Telegraph lines

[JohnG0609]

Asking for feedback from you guys, validation or correction, on telegraph routes:

1: No line from Vicksburg to Snyder's Bluff Complex HQ
2: Line from Vicksburg to Grand Gulf--cut on 4/29/63
3: Line from GG to Port Gibson--Bowen kept transmitting from GG to Pemberton in Jackson until 5/1 when Bowen moved to Port Gibson.
4. Line east from Port Gibson to Hazlehurst (?) and up the railroad to Jackson. But that line was cut by Grierson right? So did the line from PG to Jackson follow another route?
5. Pemberton moved to Vicksburg on night of 4/30 and came up on telegraph at Vicksburg morning of 5/1. Bowen transmitted from Port Gibson, meaning the message went from PG to Hazlehurst to Jackson to Vicksburg?

Thanks in advance!

John

 

[tony_gunter]

I've always assumed the messages going back to Vicksburg after the Port Gibson telegraph was cut were carried by courier.

Snyder's Bluff probably (?) didn't need telegraph since there's line of sight from bluff to bluff … but I've never looked for evidence of signal flags being used. There is what appears to be a signal station or gun emplacement above both Snyder's Bluff and the bluff above the road at Chickasaw Bayou. Then there's line of sight from there into the fortifications at Vicksburg.

 

[JohnG0609]

I've always assumed the messages going back to Vicksburg after the Port Gibson telegraph was cut were carried by courier.

Snyder's Bluff probably (?) didn't need telegraph since there's line of sight from bluff to bluff … but I've never looked for evidence of signal flags being used. There is what appears to be a signal station or gun emplacement above both Snyder's Bluff and the bluff above the road at Chickasaw Bayou. Then there's line of sight from there into the fortifications at Vicksburg.

Thanks Tony, I've not seen anything showing a telegraph line to Snyder's Bluff but wanted to validate that with you guys.

Im basing my assumption that there was a line connecting GG and PG. Both towns were thriving in 1860, there was a railroad from PG to GG, and the quality trestle over Bayou Pierre lead me to conclude that a telegraph line would also be present. But whether there was or he used couriers it's still a minor point but does play a role in Confederate operations 4/28-5/3 in Bowen's AOR.

 

[JohnG0609]

Thanks Tony, I've not seen anything showing a telegraph line to Snyder's Bluff but wanted to validate that with you guys.

Im basing my assumption that there was a line connecting GG and PG. Both towns were thriving in 1860, there was a railroad from PG to GG, and the quality trestle over Bayou Pierre lead me to conclude that a telegraph line would also be present. But whether there was or he used couriers it's still a minor point but does play a role in Confederate operations 4/28-5/3 in Bowen's AOR.

I hit post a little earlier. How do you think the line ran from PG to Jackson. I assume to the GNO RR at some depot. Can't be Hazlehurst because Grierson cut it. So would have to be north of Hazlehurst .... Gallman? Crystal Springs?

 

[tony_gunter]

I hit post a little earlier. How do you think the line ran from PG to Jackson. I assume to the GNO RR at some depot. Can't be Hazlehurst because Grierson cut it. So would have to be north of Hazlehurst .... Gallman? Crystal Springs?

Good question. I thought surely it couldn't be that hard to find a map of the telegraph lines in the state, but I can't find one. Maybe newspapers would have some record of lines being run?

 

[tony_gunter]

With regard to signal stations on top of Snyder's Bluff and Chickasaw Bayou, that's just personal observation from climbing up on top to see if anything was there. Definitely evidence of something having been on the peaks of both. Gun emplacements? Signal stations? If signal stations, Federal or Confederate? Probably all of the above.

There's definitely line of sight from Chickasaw Bayou to Snyder's Bluff, if I remember correctly there's line of sight from Chickasaw Bayou to Fort Hill in the VNMP.

 

[JohnG0609]

After some thought, and looking at a map, I'm less inclined to think

With regard to signal stations on top of Snyder's Bluff and Chickasaw Bayou, that's just personal observation from climbing up on top to see if anything was there. Definitely evidence of something having been on the peaks of both. Gun emplacements? Signal stations? If signal stations, Federal or Confederate? Probably all of the above.

There's definitely line of sight from Chickasaw Bayou to Snyder's Bluff, if I remember correctly there's line of sight from Chickasaw Bayou to Fort Hill in the VNMP.

