cc=1438024
So next door, in household #72 you see "Arthur Thomas" age 24? And the elder "William A Thomas" age 80? Interestingly there is a record in 1860 in Georgia for that William A Thomas along with children - none named Iltlid but let me pull it up for you. Hang on let me see if I can find it again.

EDIT TO ADD: Ok, so in the 1860 US Census, Wm A Thomas is listed in Chattanooga District, Walker County, Georgia. Listed as William A Thomas age 70 b. @1790 in South Wales. Also in the household, we have D D Thomas, age 24 Male born @1836 in South Wales; Caroline Thomas, Female age 24 b. @1836 in GA; Archy D Thomas, male age 17 b. @1843 in South Wales; and "Arther" Thomas, male age 15, b@1845 in South Wales. Unfortunately, there is no link to the original, but here's the link to indexed info. http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/747417270/Wm-A-Thomas

Still no Iltlid but were getting closer. And I bet he enlisted somewhere near Chattanooga.

EDIT AGAIN: Heres the 1900 US Census record in Oregon http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/471119686/Iltid-W-Thomas

Jeez, this is impressive!

 

[57th Indiana Infantry]

1880 Jacksonville, Jackson, Oregon
I W Thomas......Self......M........41.....Wales
Kate Thomas.....Wife.....F.........36.....Tennessee
Joe A Thomas....Son......M........10.....Tennessee
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GYBF-28B?i=27&cc=1417683

 

[John Winn]

Having a hard time with this one.... Since "Iltlid" was probably really hard to pronounce, could be anything that sounds remotely similar. Im guessing they gave him a shortened version or nick name? Any idea where in Georgia he was living at the time?

Ok. I found him in the 1870 US Census. His Find A Grave Memorial links to a son - Josiah Anderson Thomas b. 1869 in TN to Iltlid and Catherine Keith Thomas - so I checked the TN Census for a "Thomas" born in Wales and there he was in Household #71 Family #80 Hamilton County, Chattanooga Ward 1. Listed as "Illeid W Thomas" age 30 born in @1839 in Wales with wife "Kate K. Thomas" age 25 born in @1844 in Tennessee and son, "Jasiah A Thomas" age 1 born in @1868 in TN. http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/695326755/Illeid-W-Thomas
View attachment 141630
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DTX3-TZR?i=9&cc=1438024
So next door, in household #72 you see "Arthur Thomas" age 24? And the elder "William A Thomas" age 80? Interestingly there is a record in 1860 in Georgia for that William A Thomas along with children - none named Iltlid but let me pull it up for you. Hang on let me see if I can find it again.

EDIT TO ADD: Ok, so in the 1860 US Census, Wm A Thomas is listed in Chattanooga District, Walker County, Georgia. Listed as William A Thomas age 70 b. @1790 in South Wales. Also in the household, we have D D Thomas, age 24 Male born @1836 in South Wales; Caroline Thomas, Female age 24 b. @1836 in GA; Archy D Thomas, male age 17 b. @1843 in South Wales; and "Arther" Thomas, male age 15, b@1845 in South Wales. Unfortunately, there is no link to the original, but here's the link to indexed info. http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/747417270/Wm-A-Thomas

Still no Iltlid but were getting closer. And I bet he enlisted somewhere near Chattanooga.

EDIT AGAIN: Heres the 1900 US Census record in Oregon http://us-census.mooseroots.com/l/471119686/Iltid-W-Thomas

Thank you so much lelliot !! That's great work. Do you think the two service records you show are the same guy ?

The president of my cemetery group says he's got the obituary (but will have to find it in his stuff) and will send me a copy. I'm hoping it'll maybe say something about him that'll provide a clue - maybe where in Georgia he lived. He only remembers that it says he was from Georgia and served in the Confederate army. If he can't find it I know where to get it but it'd cost me $10 so I'm going to wait a little.

 

[57th Indiana Infantry]

National Register of Historic Places
Inventory—Nomination Form

West Side Feed and Sale Stable (Medford, Oregon)

The stable building was probably built for I. (Illtid) W. Thomas. In April 1906 I.W.
Thomas purchased the 100' x 140' lot, on which the stable building now stands, from George
W. and E. J. Bashford (15). (During the Bashford's ownership from 1890 to 1906, the site
of the livery stable was occupied by two adjoining one-story wood-frame shed-like structures
(29).) Born in Wales in 1838, Illtid W. Thomas arrived in the Rogue River Valley in 1877,
after spending some time in Tennessee. During Thomas's early years in the valley, he
pursued farming, however, by 1906, at the time of Medford's explosive growth, Folk's city
directory lists his occupation as "capitalist."

