Hatfields and McCoys

[JWheeler331]

Photo from the McCoy article (these folks are Hatfields):

Expired Image Removed

I see five people holding guns in that photo, and at least three of them are pointing the gun in the direction of a family member.

I'll give this show a try. Don't know if I can take six hours of it, though. LOL.

Back then gun safety was not at the forefront. They were just another tool and were treated as such. They were also in the hands of mostly skilled gunmen and with single actions and lever actions......one would just about have to mean to shoot someone. Now.....if the hammers were back and such I would be a bit nervous at the other end.

 

[JWheeler331]

Thought Randall McCoy fought for the Union ??? They got it right about his nephew, Harmon. I believe a lot of the Hatfields were officially listed as " deserted. " Pretty much ignored orders. Came home and fought WHO they wanted to and WHEN they wanted to.

Im sure someone here could drum up a service record for him, no?

 

[Joshua Horn]

I didn't know that thanks for the information. I remember the movie " The Last of the Mohicans" was filmed around or near Asheville NC. Originally I thought that was filmed in upstate NY. The Cold Mountain Romania site kind of surprised me much like the Hatfields and McCoys. One would think it would be less expensive to film here in the US but I am not in the film making business.............

Romania may have been cheaper once they got over there. I went there a few years ago and it is a pretty poor country, most of the men leave for long periods of time to work in other nations, such as Spain, sort of like Mexico and the United States.

 

[donna]

Powers Boothe is a very fine actor. He was born June 1, 1948 inSynder, Texas and he lives in Los Angeles now.

I thought he was especially excellent in the TV movie on Jim Jones in 1980. He won an emmy for his role.

 

[Nathanb1]

Powers Boothe is a very fine actor. He was born June 1, 1948 inSynder, Texas and he lives in Los Angeles now.

I thought he was especially excellent in the TV movie on Jim Jones in 1980. He won an emmy for his role.

Wow. He's in it? I missed that. Better pay closer attention.

 

[Nathanb1]

Romania may have been cheaper once they got over there. I went there a few years ago and it is a pretty poor country, most of the men leave for long periods of time to work in other nations, such as Spain, sort of like Mexico and the United States.

But it truly is beautiful. Regarding what you posted--we met a young man from their capital at Disney World. He got us hooked on Romania!

 

[JWheeler331]

But it truly is beautiful. Regarding what you posted--we met a young man from their capital at Disney World. He got us hooked on Romania!

I remember my dad going there in the early 1990s with the Army and brought back lots of pics. Very beautiful place with lots of nice castles......and of course there is Dracula's Castle near by. Those pics really were neat to a young kid.

 

[diane]

Powers Boothe is a very fine actor. He was born June 1, 1948 inSynder, Texas and he lives in Los Angeles now.

I thought he was especially excellent in the TV movie on Jim Jones in 1980. He won an emmy for his role.

Powers Boothe is a very good actor! He got his feet wet here in Ashland, Oregon as a member of the Oregon Shakespeareans. (So did William Hurt, Valerie Harper and a number of other notables!)

 

[K Hale]

Boothe is awesome. He was chilling as the sociopathic Cy Tolliver in Deadwood.

 

[East Tennessee Roots]

Im sure someone here could drum up a service record for him, no?

Union Private Asa Harmon McCoy Company E 45th Ky Inf. Enlisted Oct.20th 1863 at Asland Ky. He is listed " present ' till the roll for May/June 63. He's listed as " sick in the hospital at Lexington " He has returned for the July/Aug.roll.Hs name last appears on the roll at Catlettsburg,Ky.Dec.1864. He was killed the following Jan.1865. I copied the following online : The first real violence in the feud was the murder of a returning Union soldier Asa Harmon McCoy. He was killed by a group of ex-Confederates Homeguard called the "Logan Wildcats". Devil Anse Hatfield was a suspect at first, but was later confirmed to have been sick at home at the time of the murder. It was widely believed that his uncle, Jim Vance, a member of the Wildcats, committed the murder.[3]
Asa Harmon McCoy was murdered on January 7, 1865. Jim Vance, the uncle of Devil Anse Hatfield, despised Harmon because he had joined the Union Army during the American Civil War. Harmon was discharged from the army early because of a broken leg. He returned home to a warning from Vance that Harmon could expect a visit from Devil Anse's Wildcats. Frightened by gunshots as he drew water from his well, Harmon hid in a nearby cave, supplied with food and necessities each day by his slave, Pete; but the Wildcats followed Pete's tracks in the snow, discovered Harmon and shot him fatally

 

[East Tennessee Roots]

Anyone else looking forward to watching the 3 night series on the History Channel? Pretty good line-up of actors, Civil War background/related and interesting story. The previews look pretty good. Looks much better than their recent project on Gettysburg.