Thanks Tony, I think you nailed that down for C2 from Snyder's Bluff.

After some thought and actually looking at a map, I'm less inclined to think a line ran due east from PG to the GNO RR. Telegraphs were commercial and I just can't see how investing in a line through that country, with no towns of any significance, would make business sense.

We know Crystal Springs had at least a line, if not a telegrapher, as McPherson sent Wright after it, 24(v3)290, and we know Fayette had a line and a telegrapher, as I've seen telegrams from Fayette to Jackson.

My intent is to try to nail down the confederate C2 after the boats ran the batteries and Grierson was wreaking his havoc. And secondly, get some fidelity on Confederate operations along the GNO RR south of Jackson. I think there is some work to do around that and how operations along the RR influenced operations around GG and PG.

Let me know what you think!

John

 

[alan polk]

I've never come across anything indicating a telegraph from Port Gibson to the east. Natchez had a telegraph line. It likely connected to Port Gibson (not absolutely sure about that) but I'm pretty sure the Natchez line also went east from that town to the NOJ.

I've also often wondered about the naming of the Telegraph Road which ran from the Jackson-Raymond Road to below Edwards Depot. I've never seen anything indicating that an actual telegraph ran along it, at least during the war.

 

[JohnG0609]

Thanks Alan,
After some thought I'm inclined to agree with you that no line ran due east. But that leaves us with the notion that went it south Fayette to Natchez maybe? But that still doesn't get Pemberton C2 with Bowen at PG/GG because if the line went south before east it would connect south of Hazlehurst, which we know Grierson broke. So maybe you are right.... Maybe the line between PG and Jackson went north/north east, east of BBR and joined it at the Southern RR? Edwards Depot? Clinton? Maybe Bolton since it had the short Raymond line?

My follow on would be, how long would it take to transmit a message and have it received by the intended? As I understand it, each message had to be received and re-sent at each station to move it down the line.

John

 

[alan polk]

John, as I think on it, I doubt a line ran south from Port Gibson to Natchez. I seem to recall that in March Pemberton was anxious to inform Bowen at Grand Gulf about the progress of Farragut coming up the Mississippi after he ran the batteries at Port Hudson. I seem to recall that when Farragut was finally spotted near Natchez, the information from Natchez arrived first to Pemberton in Jackson, and then from Pemberton in Jackson to Grand Gulf via Vicksburg. Otherwise, if there had been a line between Natchez and Port Gibson, the message would have gone direct to Port Gibson then Grand Gulf. I'll have to dig through the ORs to make sure.

From my limited perspective, I always assumed that a message from Port Gibson travelled to Grand Gulf first, then went north to Vicksburg, and from Vicksburg to other points.

Warren Grabau gives an example of this on page 37 of his work, "98 Days," as follows:

"The Confederate high command made elaborate use of electronic communications, which was a major advantage; by 1863, telegraph lines had reached nearly every major town in the South. However, the interconnectivity remained relatively poor. The major lines tended to follow the railroads; towns off the railroads normally were reached only by a branch or stub line."

"For example, Yazoo City was not on a railroad, but it was reached on a stub line that ran from the railroad at Vaughan."

"Grand Gulf and Port Gibson were connected by a telegraph line that ran along the little railroad line connecting the two towns, and Grand Gulf was connected to Vicksburg by a stub line, but there was no direct connection between Grand Gulf and Jackson.
The result was that a telegraph message from Grand Gulf to Yazoo City had to go to Vicksburg, where it was transcribed by an operator, who sent it to an operator in Jackson, who transmitted it to one in Vaughan, who transmitted it to Yazoo City."

As concerns your query into the time it would take for telegraphic messages to reach a destination, Grabau offers this:

"Of course, each operator was subject to error, and it was fairly common for a message to be somewhat garbled before it got to its final destination. Nevertheless, the telegraph system gave the Confederate high command the ability to reach very nearly all its major outlying commands within minutes."

Grabau goes on to say, for example, that a message sent from Davis in Richmond to Pemberton in Jackson could be accomplished in about one hour.

Hope this helps.

 

[JohnG0609]

Alan, really good work. I hadn't thought about looking at Grabau.

I recall having been to the site linked here:

https://telegraph.library.cmu.edu/

Here's a screenshot of his interactive map:

Taken from your post, "From my limited perspective, I always assumed that a message from Port Gibson travelled to Grand Gulf first, then went north to Vicksburg, and from Vicksburg to other points."

