Impressions Continued Work on Impression, Advice Needed

[TnFed]

Regrettably no

The Moon sisters were spies for the Confederates. They lived in near by Oxford. Ambrose Bursides was sweet on one of them. He was from Liberty Indiana


A

 

[7thWisconsin]

I can understand events wanting to curb walk on Maj. Gens, but given our ranks are all fictional I don't see what the fuss among reenactors & within units is. Most are so old they ought to be pensioners not privates! But if people are going to be stubborn about it I'll be a private.

I might make use of those buttons off my old frock to try & recreate a early war state jackets now that I know more about them. No such thing as too many uniforms, I say!

I am generally wanting to stick to artillery since that's my interest area and my trousers are riding trousers but might cultivate an infantry impression too since there is a lot of overlap with in basic gear. I'd love to portray someone who switched branches... would it make sense for me to go artillery then infantry or the reverse when it comes to hypothetical service record?

Rank may be fictional, but it is not functionless. Generally speaking, the people wearing stuff on their sleeves and shoulders are in charge somehow. Either they are elected leaders of their individual units, or are filling a staff role in larger organizations. Unless they are personality reenactors (who research and recreate a specific historical indivual and concentrate on portraying them) their rank has a function during the weekend.
The artillery drafted men from infantry units to make up their numbers. I don't know if a transfer the other way was common, given the difference in casualty rates between the 2 branches. I would pursue your artillery interest, because that's a fairly inexpensive impression (as long as you're not the guy buying the gun). I wouldn't build your impression around your trousers; not all mounted troops got those trousers, and there is every possibility that a soldier from another branch could acquire them through barter or purchase if he really wanted them. If you keep your impression generic, without too much brass, cordage or feathers, you can fit in wherever you go. I would say that you should prioritize getting out and doing your hobby. You've asked about events in Ohio, but you have to work many of the weekends when they are. I know time off is hard to come by, but it's your choice. If you don't start actually going to reenactments, you're just going to have a closet full of random clothing and gear that you spent a lot of money for and never use. Just my 2 cents...

 

[Legion Para]

Rank may be fictional, but it is not functionless. Generally speaking, the people wearing stuff on their sleeves and shoulders are in charge somehow. Either they are elected leaders of their individual units, or are filling a staff role in larger organizations. Unless they are personality reenactors (who research and recreate a specific historical indivual and concentrate on portraying them) their rank has a function during the weekend.
The artillery drafted men from infantry units to make up their numbers. I don't know if a transfer the other way was common, given the difference in casualty rates between the 2 branches. I would pursue your artillery interest, because that's a fairly inexpensive impression (as long as you're not the guy buying the gun). I wouldn't build your impression around your trousers; not all mounted troops got those trousers, and there is every possibility that a soldier from another branch could acquire them through barter or purchase if he really wanted them. If you keep your impression generic, without too much brass, cordage or feathers, you can fit in wherever you go. I would say that you should prioritize getting out and doing your hobby. You've asked about events in Ohio, but you have to work many of the weekends when they are. I know time off is hard to come by, but it's your choice. If you don't start actually going to reenactments, you're just going to have a closet full of random clothing and gear that you spent a lot of money for and never use. Just my 2 cents...

Agreed.

 

[Legion Para]

If you are going to do an Ohio Artillery impression, then I suggest you join an Artillery battery and really learn what it means to be an Redleg.

 

[Belle Montgomery]

The Moon sisters were spies for the Confederates. They lived in near by Oxford. Ambrose Bursides was sweet on one of them. He was from Liberty Indiana


A

Yes I know all about them...Lottie left Burnside at the altar when he was a Lieutenant! Miami U owns the Moon house on High Street. My impression is a Confederate spy/smuggler but I also know all about the Union female spies too.

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

The gentleman with the rammer, who is wearing Gaiters intrigued me. Let me all know what your thoughts are on him. I plan on staying as a private for the near future, my impression of that is fairly decent. If i did go the officers route I might follow the example of one of the Lt. in this 1st OVLA Battery C picture previously mentioned:

Looks like a frock, forage cap, and shoulder scales to me. Can anyone tell the kind of sword he has on?

Interesting that mounted trousers got issued outside of the artillery\cavalry sometimes, did not know that. I will keep the tin mind in case someone asks in the future. Maybe I'll incorporate the infantry to artillery replacement into my impression. The Cleveland Artillery did lose a man just before Corricks Ford, I could be a replacement from one of the infantry regiments they were attached to.