I believe this is the Confederate Service Record For William Anderson ("Devil Anse") Hatfield :

Residence was not listed; a 25 year-old Farmer.

Enlisted on 8/31/1863 at Saltville, VA as a 1st Lieutenant.

On 8/31/1863 he was commissioned into "B" Co. VA 45th Battn Infantry
(date and method of discharge not given)


He was listed as:
* Absent without leave 2/1/1864 (place not stated)
* Paroled 5/4/1865 Charleston, WV


He was described at enlistment as:
5' 6.0", dark complexion, dark eyes, dark hair

Other Information:
born 9/9/1839 in Logan County, WV
died 1/6/1921 in Logan County, WV
Buried: Hatfield Cem, Logan Co, WV

After the War he lived in Logan County, WV

 

[Glorybound]

I'm having a little trouble following (understanding) the speech from some of the characters. Don't know whether it's because my hearing blows, or the dialect, the mumbling, the sound from my ancient TEE-vee, or what - probably all those put together.

I do gather, from what I've seen so far, that the origin of the bad blood between the two families seems to have occurred when Costner's Hatfield character deserted Confederate forces and went back home. That seemed to set Paxton's McCoy character off kilter somewhat. Then shortly afterwards the ne'er-do-well Yankee POW-murdering 'Uncle Jim' Hatfield murders ex-Yankee Harmon McCoy because Harmon was a Yankee (1) and Harmon made the comment to Uncle Jim and in front of other bar patrons that Uncle Jim was having sex with his dog (2). Such a comment in a bar even in today's culture might cause some fisticuffs between drunken dudes but I imagine in 19th century eastern Kentucky/western WV it might be considered justification for murder. After Harmon's death, maybe even slightly before, things begin to go downhill pretty quickly.

I'm enjoying the show despite the trouble understanding some of the speech, even though the obligatory Hollywood love story seems to have made it's way into the film (surprise) and is taking up a significant portion of it so far, and probably will continue to do so for a while.

 

[JWheeler331]

I'm having a little trouble following (understanding) the speech from some of the characters. Don't know whether it's because my hearing blows, or the dialect, the mumbling, the sound from my ancient TEE-vee, or what - probably all those put together.

I do gather, from what I've seen so far, that the origin of the bad blood between the two families seems to have occurred when Costner's Hatfield character deserted Confederate forces and went back home. That seemed to set Paxton's McCoy character off kilter somewhat. Then shortly afterwards the ne'er-do-well Yankee prisoner-murdering 'Uncle Jim' Hatfield murders ex-Yankee Harmon McCoy because Harmon was a Yankee (1) and Harmon made the comment to Uncle Jim and in front of other bar patrons that Uncle Jim was having sex with his dog (2). Such a comment in a bar even in today's culture might cause some fisticuffs between drunken dudes but I imagine in 19th century eastern Kentucky/western WV it might be considered justification for murder. After Harmon's death, maybe even slightly before, things begin to go downhill pretty quickly.

I'm enjoying the show despite the trouble understanding some of the speech, even though the obligatory Hollywood love story seems to be taking up much of it so far, and probably will continue to do so for a while.

There were several rumors of how the feud started and I think the movie kind of touched on most of them. That kind of gives people who may haver heard it one way or another the satisfaction of having that in there.

As for understanding them......well my uncle is from W. Virginia and he has a thick accent. Its hard to understand sometimes so I think as you say.....it may be a little bit of everything, from your hearing to the dialect.

 

[Glorybound]

There were several rumors of how the feud started and I think the movie kind of touched on most of them. That kind of gives people who may haver heard it one way or another the satisfaction of having that in there.