That is a logical assumption, except how would one explain message traffic after 4/29? There has to be some other route to complete the circuit. Did that traffic get pushed east to the GNO above Hazlehurst or did it go north/northeast to intersect the line along the Southern.

I don't think the route could go south then east, that would put it below Hazlehurst, which Grierson cut.

There had to be a redundancy in the system that allowed Pemberton C2 to operations along the river below Vicksburg.

Or maybe I'm overthinking it and they just repaired the break between GG and Vicksburg? I don't think so because after PG fell but before GG evacuated they were reduced to couriers. Which would not have been so if the line from GG was up and running.

This may be one of those things you solve accidentally while you were looking for something else or a deep dive into NARA RG 109.

 

[alan polk]

Or maybe I'm overthinking it and they just repaired the break between GG and Vicksburg? I don't think so because after PG fell but before GG evacuated they were reduced to couriers. Which would not have been so if the line from GG was up and running.

I'll have to look at the ORs to get precise dates, but I believe that soon after the Confederates withdrew across Hankinson's Ferry (after giving up the line of the Bayou Pierre), telegraphic communication was reestablished to a point near Hankinson's Ferry on the north side of the Big Black.

You're asking very good and important questions that I have never looked deeply into. And it is likely I'm not fully understanding your questions. Honestly, my suspicion is that there was no "redundancy in the system" at all. Initially, any news coming from along the river below Vicksburg came direct from Port Gibson/Grand Gulf to Vicksburg or from Natchez to the east, then up the railroad to Jxn, then to Vicksburg.

After the fall of Grand Gulf, then, news came to Vicksburg from as far south as Hankinson Ferry. (I think they even ran a line or branch of telegraph out to Redbone Church, but not sure.)

After Grierson, the Confederates had to wait until the telegraph was repaired along the NO&JXN, which did not take too long — if I'm remembering right. And I think that, after repairs, it stayed up and operable all the way to Jackson until the Yankee cavalry cut it at Crystal Springs on May 11.

But again, this is conjecture off the top of my head right now. You are certainly looking into important questions. I'll try to comb through some stuff tonight.

 

[JohnG0609]

I'll have to look at the ORs to get precise dates, but I believe that soon after the Confederates withdrew across Hankinson's Ferry (after giving up the line of the Bayou Pierre), telegraphic communication was reestablished to a point near Hankinson's Ferry on the north side of the Big Black.

You're asking very good and important questions that I have never looked deeply into. And it is likely I'm not fully understanding your questions. Honestly, my suspicion is that there was no "redundancy in the system" at all. Initially, any news coming from along the river below Vicksburg came direct from Port Gibson/Grand Gulf to Vicksburg or from Natchez to the east, then up the railroad to Jxn, then to Vicksburg.

After the fall of Grand Gulf, then, news came to Vicksburg from as far south as Hankinson Ferry. (I think they even ran a line or branch of telegraph out to Redbone Church, but not sure.)

After Grierson, the Confederates had to wait until the telegraph was repaired along the NO&JXN, which did not take too long — if I'm remembering right. And I think that, after repairs, it stayed up and operable all the way to Jackson until the Yankee cavalry cut it at Crystal Springs on May 11.

But again, this is conjecture off the top of my head right now. You are certainly looking into important questions. I'll try to comb through some stuff tonight.

Correct about re-establishing comms west of Hankinson's. As I recall Pemberton to Loring referencing reconnection if the operator took his instruments. But I'm not sure that it occurred.

 

[tony_gunter]

The Mississippi Free Trader April 5th 1848 describes the route: Natchez to Liberty to Gallatin. Port Gibson newspapers reported that a line was later run from Natchez to Port Gibson, and a short line was built from there to Grand Gulf to provide quick access of dispatches to the river.

I assume the construction of the railroad shifted the line and it no longer ran from Liberty to Gallatin, but Liberty to McComb?

 

[tony_gunter]

Asking for feedback from you guys, validation or correction, on telegraph routes.

Thanks in advance!

John

I'm struggling to understand why the line ran from Natchez to Liberty to Gallatin. May have been the existence of the ridge road from Gallatin to Liberty, almost 70 miles without crossing a single waterway.

Did it require extra equipment / maintenance to carry a telegraph line across a river or creek?

 

[alan polk]

Did it require extra equipment / maintenance to carry a telegraph line across a river or creek?