At the time of Thomas's death in 1917, his estate included several acres of commercial, residential and agricultural property in and around Medford, with assets in real and personal property totaling several thousand dollars. At one time Thomas owned most, if not all, of the Perry subdivision, near the west city limits of Medford. A brick commercial building at the southeast corner of West Main and South Grape Streets, half a block from the West Side Feed and Sale Stable, was at one time known as the White and Thomas Block. Although apparently not a leader in public or civic affairs, I.W. Thomas estate records reveal that he financed the activities of some of the city's leading merchants and businessmen.

Continued growth in Medford has meant the demise
of a great number of residences once owned by Thomas, with the exception of his own
substantial two-story residence at 718 West Main Street. Illtid Thomas married twice. His
first wife, Catherine K., died in 1902. His second wife was Abbie K. Thomas, who survived
him by several years.

I.W. Thomas had one son, Joseph A. Thomas, who was involved in real estate and mining
throughout his life, and owned several mining and ranchina properties in the valley (6, 7,
12, 13, 15, 30 31, 32).

Together with his father Joseph A., Eugene Thomas owned and operated the Thomas Realty and
Insurance Company in the late 1920s (22), which later evolved into the Thomas Realty and
Loan Company (23). In 1930 Eugene Thomas established the Oregon Finance Company, which he
operated until his retirement in 1963 (8).

The West Side Feed and Sale Stable remained in the ownership of the Thomas family until
1927 (18) https://npgallery.nps.gov/GetAsset?assetID=92406de4-6710-4c18-a5f7-1a0207a43359

 

[John Winn]

National Register of Historic Places
Inventory—Nomination Form

West Side Feed and Sale Stable (Medford, Oregon)

The stable building was probably built for I. (Illtid) W. Thomas. In April 1906 I.W.
Thomas purchased the 100' x 140' lot, on which the stable building now stands, from George
W. and E. J. Bashford (15). (During the Bashford's ownership from 1890 to 1906, the site
of the livery stable was occupied by two adjoining one-story wood-frame shed-like structures
(29).) Born in Wales in 1838, Illtid W. Thomas arrived in the Rogue River Valley in 1877,
after spending some time in Tennessee. During Thomas's early years in the valley, he
pursued farming, however, by 1906, at the time of Medford's explosive growth, Folk's city
directory lists his occupation as "capitalist."

At the time of Thomas's death in 1917, his estate included several acres of commercial, residential and agricultural property in and around Medford, with assets in real and personal property totaling several thousand dollars. At one time Thomas owned most, if not all, of the Perry subdivision, near the west city limits of Medford. A brick commercial building at the southeast corner of West Main and South Grape Streets, half a block from the West Side Feed and Sale Stable, was at one time known as the White and Thomas Block. Although apparently not a leader in public or civic affairs, I.W. Thomas estate records reveal that he financed the activities of some of the city's leading merchants and businessmen.

Continued growth in Medford has meant the demise
of a great number of residences once owned by Thomas, with the exception of his own
substantial two-story residence at 718 West Main Street. Illtid Thomas married twice. His
first wife, Catherine K., died in 1902. His second wife was Abbie K. Thomas, who survived
him by several years.

I.W. Thomas had one son, Joseph A. Thomas, who was involved in real estate and mining
throughout his life, and owned several mining and ranchina properties in the valley (6, 7,
12, 13, 15, 30 31, 32). Together with his father Joseph A., Eugene Thomas owned and operated the Thomas Realty and Insurance Company in the late 1920s (22), which later evolved into the Thomas Realty and Loan Company (23). In 1930 Eugene Thomas established the Oregon Finance Company, which he operated until his retirement in 1963 (8).

The West Side Feed and Sale Stable remained in the ownership of the Thomas family until
1927 (18) https://npgallery.nps.gov/GetAsset?assetID=92406de4-6710-4c18-a5f7-1a0207a43359

Wow, that's a great find ! I've sent a copy of that to our cemetery group president for his files (he keeps lots of info about people buried in the cemetery which gets used for lots of things, among them our yearly "meet the pioneers" presentation where actors portray people and tell their stories). Thanks a bunch.

