Dan Sickles - Anything good?

[MikeyB]

I asked this about Burnside a bit ago and got some good information. He did have some good service despite history largely only remembering Fredericksburg.

How about Sickles? History remembers either insanity defense or his day 2 Gettysburg movement. Perhaps the most generous thing history may remember is that he visited his leg at Walter Reed, showcasing his bravery under fire.

So, what are the good things of Sickles? Service or lesser advertised actions?

 

[Kearny The Magnificent]

Good and interesting don't necessarily overlap. For the "good", I would say Sickles cared enough to put on a uniform and serve. His intentions might have also been self-serving, to rehab his image, but there were potentially other pathways to do that too. He could have stayed on the sidelines but chose not to. He helped recruit an entire brigade into service. I am not a Sickles "fan" and believe Meade was correct to admonish him at Gettysburg. But because he's a bit of a wacky character, sometimes people do lose sight of the fact he lost a limb serving the country (his leg getting blown off still counts in that regard even when considering he disobeyed orders + got an entire AoP Corp destroyed) and mock him instead.

 

[Tony Z]

In my opinion, he played a major role in the evolution of the Gettysburg battlefield into the battle monument it became. It can be argued that the Gettysburg park then became what other battlefields emulated.

Also, he is a fun character to read about.

 

[rpkennedy]

Sickles was a pretty good brigade commander on the Peninsula but was largely untested as a division commander before being tapped to command the Third Corps.

He was personally courageous and was never afraid to lead his men from near the front, for good or ill. He also cared deeply for his troops and was conscientious about their needs.

Ryan

 

[TerryB]

I guess you could say rumors of his death at Williamsburg were greatly exaggerated.

 

[Scott1967]

Uncle Dan was loved by his men and he was no fool his movement of the III corps at Gettysburg was a direct result of his experience at Chancellorsville where his men were pounded from higher ground by Confederate Artillery , And whether you deem it unwise or not his actions probably saved the Union army that day not that Dan knew anything about it.

I think if Sickles had not been wounded that day he may have made a decent Corps commander , Would he have survived Grant though is the question I doubt it.

 

[rpkennedy]

Uncle Dan was loved by his men and he was no fool his movement of the III corps at Gettysburg was a direct result of his experience at Chancellorsville where his men were pounded from higher ground by Confederate Artillery , And whether you deem it unwise or not his actions probably saved the Union army that day not that Dan knew anything about it.

I think if Sickles had not been wounded that day he may have made a decent Corps commander , Would he have survived Grant though is the question I doubt it.

Interestingly, Sickles never mentioned that Hazel Grove influenced his decision on July 2. But he did say that Jackson's flank attack was something that he thought of during that day (of course, he said it after the war with hindsight).

And he definitely would not have survived Grant. His corps would still be folded into the Second and he'd be left without a command.

Ryan

 

[Scott1967]

Interestingly, Sickles never mentioned that Hazel Grove influenced his decision on July 2. But he did say that Jackson's flank attack was something that he thought of during that day (of course, he said it after the war with hindsight).

And he definitely would not have survived Grant. His corps would still be folded into the Second and he'd be left without a command.

Ryan

You are quite correct he never mentioned Hazel Grove directly but he did say that he did not want the Confederates occupying the high ground in front of him and placing cannon , I believe he also had a conversation with Henry Hunt who agreed with Sickles , Hunt went off to find Meade but nothing came of it although my memory is a bit sketchy.

Either way there is no doubt Sickles moved his Corps because of what happened when he was pulled back from Hazel Grove by Hooker that had to be on his mind.

 

[7thWisconsin]

Dan Sickles was the driving force behind the establishment of Central Park in NYC. Sometimes terrible people do good things.

 

[JerryD]

You are quite correct he never mentioned Hazel Grove directly but he did say that he did not want the Confederates occupying the high ground in front of him and placing cannon , I believe he also had a conversation with Henry Hunt who agreed with Sickles , Hunt went off to find Meade but nothing came of it although my memory is a bit sketchy.

Either way there is no doubt Sickles moved his Corps because of what happened when he was pulled back from Hazel Grove by Hooker that had to be on his mind.

I think you are stretching things a bit when you say Hunt agreed with him. Hunt agreed the Peach Orchard would make a good artillery platform. He certainly did not agree that he should move his troops hundreds of yards in front of the line and leave both wings unsupported, while leaving the most defensible point undefended. Sickles essentially destroyed his corps that day and what saved the battle for the US was Meade shoveling troops into the sector to save his a%%.

 

[Belfoured]

Dan Sickles was the driving force behind the establishment of Central Park in NYC. Sometimes terrible people do good things.

True - but then there's that $27,000 belonging to the NY Monuments Commission that was found "missing" c. 1910 and that resulted in Dan being let go in 1912. That equates to about $950,000 today. It's hard to simply "misplace" that or lose it in the couch seats.

 

[Belfoured]

I think you are stretching things a bit when you say Hunt agreed with him. Hunt agreed the Peach Orchard would make a good artillery platform. He certainly did not agree that he should move his troops hundreds of yards in front of the line and leave both wings unsupported, while leaving the most defensible point undefended. Sickles essentially destroyed his corps that day and what saved the battle for the US was Meade shoveling troops into the sector to save his a%%.

I've always found compelling Dave Powell's detailed analysis c. 2003 of the several reasons why Sickles' decision was incompetent. That's aside from his subsequent public relations campaign which was an exercise in, shall we say, "mendacity".

 

[35th MA InfRegt]

Dan Sickles was the driving force behind the establishment of Central Park in NYC. Sometimes terrible people do good things.

I suppose it is possible that terrible people can sometimes do good things but I tend to doubt that Sickles was one of these people. I think Shakespeare had something to say about that.

 

[35th MA InfRegt]

I've always found compelling Dave Powell's detailed analysis c. 2003 of the several reasons why Sickles' decision was incompetent. That's aside from his subsequent public relations campaign which was an exercise in, shall we say, "mendacity".

Powell's article on Sickles ought to be required reading for anyone participating in these discussions.

 

[JerryD]

I've always found compelling Dave Powell's detailed analysis c. 2003 of the several reasons why Sickles' decision was incompetent. That's aside from his subsequent public relations campaign which was an exercise in, shall we say, "mendacity".

Hate to admit it, but have not seen it. Is there a link available?

 

[35th MA InfRegt]

Hate to admit it, but have not seen it. Is there a link available?

If I may butt in?

Advance to Disaster

 

[Belfoured]

Hate to admit it, but have not seen it. Is there a link available?

@35th MA InfRegt beat me to it. It really is still the best I've seen. The fact that Dirty Dan then lied about the whole thing later just adds to the problem. But then in his AAR report for Chancellorsville he subtly altered the content of his message to Hooker on May 2 regarding what Jackson was up to, so Gettysburg was hardly the first occasion for Dan to play with the truth.

 

[Saint Jude]

I've never found any evidence that there was anything good about Sickles. He seems to have been a self-serving liar his entire life.

 

[NH Civil War Gal]

Here's the thing about Dirty Dan - for some reason he lasted an incredibly long time against great physical odds that would have killed most men and did. He and Longstreet were friendly to a point and that made a good talking point long after the Civil War. His widely known good deeds - Gettysburg Park, publicly breaking with pre-war Southern sympathizers, recruiting the Excelsior Brigade - offset his bad deeds. And by outliving his accusers, he's the one that got to tell the story.

Plus the eccentricity of visiting his leg in the museum didn't hurt either.

 

[7thWisconsin]

To pile on to his personal odiousness, Sickles was hideously cruel to both his wife and his only daughter.