I don't think it was difficult at all. I may be wrong, but I think the wire was wrapped around a spindle and it just unwound from the back of the wagon as you moved along. The hardest part was probably setting telegraph poles.

I can understand why it ran to Liberty. It was an important town. In fact, in 1816— a year before Mississippi even became a State— Liberty already had a population of 3,365 whites and about 1700 slaves. The town moved a lot of cotton to Natchez and probably exchanged a lot of other commerce. So I can see how communication to that area might've been important.

As far as Gallatin, I don't know, but before the railroad came, Gallatin was probably the biggest village in the area. Anyhow, just my thoughts.

 

[JohnG0609]

Sketching out where I think we are in this. Let me know what y'all think.

I'm still kind of stuck on messages from Jackson to GG/PG after the line at Hazlehurst was cut. What an I missing?

I don't think I'm synced up on a Gallatin, CS, Hazlehurst "node".

John

 

[alan polk]

I guess I'm not sure what you are asking. If so, I beg for your patience, because the way I see it is that a message from Jackson to Grand Gulf would go from Jackson to Vicksburg and then to Grand Gulf. The fact that Grierson cut the telegraph at Hazlehurst did not factor into that equation. Or at least that is how I'm seeing that particular issue.

 

[JohnG0609]

I guess I'm not sure what you are asking. If so, I beg for your patience, because the way I see it is that a message from Jackson to Grand Gulf would go from Jackson to Vicksburg and then to Grand Gulf. The fact that Grierson cut the telegraph at Hazlehurst would did not factor into that equation. Or at least that is how I'm seeing that particular issue.

Right. Except that the line - to GG went down 04/29. Bowen transmitted from GG on the 4/30 to JCP in Jackson. JCP moved night of 04/30 to Vburg and began transmitting to Bowen on morning of 05/1. Bowen moved to PG morning of 5/1 and kept transmitting to JCP now in Vburg.

My premise is that there had to be a circuit moving south or east of PG to get past the cut in the GG to Vburg north line in order to be received in Jackson and/or forwarded on to Vburg.

To be more transparent and widen the aperture a bit, what I'm specifically looking at is the 96 hour time Fram from 04/28-05/01 and the CSA response to the GG attack and landing at Bburg. We know intuitively if not literally that Grierson's operations along the GNO influenced operations in the GG/PG AOR but beyond Adams cavalry being pulled away I've not seen a "list" of what those influences are and how they impacted operations around GG/PG. I have some notions, but I need to get some fidelity on a few events to confirm my own thinking.

Feels like we kinda gettin bogged down in the good ole gumbo mud in the Delta huh old friend? The more we move, the thicker and stickier the mud becomes.

 

[alan polk]

Right. Except that the line - to GG went down 04/29. Bowen transmitted from GG on the 4/30 to JCP in Jackson. JCP moved night of 04/30 to Vburg and began transmitting to Bowen on morning of 05/1. Bowen moved to PG morning of 5/1 and kept transmitting to JCP now in Vburg.

My premise is that there had to be a circuit moving south or east of PG to get past the cut in the GG to Vburg north line in order to be received in Jackson and/or forwarded on to Vburg.

To be more transparent and widen the aperture a bit, what I'm specifically looking at is the 96 hour time Fram from 04/28-05/01 and the CSA response to the GG attack and landing at Bburg. We know intuitively if not literally that Grierson's operations along the GNO influenced operations in the GG/PG AOR but beyond Adams cavalry being pulled away I've not seen a "list" of what those influences are and how they impacted operations around GG/PG. I have some notions, but I need to get some fidelity on a few events to confirm my own thinking.

Feels like we kinda gettin bogged down in the good ole gumbo mud in the Delta huh old friend? The more we move, the thicker and stickier the mud becomes.

Oh, I see. I had always operated under the assumption that the telegraph was repaired later on the afternoon of April 29. So, it was only down for several hours.

Grabau speaks to this. He writes that the telegraph break was from a normal malfunction. Then writes: "By late afternoon [29th], the telegraph to Vicksburg had been repaired, and Bowen sent a message to Pemberton, informing him of the days' events and asking for cartridge bags and shells for his big guns. As soon as Pemberton got the news, he sent a peremptory wire to Carter Stevenson: "Hurry forward reinforcements to Bowen to-night." Only then did Stevenson order Tracy's and Baldwin's brigades to hit the road for Grand Gulf." Pp 139, 140.