 

[lelliott19]

Do you think the two service records you show are the same guy ?

Not necessarily - just a couple of possibilities I wanted to keep up with. It will take some more research to determine which Companies were raised in the Georgia counties near Chattanooga. I tried looking for the brothers - DD, Archy, and Arthur - but didnt find anything definitive. Obviously, if we could find them serving we could look at all members of the regiments in which they served to see if any Thomases in that regiment are a possibility. I'll spend some more time on it when I can.

I hope the obituary will give some additional info. Let us know when you are able to obtain it. It would be good to know when he served - even just the years so we could rule out possibilities.

1880 Jacksonville, Jackson, Oregon
I W Thomas......Self......M........41.....Wales
Kate Thomas.....Wife.....F.........36.....Tennessee
Joe A Thomas....Son......M........10.....Tennessee
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GYBF-28B?i=27&cc=1417683

National Register of Historic Places
Inventory—Nomination Form

Whoa! Good stuff @57th Indiana Infantry !!! Great finds! And yet another alternative spelling - "Illtid"

 

[John Winn]

Not necessarily - just a couple of possibilities I wanted to keep up with. It will take some more research to determine which Companies were raised in the Georgia counties near Chattanooga. I tried looking for the brothers - DD, Archy, and Arthur - but didnt find anything definitive. Obviously, if we could find them serving we could look at all members of the regiments in which they served to see if any Thomases in that regiment are a possibility. I'll spend some more time on it when I can.

I hope the obituary will give some additional info. Let us know when you are able to obtain it. It would be good to know when he served - even just the years so we could rule out possibilities.



Whoa! Good stuff @57th Indiana Infantry !!! Great finds! And yet another alternative spelling - "Illtid"

Our director has mailed me a copy of the obituary; will report when I get it. Illtid is the correct spelling; I got it wrong (as have a number of other people). His stone is very difficult to read due to lichen. We'll be cleaning it soon.

Thanks so much for your help. I, and my cemetery buddies, do appreciate it. It would be great to know how our only known confederate veteran spent the war. As I've said, we try to accumulate histories of folks from the earlier days and use that information in a number of ways. People contact us about relatives and we share and we do guided tours where we tell about folks buried and also do a yearly production in the fall. I'm thinking Illtid might be a good candidate for the fall presentation.

Will have the obit in a day or two.

Edit: I'm going to diplomatically petition to have a first national flag placed on his grave instead to the US flag that's now placed on Memorial Day. We'll see; pretty PC around here but I'd bet there's not more than a handful of people in the county who'd know what a first national was so I'll argue that it's historically correct and nobody will be offended. Have to be very careful as our director is an autocrat and a big fish in a small pond sort (and a Yankee by birth). I'll play my card when the time seems right.

 

[MaryDee]

Please do keep us informed, @John Winn--this is fascinating!

 

[57th Indiana Infantry]

Forest Hills Cemetery, Chattanooga, TN

Arthur R. Thomas Plot: sec.6 lot 147 https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/...Scntry=4&GSob=n&GSsr=41&GRid=59178368&df=all&

Archer D. Thomas Plot: sec.6 lot 147 https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GSln=Thomas&GSiman=1&GScid=12061&GRid=59178039&

Archer D. Thomas - Barry's Battery
Tennessee
Capt Barry's Co, Light Artillery (Lookout Artillery)

Arthur R Thomas
Watts Cadets/ Ala.Inf.
N.B.Forrest #3

Not sure what to think about Arthur R Thomas service?

Arthur had two wife's, Martha died in 1899, remarried to Daisy.

Edit:

As noted above, we see three brothers of Illtid W. Thomas in 1860. I show two being buried in the same plot in Chattanooga - Archer and Arthur. I have track these two and David D. through the census, they are brothers to Illtid. Though they are irrelevant to Illitid's story in Oregon, I posted as family history nonetheless.

1860 Chattanooga District, Walker, Georgia
Wm A Thomas.............M......70.......S.Wales
D D Thomas.................M......24.......S.Wales
Caroline Thomas...........F......24.......Ga (David's wife)
Archy D Thomas...........M......17 .......S.Wales
Arthur Thomas............M......15.........S. Wales


David D Thomas stayed in Walker County, Georgia.