New Canteen arrived today and I'm very happy with it. Sorry, no pictures as of yet. Is there any info on wether or not 3 month guys used gaiters? I see a very nice pair of tarred button up one for sale on line, should I bite or save my money?

Same question about the nice buckle shoes I see up for sale... I know they aren't brogans but I think they were mentioned in that Congress elastic shoe thread a while back as being a period? I'll probably pass on them but it would be nice to know for future reference.

Also, with my shoes, is my modern shoe size the same as the shoes I ought to be buying? I wear a size 8 1/2 wide.

I do plan on going to the encampment at Marblehead this October if anyone else is coming. I will also be at the 103rd OVI's flag lowering ceremony on the 8th, playing my violin. There are probably another couple local community events I can get out to... some are not specifically ACW related but probably wouldn't mind my presence.

I will have to research the CLA's compliment of guns more, but it is interesting to see two period sources claim that they were using both 12 & 6 lbers. I know the batteries from Cleveland were supposed to have had 12lbers by 1845, according to the Cleveland Artillery Reminscances book, but the same source also says when they were enlarged to a 4 battery unit (A,B, D,E, all one gun units) the state supplied harnesses & guns so not sure wether they supplied all new guns, or just two new guns or what? Also, if the 12lber guns are from 1845, they would be either 12 lber Howitzers or 12 lb heavy field guns, being in pre-Napoleon times. If said cannons were truly the latter type, it dosen't square particularly well with the idea that they were a flying artillery battery in 1845 although I suppose it is possible. Most survivng photos of them seem to show an all 6 pounder battery, as far as I can see. An interesting wrinkle in things...

 

[James Brenner]

In answer to your question about whether or not the 3 month men wore gaiters, the answer is no. The General Regulations for the Military Forces of Ohio (Columbus: Nevins, 1859) which governed - generally speaking - the clothing and equipment of the enrolled/common militia make no mention of gaiters. These regulations apply to the 14th - 27th OVMs. Similarly, neither set of the later guidelines printed in 1861 (initially gray and later regulation blue uniforms) include gaiters.

The CLA, a volunteer organization, established its own uniform guidelines and, as is apparent from the above picture, gaiters are noticeably missing. BTW, if you can find a copy of Volume IV, Fighting for Time in the National Historical Society Image of War:1861-1865 series, (New York: Doubleday, 1983), page 416 shows a picture of a second pre-war CLA company. It is mislabeled as the ONG 8th Light Artillery, but the uniforms and background indicate it is an unknown company of the CLA. And, again, no gaiters. But the officer images are more clear and distinct.

In terms of ordnance, the CLA -even though it was a volunteer company and therefore responsible for its own uniforms and equipment - received some help from the state. As you noted, Ohio provided cannon to the CLA; probably as a result of political influence. While it's not possible to say exactly what Ohio provided the CLA, under the provisions of the 1808 Militia Act, Ohio received primarily 6-pounders: ten 6-pounders with carriages in April 1853 and one, "12-pounder howitzer with carriage and caisson" in 1856. (NARA, RG 156, Entry 118, Vol. 5). In April 1859, Ohio received six caissons.

Once the war began, QMG D. L. Wood wanted to exchange the CLAs smoothbore 6-pounders soon after the unit received its horses and ammunition. Writing Barnett, he said he wanted to put the "Battery on a proper war footing." (OHC, QM Letter Book, 13 May 1861). Wood was able to acquire the James rifles in June and sent them to Barnett who was in western Virginia at the time. The guns weren't well received. "The rifled six pounders were tested today (17 June) and were not satisfactory. The recoil is tremendous. The Ball is too heavy for the metal." (Cleveland Morning Leader, 19 June 1861)

One other thing: The 8 May 1861 Cleveland Morning Leader has a short article titled, Artillery Waltz, "composed and dedicated to the officers and members of Company D, Light Artillery." If you can find a copy of it, it may be possible to build an impression around that.

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

Thanks! That confirms a lot of my research into the Cleveland Light Artillery. I will definitely have to see if I can find that other image of a prewar battery... I think the LoC might have the Artillery Waltz in sheet music form among it's files. It certainly has J.M. Leland's music, including a march dedicated to James Barnett. Great research!

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

An update for anyone also interested in the CLA/1st Ohio 3mo LA, the battery most likely referenced and confused with the 8th ONG battery is Battery C, from Brooklyn. They went on to become the 8th ONG later in the war, hence the confusion in titles later on down the line.

Interestingly, the men in the photo who are in battleshirts appear to be equipped with 1832 pattern foot artillery swords.

