World War 1 German POW question

[JCM6395]

Researching my German relatives who served in WW1. My mom said that my grandfather was drafted at 16 and sent to the front (1916). He was captured by the British in 1917 and sent to England to work on a farm for a British couple. Did the British keep detailed records of where they captured POWs, and then sent POWs to work on farms?

He got along very well with the British couple he worked for and at wars end they asked him to stay. But he was a mama boy, according to my mom, so he returned to Germany. Would the British have kept detailed records of his return also?

 

[Schwallanscher]

that's kinda strange as noone was drafted under the age of 18, people could and a lot did volunteer at the age of 17 - lying about one's age would have been a problem given our love for meticulous record-keeping

no idea about your question unfortunately

 

[mcfb50]

I've only started down the path of this research for WWII, and from what I could tell from that war, Red Cross records were the way to go. It looks like those records were mostly destroyed from WWI, though. Still wouldn't hurt to do a search.

http://grandeguerre.icrc.org/

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/...ar-british-hands/#6-first-world-war-1914-1918

 

[JCM6395]

I have found his German WW1 records....he was born in Dec 1899...my mom always said he was drafted at 16. Maybe that is incorrect...although his pictures of him in uniform...he looks about 12...lol. My cousins in Germany are now looking thru his records for me.

 

[MajGenl.Meade]

Edit to add: OH I'm a day late and a dollar short!

http://encyclopedia.1914-1918-online.net/article/prisoners_of_war_and_internees_great_britain

Prisoners found employment in a wide range of occupations, but agriculture dominated, fuelled by fears that the harvest of 1918 could not be gathered due to lack of labour supplies. Although only 16.7 percent of those employed worked in this area in February 1918, the figure had increased to 60.5 percent by November 1918. The growth in the total of German prisoners employed in agriculture resulted from a series of conscious schemes to recruit them. While some lived in working camps, to which they returned at night, others found employment in "migratory gangs" which lived on the farms where they worked. The prisoners certainly seemed to have proved valuable to farmers during 1918. Apart from agriculture, internees found employment in a wide range of other activities. In July 1918 prisoners worked in aerodromes, quarries, timber production, shipyard construction, brick manufacture, cement making, road building and aluminium smelting

I am sure that records were kept, in fact this site contains records of 80% of all prisoners from the belligerent countries and the number is growing as they continue their digitization project. Perhaps it will help:

http://grandeguerre.icrc.org/

 

[JCM6395]

Here is one pic I have of him...looks pretty young.

 

[Schwallanscher]

Here is one pic I have of him...looks pretty young.View attachment 106391

it's kinda getting stranger, as pistols wheren't issued to regular infantry - to me he looks anything between 16 and 22 (a lot of german ww1 photos have that boyish note - also the flowers either denote an early picture of 1914 (they carried flowers in their barrels) or a volunteer (kriegsfreiwilliger)

 

[mcfb50]

I have found his German WW1 records....he was born in Dec 1899...my mom always said he was drafted at 16. Maybe that is incorrect...although his pictures of him in uniform...he looks about 12...lol. My cousins in Germany are now looking thru his records for me.

What a wonderful photo, and I agree he looks about 12!

Have you done any searching through online newspapers? I've been surprised at what details turn up sometimes.

Question--do you know if the record search is easier/faster for those actually doing the search in Germany? I made a request for WWII service records for my grandfather and a great uncle and was told it might take up to a year. I don't know if we'll even be able to see records for the uncle if they are located, as the email I received said permission to access those records would be needed from immediate family and there's no longer immediate family living. The uncle was killed in the Battle of Stalingrad and my grandfather was a prisoner who was released during the war (also near Stalingrad), so I'm not sure why one record requires authorization and the other doesn't.

 

[Schwallanscher]

Question--do you know if the record search is easier/faster for those actually doing the search in Germany? I made a request for WWII service records for my grandfather and a great uncle and was told it might take up to a year.

ww1 is rather bad and ww2 is partly gone (thanks to the usaf), i doubt that they have much about british pow allocation so (maybe post adresses via the irc)

if you want to get information you need a reason: scientific or journalistic research, family etc. those reasons have a ranking. i never found out when or how much the charge.

 

[JCM6395]

Here is a pic where he looks a little bit older.

 

[JCM6395]

What a wonderful photo, and I agree he looks about 12!

Have you done any searching through online newspapers? I've been surprised at what details turn up sometimes.

Question--do you know if the record search is easier/faster for those actually doing the search in Germany? I made a request for WWII service records for my grandfather and a great uncle and was told it might take up to a year. I don't know if we'll even be able to see records for the uncle if they are located, as the email I received said permission to access those records would be needed from immediate family and there's no longer immediate family living. The uncle was killed in the Battle of Stalingrad and my grandfather was a prisoner who was released during the war (also near Stalingrad), so I'm not sure why one record requires authorization and the other doesn't.

I had contacted the Bavarian Archive in Munich. They suggested I try ancestry.com or I could go in person there and search. If they had to look for it they charged a fee. Can't remember how much it was now but don't think it was much.

