Bruce Catton

[Drew]

Who's better, Catton or Foote?

Meet me in the middle, I'd say. Foote is a better story teller, though, IMO. Stories.

 

[James N.]

I'm going to show my ignorance with this question: Who's better, Catton or Foote? I've read Foote's books, but I
haven't read Catton.

Of course Shelby Foote was a Tenneseean, and largely gave the "Southern" viewpoint in Ken Burns' epic documentary. Catton was a Michagander who wrote of listening to the Civil War vets in his hometown sit on the porch of the local GAR Soldiers' Home and talk about the war; unsurprisingly, his writings were often from the Northern viewpoint, like in ( naturally! ) the Army of the Potomac Trilogy and the 3 volumes he wrote about U. S. Grant. But in considering the Big Picture, I always thought him to be fair and reasonable, such as The Civil War Centennial Trilogy and The American Heritage Picture History of the Civil War which was awarded a "Special Pulitzer Prize". He was also Senior Editor of the non-partisan American Heritage Magazine until his death. His early training was as a newspaperman, and it showed in his no-nonsense but evocative writing style, which was erudite and thoughtful, sometimes almost mystical, without being at all pompous or preachy.

 

[John Hartwell]

There are lots of beautiful second-hand editions of Catton available -- they all deserve a good home, and will cost far less than a new reprint would.

Share your love! Adopt!

jno

 

[R. Evans]

There are lots of beautiful second-hand editions of Catton available -- they all deserve a good home, and will cost far less than a new reprint would.

Share your love! Adopt!

jno

I will. Looking forward to getting some of his books.

And to be honest, I've never read Catton. Can I still be a member here?

 

[Dave Wilma]

I'm going to show my ignorance with this question: Who's better, Catton or Foote? I've read Foote's books, but I
haven't read Catton.

Ouch! "Who do you want to live with, children, Mommy or Daddy?"

For facts and scope of coverage, Foote. For language and "feeling," Catton.

 

[James N.]

For facts and scope of coverage, Foote. For language and "feeling," Catton.

Of course, Shelby Foote was "discovered" by Ken Burns and thereby introduced to an all-new audience who could see and hear him as well as read his books. Catton was from a slightly earlier generation, and by the time he helped found American Heritage he had already retired from journalism to devote his time to historical writing. But if you want to get a "feel" for him as both a writer and a speaker, there exists a 30-minute 1983 VHS tape ( and probably a DVD as well ) called Gettysburg - The Final Fury which is jointly narrated by actor Stacey Keatch and Catton shortly before his death. Catton is tweedily dressed as if in Autumn and posed on what may well be the battlefield, and speaks in a low, thoughtful, almost ruminating manner, very different from the distracting, frenetic enthusiasm of Ed Bearss. I'm sure he wrote his own dialog, which gives an insight into the man and his writings.

 

[Complicity]

I'm going to show my ignorance with this question: Who's better, Catton or Foote? I've read Foote's books, but I
haven't read Catton.

Foote wins.

From your perspective, simply compare their narratives of Jenkins Ferry.

 

[cash]

I'm going to show my ignorance with this question: Who's better, Catton or Foote? I've read Foote's books, but I
haven't read Catton.

Do you like apples or do you like oranges? Which is better?

They are both great storytellers. Catton's books are well footnoted and thus are more reliable as sources. I'd say Foote is every bit as good a writer as Catton, and possibly a bit better.

 

[cash]

I will. Looking forward to getting some of his books.

And to be honest, I've never read Catton. Can I still be a member here?

You will be placed on probation pending your reading of Catton.

 

[Yankeedave]

Expired Image Removed
Broooce!

 

[Complicity]

Do you like apples or do you like oranges? Which is better?

They are both great storytellers. Catton's books are well footnoted and thus are more reliable as sources. I'd say Foote is every bit as good a writer as Catton, and possibly a bit better.

My three volumes of the Catton's Centennial history are footnoted, but not abundantly.

Nonetheless, in the era of the Internet the sources of Foote, Catton, or any non-fiction author can be Googled. In general this works to Foote's advantage because lesser writers, historians, and bloggers who are jealous of his success have superciliously criticized his avoidance of footnotes. The Internet makes it comparatively easy to verify the validity of his research.