 

[James Brenner]

I noticed that, too. Under the 1808 Militia Act, between July 1850 and June 1851, Ohio received 77 artillery sabers and 100 artillery swords with belts The state received another 200 artillery sabers and 280 artillery swords with belts two years later. Another 150 artillery swords and belts and 50 artillery sabers came in on 9 August 1856 and the state received an additional issue of swords and belts in May 1860, but I did not make a note of that number.

Two other items of interest in the picture: no chevrons or any other mark distinguishing the NCOs. It's likely the swords/sabers accomplished that purpose. Also, Ohio received almost 500 Colt revolvers from 1852 to 1860, but no holsters. You can see the revolvers stuck in the officers' belts.

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

Thanks for that info, James. I will also have to go back & see what other swords were out there for the NCOs too... I kind of wonder what they were using before hand? I think the officer with the jacket has a NCO small sword rather than a artillery sabre, though the choice might have varried from officer to officer and I think we agreed he was comissioned? He is also wearing the summer white trousers, if my eyes do not decieve me.

Good spot on the lack of chevrons, useful for my impression since I 'd like to play an NCO from time to time. IIRC gunners (No 1 man) were NCOs?

 

[James Brenner]

I didn't include them in my list, but Ohio also received NCO swords and belts: 100 in 1851, 100 more in 1853, and 150 more in 1854. The state also received 100 musicians swords in 1858.

I didn't mention it before, but Ohio, in 1844, received 200 artillery swords and belts. That's a lot of artillery-related cutlery.

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

Indeed! Hard to decide what to go with, though probably I would use the 1840 Artillery sabre if the numbers are any indication of frequency (hard to tell, Ohio lost more arms due to their lousy pre-war milita system than most states). Good news in that I quite like that sword, but it might be tricky to find a good copy of it.

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

This, an uncropped version of the previous picture, seems to also show a gentleman in a overcoat & kepi, and someone in a battle shirt and kepi as well... good news for me as I have only a kepi at the moment. Dose that one guy in the back near the limber have a gudion shouldered, or a musketoon? I am also sure the guy on the right background with the double breasted coat is not only a kepi wearer but fancy's himself a higher rank than he actually possesses judging by his buttons . Shows how "uniform" a volunteer unit could be, what with three uniform varieties, and three choices of headgear. Am I mistaken in seeing a lot of men in dark blue trousers, a few with light blue, and the nearest officer wearing white summer weight trousers? Those are a option in the Ohio 1861 regs iirc, not sure if that was something exclusive to them or something done by the Army prewar.

I have to do more research to see if anyone early war was using the Hardee hats that later became a fixture of Western theater men... I assume so since they were in the prewar regs of the US Army and Ohio mainly copied those regs in 1861.

I was contemplating having the black broad hat for those days when the weather is sweltering or rainy/snowy to keep the kepi pasteboard from melting. At some point I probably ought to get a knapsack to stow some of my things in... do I want to go hard or softpack? Most surfing examples I have seen on display are hardpacks, from the Cleveland Grays & 103rd OVI museums.

 

[7thWisconsin]

I think the officer in front is wearing light blue trousers, not white. The look is consistent with how Kersey blue shows up in B/W photography, and the way they drape suggests that to me as well. The dark trousers might possibly be black, also. Black trousers and a battleshirt were a common early war uniform for both sides, since it could be constructed cheaply from existing civilian stores. Black wool trousers were kind of the Carharts of the day. I can't tell from the pic, so I wouldn't go with that option unless you have something written to substantiate it. Kepis and forage caps do a terrible job of shielding the ears and the back of the neck, so pretty quickly you'll find out why the veterans opted for a hat. If you have had data that the unit had hard packs, that's the obvious choice, but if you don't, the double-bag pack is easier to carry, will fit more stuff for storage and makes a better pillow.

 

[James Brenner]

Applying the 1859 Ohio Militia Regulations to this photo is an interesting exercise. The regulations, by the way, are essentially those of the U.S. army with just a few modifications; primarily with buckles and badges. The CLA - particularly the officers - abided by them to a greater degree than the men. Assuming the photo is from 1860, give or take a year, it's possible to see what they've adopted and what they've ignored. In terms of hats, the official cap was a forage cap for both officers and men. But it seems only the officers wore them; everyone else wore the shako. Similarly, the uniform coat was to be a dark blue jacket "of the pattern of light artillery corps", complete with shoulder scales, but the battle shirt appears to be the preferred garb.