They also gave me a place to look for the WW2 relatives. I went to Germany in the 1980s and was able to talk thru my mom to 4 uncles who served. I got their info on regiment and division. Even for the one who was killed in the Ukraine at Kiev in 1943.

My one uncle was in the 88th Division which seemed to have went thru hell...like most of the German divisions on the Eastern Front. I think his division was on one of the flanks of Stalingrad but not certain.

 

[Schwallanscher]

I had contacted the Bavarian Archive in Munich. They suggested I try ancestry.com or I could go in person there and search. If they had to look for it they charged a fee. Can't remember how much it was now but don't think it was much.

They also gave me a place to look for the WW2 relatives. I went to Germany in the 1980s and was able to talk thru my mom to 4 uncles who served. I got their info on regiment and division. Even for the one who was killed in the Ukraine at Kiev in 1943.

My one uncle was in the 88th Division which seemed to have went thru hell...like most of the German divisions on the Eastern Front. I think his division was on one of the flanks of Stalingrad but not certain.

my first try would be the militärarchiv in koblenz, freiburg and berlin

https://www.bundesarchiv.de/benutzung/sachbezug/personenbezogen_genealogie/01306/index.html.de

the more data you have the better - you should also offer them copies of your photographs - obviously i don't know whether they have an english version

 

[mcfb50]

I made my request through WASt in January. Good advice to offer photos. I do have some.

I did find confirmation of some family information I had through Volksbund, the German War Graves Commission. For instance I had an old photo of a grave marker, and I was able to identify the location. For another family member it confirmed a date of death and location.

https://www.volksbund.de/en/volksbund.html

 

[Schwallanscher]

I made my request through WASt in January. Good advice to offer photos. I do have some.

I did find confirmation of some family information I had through Volksbund, the German War Graves Commission. For instance I had an old photo of a grave marker, and I was able to identify the location. For another family member it confirmed a date of death and location.

https://www.volksbund.de/en/volksbund.html

yea, but ...

unfortunately - for the purpose of using the volksbund - the guy survived the war

 

[Schwallanscher]

My one uncle was in the 88th Division which seemed to have went thru hell...like most of the German divisions on the Eastern Front. I think his division was on one of the flanks of Stalingrad but not certain.

wiki doesn't mention stalingrad - they normally get that kind of stuff halfway right

 

[Don Dixon]

it's kinda getting stranger, as pistols wheren't issued to regular infantry - to me he looks anything between 16 and 22 (a lot of german ww1 photos have that boyish note - also the flowers either denote an early picture of 1914 (they carried flowers in their barrels) or a volunteer (kriegsfreiwilliger)

The patch/device on his left sleve indicates that he was an expert machine gunner. That might account for the pistol.

Regards,
Don Dixon

 

[JCM6395]

The patch/device on his left sleve indicates that he was an expert machine gunner. That might account for the pistol.

Regards,
Don Dixon

Wow....that confirms one of his records as it listed him as a machine gunner. Thanks for this info about his sleeve patch!!!

 

[JCM6395]

wiki doesn't mention stalingrad - they normally get that kind of stuff halfway right

Thanks for this info!

My uncle Simon Pröll was in the 246th Infantry Regiment of the 88th Division. I currently can't find the info I wrote down on his division's service history on the Russian Front. But I was thinking they were lined up just to the north of the 6th Army at Stalingrad. I believe his division was in the 8th or 9th Army.

 

[Schwallanscher]

Thanks for this info!

My uncle Simon Pröll was in the 246th Infantry Regiment of the 88th Division. I currently can't find the info I wrote down on his division's service history on the Russian Front. But I was thinking they were lined up just to the north of the 6th Army at Stalingrad. I believe his division was in the 8th or 9th Army.

if you call 600 klicks 'just to the north'

http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Gliederungen/Infanteriedivisionen/88ID.htm

sorry it's german

 

[GELongstreet]

...http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Gliederungen/Infanteriedivisionen/88ID.htm ... sorry it's german

Section one means:

Mustered on December 1, 1939 as part of the 6th mobilisation wave on the training area Grafenwöhr by the 13th Military District with support from districts 7 and 17. The division was equippend and armed with Czech material. The 13th companies of the infantry regiments initially were heavy mortar companies.

The division was on leave (recovering) from August 1940 to February 1941.

On December 23, 1941 the infantry regiments each received a (13th) infantry gun company from the 205th infantry division.

In winter 1942/43 the bicycle company was upgraded into Ski-Battalion 188.

On November 2, 1943 the 323rd Divisional Group was subordinated (to the 88th). The unit was transformed into a division of the new model (think they mean the 88th, not the 323rd).

After breaking out of the Tscherkassy enciclement the division was, on order of the organisation department of the OKH on February 1944 (more boring numbers) sent to training area Deba to recuperate until May 15, 1944. It was strenghtened with the remnants of the 309th infantry division. Divisional Group 323 was discontinued; instead the 110th Grenadier Regiment was added.

The division was shattered in January 45 at Baranov (near the Vistula bend) and officially dissolved on March 28.

The other sections should be alright I suppose.