 

[Mark F. Jenkins]

Nonfiction books without footnotes tend to bother me. Not that it makes me think that the author's making something up, but if there's no trail of breadcrumbs, how do I know where to go to find out more details?

 

[cash]

My three volumes of the Catton's Centennial history are footnoted, but not abundantly. Nonetheless, in the era of the Internet the sources of Foote, Catton, or any non-fiction author can be Googled. In general this works to Foote's advantage because lesser writers, historians, and bloggers who are jealous of his success have superciliously criticized his avoidance of footnotes.

One can speculate on what sources Foote used. But that's it. One knows exactly what sources Catton used and exactly where in those sources the quotes can be found. One can check on Catton's use of those sources. One can't do that with Foote.

My three volumes of the Army of the Potomac are well footnoted. My volumes on Grant are well footnoted. I will disagree with you about the Centennial History. They are well footnoted. Catton's scholarship is well founded. We don't know where Foote got many of his stories. His fertile imagination cannot be discounted.

 

[Complicity]

Nonfiction books without footnotes tend to bother me. Not that it makes me think that the author's making something up, but if there's no trail of breadcrumbs, how do I know where to go to find out more details?

By using Google.

For example, when Foote quotes a CW participant, simply Google the quote. It will take you to his source.

 

[Complicity]

One can speculate on what sources Foote used. But that's it. One knows exactly what sources Catton used and exactly where in those sources the quotes can be found. One can check on Catton's use of those sources. One can't do that with Foote.

My three volumes of the Army of the Potomac are well footnoted. My volumes on Grant are well footnoted. I will disagree with you about the Centennial History. They are well footnoted. Catton's scholarship is well founded. We don't know where Foote got many of his stories. His fertile imagination cannot be discounted.

For those with enough "imagination" to use Google, it is likely that they can discover Foote's original sources. For others...well their epitaphs might appropriately read "Died age 30, buried age 80."

 

[James N.]

One can speculate on what sources Foote used. But that's it. One knows exactly what sources Catton used and exactly where in those sources the quotes can be found. One can check on Catton's use of those sources. One can't do that with Foote... We don't know where Foote got many of his stories. His fertile imagination cannot be discounted.

I have to admit to only finishing the first volume of Foote's The Civil War, but I don't believe he's invented anything out of whole cloth. One would however, do well to remember that Foote started his writing career with novels, including Shiloh, whereas Catton was a trained journalist, possibly more likely to need to be careful with his "facts". Also, by the time of most of his writings he had a staff of assistants, some through the magazine, something I think Foote did not, at least at first.

 

[cash]

For those with enough "imagination" to use Google, it is likely that they can discover Foote's original sources. For others...well their epitaphs might appropriately read "Died age 30, buried age 80."

"Likely" is another word for "speculate." Without Foote actually telling us what his sources were, we can only speculate.

 

[cash]

By using Google.

For example, when Foote quotes a CW participant, simply Google the quote. It will take you to his source.

It will take you to a source. It may or may not be what Foote used.

 

[cash]

I have to admit to only finishing the first volume of Foote's The Civil War, but I don't believe he's invented anything out of whole cloth. One would however, do well to remember that Foote started his writing career with novels, including Shiloh, whereas Catton was a trained journalist, possibly more likely to need to be careful with his "facts". Also, by the time of most of his writings he had a staff of assistants, some through the magazine, something I think Foote did not, at least at first.

I don't know that he invented anything, but since he gave no notes to show where they came from, invention can't be discounted, especially if one has never heard that story anywhere other than Foote.

 

[Complicity]

I have to admit to only finishing the first volume of Foote's The Civil War, but I don't believe he's invented anything out of whole cloth. One would however, do well to remember that Foote started his writing career with novels, including Shiloh, whereas Catton was a trained journalist, possibly more likely to need to be careful with his "facts". Also, by the time of most of his writings he had a staff of assistants, some through the magazine, something I think Foote did not, at least at first.

I have to admit to only finishing the first volume of Foote's The Civil War, but I don't believe he's invented anything out of whole cloth.

Admittedly, Foote's narrative is not free of errors. But, I agree with you in believing he avoided intentionally make anything up. The care with which he undertook the twenty year project can be better understood by anyone willing to watch the three hour interview below.

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/165823-1