I also think the trousers are light blue rather than white. Ohio's 1859 regulations, which specify sky-blue for all ranks, allow white trousers, but with the caveat that "white linen pantaloons may be worn in summer except at inspection or review." Since this photo seems like a formal portrait - akin to an inspection or review - I think it's unlikely that the officer would wear white trousers.​

The officer wearing the double-breasted frock coat is probably one of the field grade officers: Sturgis, Gates, Standart, maybe Barnett. Officially, the coat "shall be of dark blue cloth … single breasted for captains and lieutenants; double breasted for all other grades." It's refreshing to see that the field grade officer did not photo bomb the picture by being up front.

It's hard to tell what the man near the limber is holding, if anything. It could just be a trick of the light. It's probably not a guidon, though. The regs only allowed for a national and regimental color for an artillery regiment and are silent on guidons. It is possible that the CLA purchased some guidons commercially, but, if they did, the guidon bearer would be standing next to the battery commander. It's unfortunate that the photo in Reminiscences is so indistinct because the regiment received two flags on their way to Camp Putnam.

In terms of hard/soft pack knapsack, if you're doing a 3-month impression of the CLA (or 1st Regiment), I think a carpet bag would be more appropriate. All of the letters, etc. ,comment on how poorly equipped they were and make no mention of knapsacks, haversacks, canteens, etc. The city provided them blankets as they departed. It's likely that they carried all their personal items in civilian-style luggage or possibly in a blanket roll.

Finally, as an overall suggestion, I encourage you to decide what impression you want. Personally, I feel that the battle shirt sporting, short sword wielding, and black (dark blue?) pants wearing pre-war militia uniform is the way to go. It will distinguish you from the generic Civil War impression and is very appropriate for Cleveland's Soldiers and Sailors Monument.

I hope this helps a bit.

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

Thanks James, having a second set of eyes look at the evidence

Yeah, I think in the long run the early war uniform is the direction in which I want to move. What I am thinking of, based on what I have at the moment, is bootees\brogans, reenforced sky blue trousers, a battle shirt, an M1832 Artillery Sword, a kepi (I'm of opinion the gent in the back near the limber, the person with the overcoat, and the field grade officer (Barnett?) are wearing them as they look less feedbag-ey although I could be just seeing what I want to see), a haversack & canteen as a standard fit. The Grays in particular seem interested in bringing someone from the 3mo regiment to life, I might have a lecture in the making there if all goes well. It's such a shame that there aren't any pictures of uniforms from the other batteries\sections other than Battery C.

I might also do a later war impression of the 19th/20th, or 8th Battery since they included a lot of the originally men from the CLA. I am particularly intrigued by the 20th as Louis Smithnight, commonly accredited with being responsible for capturing the scessch cannon (although his actual role in it's capture is debatable) was it's commander and he also led the CLA after the war. For that, I'd probably ditch the sword, sub out the battle shirt for my sack coat, and maybe wear a black hat...

I am interested in the blanket roll idea, that would fit well with both my specialized impression and a more generic one in case I wanted to fall in with another unit at a specific event. The only trouble is, I was intending to carry a tin plate I have, and possibly my kepi on me and I'm not sure how I'd do that without smooshing my hat or violating the space-time continuum with the plate... reminds me now of my D&D games where we have to revert to the artifice of a bag of holding!

What would civilian camping gear look like in this period? Some species of carpet bag?

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

I think the officer in front is wearing light blue trousers, not white. The look is consistent with how Kersey blue shows up in B/W photography, and the way they drape suggests that to me as well. The dark trousers might possibly be black, also. Black trousers and a battleshirt were a common early war uniform for both sides, since it could be constructed cheaply from existing civilian stores. Black wool trousers were kind of the Carharts of the day. I can't tell from the pic, so I wouldn't go with that option unless you have something written to substantiate it. Kepis and forage caps do a terrible job of shielding the ears and the back of the neck, so pretty quickly you'll find out why the veterans opted for a hat. If you have had data that the unit had hard packs, that's the obvious choice, but if you don't, the double-bag pack is easier to carry, will fit more stuff for storage and makes a better pillow.

Yeah, even in what limited work I've done thus far the paste board in my kepi makes it into a lid to keep all the heat in... and as you said doesn't help much with keeping the sun off (though at least the brim keeps it out of your eyes).

I always worry about the use of cardboard\paper in hats in modern life (specifically I wonder what genius thought it was a good idea), I have been for years thwarted in getting a new straw hat as I refuse to buy the off the rack models which contain even the slightest bit of recycled paper. Perhaps it is the Clevelander in me that insists on having a sunhat that won't melt in the rain!