As for understanding them......well my uncle is from W. Virginia and he has a thick accent. Its hard to understand sometimes so I think as you say.....it may be a little bit of everything, from your hearing to the dialect.

Yeah I think my neighbors across the hall are also tuned into the show whether they want to be or not, simply because I've got the volume jacked up so high. I'm a lip-reader which helps me compensate for my bad hearing, but with all the beards and facial hair on these guys it's difficult to even see their lips. I did re-watch the encore presentation of that first episode for about 30 mins. that aired immediately afterwards and I was able to pick up on some things that I missed the first time.

 

[JWheeler331]

Yeah I think my neighbors across the hall are also tuned into the show whether they want to be or not, simply because I've got the volume jacked up so high. I'm a lip-reader which helps me compensate for my bad hearing, but with all the beards and facial hair on these guys it's difficult to even see their lips. I did re-watch the encore presentation of that first episode for about 30 mins. that aired immediately afterwards and I was able to pick up on some things that I missed the first time.

I did the same thing. Its been so long since I have seen or read anything on the feud that I had forgot some things and so the beginning was hard to follow at first, trying to figure out who was who and such.

 

[K Hale]

I'm still not 100% sure who is who and who is related to who. LOL. Looking up Devil Anse on Wiki after the show filled in a lot of gaps for me; wish I'd done it to begin with.

I saw an episode of Ghost Hunters once where they were visiting an old prison in WV. Their guide was an old dude who had once been incarcerated there. He was a native West Virginian, and they actually used subtitles for all of his speech... lol

 

[Glorybound]

I'm still not 100% sure who is who and who is related to who. LOL. Looking up Devil Anse on Wiki after the show filled in a lot of gaps for me; wish I'd done it to begin with.

I saw an episode of Ghost Hunters once where they were visiting an old prison in WV. Their guide was an old dude who had once been incarcerated there. He was a native West Virginian, and they actually used subtitles for all of his speech... lol

Yeah I believe that, in some of the scenes in last night's episode subtitles would've been very useful, at least for me. Another occurrence of note during the program (actually a commercial break) was the commercial for Henry rifles. First time I've ever seen one.

 

[East Tennessee Roots]

Im sure someone here could drum up a service record for him, no?

My Bad !!!! Apparently Randall McCoy was a Confederate if indeed he did serve. The Yank from Kentucky, ASA HARMON MCCOY was Randall's brother. There were about 10 Rebel McCoys in Devil Anse's outfit.
45th Virginia Infantry Battalion

HISTORY
45th Infantry Battalion was organized by detachments between April and December, 1863. Its six companies were composed of men from the 1st Regiment Cavalry Virginia State Line which had disbanded. The unit served in the Department of Western Virginia, lost 4 killed and 11 wounded at Cloyd's Mountain, then was involved in various conflicts in the Shenandoah Valley. It disbanded during April, 1865. Lieutenant Colonel Henry M. Beckley and Major Blake L. Woodson were in command.
[Source: National Park Service, Civil War Soldiers and Sailors System] & also the following :

Randall McCoy

Residence was not listed;
Enlisted as a Private (date unknown).




He also had service in:
VA 45th Battn Infantry


(Service questionable, oral tradition only, supported
by Devil Anse's statement in 1892 lawsuit.)

 

[Dave Hull]

Lori and I both enjoyed episode 1. She is from a town about 20 miles from Tug River, where the Hatfields reside. The dialog is rough to understand, as like Lee I am deaf as a post, but it is not because it is an accurate WV coal fields accent. I think some of the actors make up for the lack of proper accent by mumbling. My only other major observation is the terrain. That part of WV and KY is some of the roughest terrain in the East. A straight piece of road has about 30 yards of straight, before veering 60-90' left or right. Too many wide valleys on the show, with gentle ridges. McDowell and Mingo Counties WV are straight up and straight down, with enough flat land on either side of the Tug river to build a shack.

I read a book on the two families many years ago, do not recall the title but it was one of the few books my mother in law owned other than the bible. From what I recall, one of the daughters of one family ran off with a son of the other family and did in fact get pregnant, so the love story could be spot on.

All in all, I thought the first part was very entertaining and set up nicely, the ensuing war between the two families.

 

[K Hale]

The Romeo and Juliet aspect is in fact reality, according to the bit I read last night.