1870 Walker County, Georgia
George Willis...............M.......67.......North Carolina (Caroline's father)
David D Thomas..........M.......38.......Wales
Caroline Thomas..........F........38......Georgia
Randolph Thomas.......M.........9......Georgia
Lawrence Thomas.......M.........4......Georgia

1880 Dry Valley, Walker County, Georgia
David D Thomas...........Self.......M......45.......Wales
Caroline Thomas.........Wife.......F.......45.......Georgia
Randolph Thomas........Son.......M......19.......Georgia
Laurence Thomas.........Son.......M......13.......Georgia
David W Thomas..........Son.......M.......8........Georgia
George Thomas............Son.......M.......7........Georgia
Sarah Thomason..........Aunt.......F.......60.......Georgia

 

[John Winn]

Forest Hills Cemetery, Chattanooga, TN

Arthur R. Thomas Plot: sec.6 lot 147 https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/...Scntry=4&GSob=n&GSsr=41&GRid=59178368&df=all&

Archer D. Thomas Plot: sec.6 lot 147 https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GSln=Thomas&GSiman=1&GScid=12061&GRid=59178039&

Archer D. Thomas - Barry's Battery
Tennessee
Capt Barry's Co, Light Artillery (Lookout Artillery)

Arthur R Thomas
Watts Cadets/ Ala.Inf.
N.B.Forrest #3

Not sure what to think about Arthur R Thomas service?

Arthur had two wife's, Martha died in 1899, remarried to Daisy.

Good find ! The 1870 census noted above shows who is likely his brother as Arthur R. Thomas, not Archer D. so maybe we're getting warm. I just got the obituary and am posting it below.

 

[John Winn]

OK, so I just got the obituary and am not sure it helps too much. I'd have thought they'd have known the war didn't start in 1860. But if we are to believe the gist of it - and give them a break for a typo - then he served all four years. I think the Arthur R. Thomas thing might be our ticket.

So, calling @lelliott19 - what magic can you perform ?

 

[ErnieMac]

The service record came from Fold3, the photo from Ancestry. Ancestry has a number of entries I found using an Illtid Thomas 1838 birth.

 

[John Winn]

The service record came from Fold3, the photo from Ancestry. Ancestry has a number of entries I found using an Illtid Thomas 1838 birth.

View attachment 141901

View attachment 141902

Wow - that was fast ! Very good indeed !! I'll see if I can find any more about his service but if anybody has ways to find his record (i.e. when enlisted, when discharged) that would be great.

 

[lelliott19]

So he served in a TN regiment not a Georgia one. No wonder we couldn't locate him. Company G 26th Tennessee Infantry (aka 3 East TN Vols). Found a couple cards, but apparently most of his records are under "J W Thomas" as indicated on the index card.

That file is also attached. Enlisted July 8, 1861 at Knoxville, TN. for 12 months. Captured at Fort Donelson Feb 16, 1862; imprisoned at Camp Douglas Chicago, IL (roll dated Aug 1, 1862); sent to Vicksburg for exchange Sept 8, 1862

 

[John Winn]

So he served in a TN regiment not a Georgia one. No wonder we couldn't locate him. Company G 26th Tennessee Infantry (aka 3 East TN Vols). Found a couple cards, but apparently most of his records are under "J W Thomas" as indicated on the index card.

That file is also attached. Enlisted July 8, 1861 at Knoxville, TN. for 12 months. Captured at Fort Donelson Feb 16, 1862; imprisoned at Camp Douglas Chicago, IL (roll dated Aug 1, 1862); sent to Vicksburg for exchange Sept 8, 1862

Thank you so much ! That's just what I needed. Having the unit I thought I'd be able to find something about his service record but couldn't. Even the Park Service database returned nothing for him. I did find some histories of the outfit though.

Can you see when he finished his service ? Looks like he probably surrendered in NC.

As I think I mentioned our cemetery organization keeps files on the early folk buried in the cemetery and that comes in handy often. All you've provided will be added to our archives and he will be remembered. So far he's our first confirmed Confederate veteran. I'm going to gently petition to give him a first national flag next memorial day but this year he got a US flag like all the other veterans.

 

[John Winn]

And to all who jumped in to help me on this I do want to let you know how much I appreciate it. This is a great outfit.