I wonder if the "hard" nature of the hardback just means that they have survived more often and are better fit for display, hence their representation in local museums?

 

[Western Reserve Volunteer]

A new chapter begins in my saga to build up a decent impression... and I'm succeeding for the most part. Here's an update on what I've got:

On the (more) Civilian End:
I've procured some lovely black, fall front jean work trousers (yes yes I know it's a dated style but I do dabble in some earlier civilian stuff too), for replicating that early CLA look. I've also got some nice dark brown trousers that fit well and are very comfortable. Also I've picked up a nice pair of silk cravats, one blue & one sort of cream (got them at the ball I went to). Now have universal drawers & socks, plus a square style check shirt I wear with my uniform as a stock undershirt. I already have a very nice black silk vest made by my mother (Originally made for a young Dr. Jared Potter Kirtland impression), and have also acquired a nice red paisley vest as well. Not sure if wearing that latter vest with the check shirt will be too loud, will have to try and see. I also bought a lovely Wide Awakes cockade that will definitely be part of my early war stuff.

On the Military End:
I of course have the standard overcoat, sack coat, and my riding trousers. Still sporting the Kepi, the oldest bit of my kit at this point, in terms of acquisition. I've got a Cincinnati Depot canteen now (grey wool cover, white canvas strap, and twine stopper retainer), a tarred haversack, a tin cup, two tin plates (one of which is insanely heavy and probably won't take the field much),utensils and a "OVM" waist belt buckle and state seal cartridge box buckle. Some modern-style closure US belt plates too. I've also got a Ohio (-ish) patter untamed haversack on the way. I've also had a custom ID disk made with my medical info on it. Although at this point I have definitely branched at bit from my original intent to just do the CLA (still definitely an impression I want to do, just thinking it'll be a point in whatever my overarching story is of the war ultimately), I still definitely try to do an Ohio specific impression. I'm a proud Buckeye!

Anyways, at this point I am still searching for possibly a wide brimmed hat (maybe Civilian, since it would see the most broad use?), definitely a pleated shirt to go with my Kirtland vest, and a battle shirt based on the CLA (any guess as to it's color?). Of an shoes, definitely shoes. Really hard to find 8 1/2 Brogans for less than an arm & leg.

Thoughts, comments?

 

[Mrs. V]

A new chapter begins in my saga to build up a decent impression... and I'm succeeding for the most part. Here's an update on what I've got:

On the (more) Civilian End:
I've procured some lovely black, fall front jean work trousers (yes yes I know it's a dated style but I do dabble in some earlier civilian stuff too), for replicating that early CLA look. I've also got some nice dark brown trousers that fit well and are very comfortable. Also I've picked up a nice pair of silk cravats, one blue & one sort of cream (got them at the ball I went to). Now have universal drawers & socks, plus a square style check shirt I wear with my uniform as a stock undershirt. I already have a very nice black silk vest made by my mother (Originally made for a young Dr. Jared Potter Kirtland impression), and have also acquired a nice red paisley vest as well. Not sure if wearing that latter vest with the check shirt will be too loud, will have to try and see. I also bought a lovely Wide Awakes cockade that will definitely be part of my early war stuff.

On the Military End:
I of course have the standard overcoat, sack coat, and my riding trousers. Still sporting the Kepi, the oldest bit of my kit at this point, in terms of acquisition. I've got a Cincinnati Depot canteen now (grey wool cover, white canvas strap, and twine stopper retainer), a tarred haversack, a tin cup, two tin plates (one of which is insanely heavy and probably won't take the field much),utensils and a "OVM" waist belt buckle and state seal cartridge box buckle. Some modern-style closure US belt plates too. I've also got a Ohio (-ish) patter untamed haversack on the way. I've also had a custom ID disk made with my medical info on it. Although at this point I have definitely branched at bit from my original intent to just do the CLA (still definitely an impression I want to do, just thinking it'll be a point in whatever my overarching story is of the war ultimately), I still definitely try to do an Ohio specific impression. I'm a proud Buckeye!

Anyways, at this point I am still searching for possibly a wide brimmed hat (maybe Civilian, since it would see the most broad use?), definitely a pleated shirt to go with my Kirtland vest, and a battle shirt based on the CLA (any guess as to it's color?). Of an shoes, definitely shoes. Really hard to find 8 1/2 Brogans for less than an arm & leg.

Thoughts, comments?

*looks both ways* Mom comment..must not impede circulation on his feets..he needs a wide width..*steals away*