Breechldrs Burnside Carbine, Fifth Model

[James N.]

While not a wonderful, pristine specimen, this old warhorse caught my eye at our huge monthly regional flea market and after dickering over several visits, I finally added it to my collection this weekend. According to the seller, when he bought it, it had spent decades in somebody's hot water heater closet, accounting for its less-than-perfect finish and condition! After all that abuse and neglect, it still works!

Unfortunately, the metal surfaces overall have this spotting of raised patches of old rust; the sling swivel and buttplate are completely rusted.

Amazingly, the two inspectors' cartouches are still plain and legible; the barrel was poorly and double-stamped CAST STEEL 186? but looks like a 4 to me:

 

[UCVRelics]

She is still a nice piece. Below is a photo of the cast steel markings which were always weak and the markings above the serial #

 

[James N.]

She is still a nice piece. Below is a photo of the cast steel markings which were always weak and the markings above the serial #
View attachment 332668
View attachment 332669

Unfortunately, mine shows nothing of this mark above the serial # and very little of the Burnside name and address on the lockplate. How exactly did these serial #'s work? There were over 55,000 of these made, so has the first digit been left off? And is there any way to figure out WHEN in 1864 mine might've been made or received?

 

[Lanyard Puller]

SRS lists Burnside #7157 and #7426 as delivered in 08/64 and going to Co. G, 14th Pa. Vol. Cav...
The numbers for early Burnsides have a lot of gaps in the distribution lists, so it might be a stretch to conclude it went to the 14Th..

 

[James N.]

SRS lists Burnside #7157 and #7426 as delivered in 08/64 and going to Co. G, 14th Pa. Vol. Cav...
The numbers for early Burnsides have a lot of gaps in the distribution lists, so it might be a stretch to conclude it went to the 14Th..

Thanks - it at least indicates mine might've seen wartime service, the thing that most interested me. The same seller also has a much nicer Spencer also made and marked by the Burnside Rifle Co., but those weren't delivered before the war was already over, so it only interests me as an example of the type. I'll ask you the same question I asked above - exactly how do these Burnside serial #'s work and should they be read? Also, do you have any suggestions as to how it may be "improved" - I've oiled the stock with linseed oil and lightly scraped at some of the patches of rust; unfortunately, all the screws seem to be firmly frozen in place, and I was afraid to use vinegar or anything else I thought might damage the wood.

 

[UCVRelics]

It definitely saw wartime service and on the SRS even though its the only thing we currently have and until someone takes the time to go to DC and re-research and catalog it, if it ain't listed it ain't listed. On the serial # this model has been described as 5th model (that is erroneous), or 6th model, however either of these designations are collector terms of convenience and not contemporary designations. Serial numbers were reset to zero and number to about 19000, production estimated 1864 and 1865.

 

[Larryh86GT]

I really like the looks of it. A piece showing it's age doesn't distract for me.

 

[byron ed]

...According to the seller, when he bought it, it had spent decades in somebody's hot water heater closet, accounting for its less-than-perfect finish and condition! After all that abuse and neglect, it still works!

...you mean of course in the non-live fire sense, yes?

 

[JPChurch]

Very nice!!!!!!

 

[Stone in the wall]

Jim, Congratulations on your new purchase.

 

[James N.]

...you mean of course in the non-live fire sense, yes?

Yes - the action works smoothly, and as you can see, despite how the outside of the metal looks, the inner workings are all smooth and rust-free, and it even has a good bore, though the grooves are shallow as might be expected. However, I understand that reproduction Burnside cartridges are available for those who reload them, so conceivably live-fire is still a possibility!

 

[James N.]

She is still a nice piece. Below is a photo of the cast steel markings which were always weak and the markings above the serial #
View attachment 332668
View attachment 332669

Amazingly, when I looked for this mark above the serial # last night under a strong 200-watt bulb, I found traces of it; part of BURN and the word MODEL were there, but faintly.

 

[Mnman]

Post redone

 

[Mnman]

Greetings, I'm new to CivilWarTalk and was fortunate to accuire an 1864 Burnside carbine serial number 3448, all the stampings are clear with double cartouches. I would be interested in finding information that I could use to gather Civil War data if any concerning this 4th model Carbine. I will send pictures as soon as I can figure out how to do this. Thank You Mnman

 

[hrobalabama]

A 5th Model. The earlier models saw more service but as a collector, I have only seen 5th Models for sale at CW Gun Shows.
The late 4th and 5th Models had the wood forearm all the earlier ones did not. The problem with the Burnside was the "ice cream cone" bullet which was not good in its design.

 

[James N.]

Greetings, I'm new to CivilWarTalk and was fortunate to accuire an 1864 Burnside carbine serial number 3448, all the stampings are clear with double cartouches. I would be interested in finding information that I could use to gather Civil War data if any concerning this 4th model Carbine. I will send pictures as soon as I can figure out how to do this. Thank You Mnman

Welcome to the forums - I would love to see your photos! It's not hard to post them if you have digital copies and we will be happy to provide instructions should you still need them.

 

[Mnman]

Looks like I got it done.

 

[James N.]

It looks like a beauty - I wish mine had a better finish on the metal parts like yours does.

 

[Texas Johnny]

SRS lists Burnside #7157 and #7426 as delivered in 08/64 and going to Co. G, 14th Pa. Vol. Cav...
The numbers for early Burnsides have a lot of gaps in the distribution lists, so it might be a stretch to conclude it went to the 14Th..

Lanyard Puller, would you check on Burnside serial number 25633? It would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Mnman]

Yes it is in good condition, the man I purchased it from could not give me any information other than his grandfather had it many years in a safe as he did. This must be a hand down from relatives, it would have been great to know the history of this handy little carbine.