Why did they fight?

[TracyM61]

I do have ideas but want to be sure before I spout off. Thanks

Yes, please do spout off! That way I don't feel all alone, plus you learn a lot when you do...it's kinda fun. And...welcome!!!

 

[Patrick H]

Welcome from Missouri. Your question turns out to be a very controversial one....or perhaps I should say a contentious one. There are MANY members out here who will talk down to you from a high horse and insist that their opinion is the only God given, correct opinion. Don't be dissuaded by them. ...and now you are wondering where I stand on the issue. That's easy: I think you could ask a bunch of soldiers and you'd get a bunch of different answers.

 

[unionblue]

I think you could ask a bunch of soldiers and you'd get a bunch of different answers.

Then inquire of them when their government asked them why they enlisted and if they took note of all their different answers.

 

[major bill]

Welcome from Missouri. Your question turns out to be a very controversial one....or perhaps I should say a contentious one. There are MANY members out here who will talk down to you from a high horse and insist that their opinion is the only God given, correct opinion. Don't be dissuaded by them. ...and now you are wondering where I stand on the issue. That's easy: I think you could ask a bunch of soldiers and you'd get a bunch of different answers.

My problem with this is if one can trust soldiers to give an honest answer. Soldiers love to look like heroes and often talk big. So if asked why they joined, a soldier may well give an answer that is more for show than reality. Soldiers just love to rationalize. I joined because I couldn't find a job becomes I joined to save the American way of life.

 

[Karen Lips]

Hi, I am a newbie and need some info to counter the nay sayers. I believe the Civil War from the Southern political stand point was to preserve slavery and states rights. The hundreds of thousand Southern soldiers that fought for the South were to poor to have slaves or didn't want them so why did they fight for the South? I do have ideas but want to be sure before I spout off. Thanks

I believe they fought because they saw themselves as protecting their homeland.

 

[1SGDan]

Then inquire of them when their government asked them why they enlisted and if they took note of all their different answers.

Once again I will steal a line from the movie MASH.
"How did someone like him end up in the Army?"
"He was drafted".

 

[Drew]

I think you are on to something essential here -- "he did because his country asked him to."

I'm old enough to remember the Vietnam War, and especially the argument over the Draft. Why did 18 year old boys in the US got to Vietnam where they might get killed? Well, it wasn't because they had a deep understanding of the political conflict in Southeast Asia or the broad meaning of the Cold War. It was because their country asked them to (with the back-up threat of coercion if they didn't volunteer -- remember the Vietnam War and both North and South during the Civil War had conscription).

And when we say "country" in this context we use the term in the broad sense. I lived in a very Republican area as a kid, so boys didn't go into the service because they loved and admired LBJ. In many cases, their fathers had entered the service in the 1940s, so there was a communal sense that it was the "turn" of new generation to defend the country. The local community, broadly speaking, supported the war and encouraged their kids to join up.

So I think the social pressure had a lot to do with it.

Also -- Look at Major Bill's comment above. For many, there is a simple assumption that if the country is at war, they will serve. Not too many questions asked.

FWIW, my gg grandfather was among the very few original and surviving members of John Bell Hood's Texas Brigade. His youngest daughter was born in the 19th century and lived into the 1980s. My great grand aunt told three generations of children that her father enlisted in the Confederate Army because he felt it was his duty to do so. It's that simple and there's no reason to read anything more into it than that.

Aunt Dale was a Texan by birth and the concept of 'political correctness' sure as heck almighty had no meaning or application to her. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

 

[Drew]

Independent thinking was not valued in that society, so most who didn't care for the idea of slavery wouldn't have felt comfortable openly communicating it. Even writing it down in a diary could be dangerous, if a family member read it.

"Undeterred, Bill Fletcher made his way back to Liberty (Texas), and it was there that heard a local rancher... was organizing a (Confederate) Company...Bill Fletcher would finally march off to war.

His father never approved of secession. Tom Fletcher reminded his oldest boy, "William, I have long years since seen this had to come and it is a foolish undertaking, as there is no earthly show for Southern success..."

While I have apposed it, the senior Fletcher said, "as it is here, I will say that you are doing the only honorable thing and that is defending your country."

So, yeah, people did in fact write stuff down.

Source: Hood's Texas Brigade, Susannah Ural, LSU Press, 2017, p. 19

 

[8thFlorida]

It is my opinion only that if Buchanan abandoned the Fort it could have helped avoid the war. Other demands could have been met possibly. The war was also about other things such as cotton and tobacco supply to the North.
http://www.abrahamlincolnsclassroom.org/abraham-lincoln-in-depth/abraham-lincoln-and-cotton/

 

[Copperhead-mi]

It is my opinion only that if Buchanan abandoned the Fort it could have helped avoid the war. Other demands could have been met possibly. The war was also about other things such as cotton and tobacco supply to the North.
http://www.abrahamlincolnsclassroom.org/abraham-lincoln-in-depth/abraham-lincoln-and-cotton/

I disagree. Cotton and tobacco supply were not causes of the War but were most certainly concerns for some businessmen in the North once the war commenced. The Federal government did allow some trade between the lines involving these items during the war.

 

[8thFlorida]

I disagree. Cotton and tobacco supply were not causes of the War but were most certainly concerns for some businessmen in the North once the war commenced. The Federal government did allow some trade between the lines involving these items during the war.

Who was used to grow the cotton for the Northern factories? Slaves. The North needed cotton and the South needed slaves to meet the demand. Doesn't make it right but both sides were complicit in slavery. The common denominator was Cotton.

 

[Copperhead-mi]

Who was used to grow the cotton for the Northern factories? Slaves. The North needed cotton and the South needed slaves to meet the demand. Doesn't make it right but both sides were complicit in slavery. The common denominator was Cotton.

I disagree that this was the cause of the war. This is going off-topic and there are numerous threads available through use of the Search feature that discuss the causes of the war.

 

[Glen_C]

My problem with this is if one can trust soldiers to give an honest answer. Soldiers love to look like heroes and often talk big. So if asked why they joined, a soldier may well give an answer that is more for show than reality. Soldiers just love to rationalize. I joined because I couldn't find a job becomes I joined to save the American way of life.

Hi
<side bar>
I don't mean to get too personal but I have to ask about your own service, if you in fact did. I do note your avatar, so I can assume you did. If so, why did you enlist and serve?

I did grow up with the Vietnam war in a private militaristic secondary school. So one could say I was trained but never served. I am a 1954 model and learned ping pong from a one handed adviser back in 1962. So, I was a little young then but could have enlisted ten years later.
</end side bar>

To the ACW topic

I find the ACW debate wholly different from other US conflicts but the states had some standing militias leaning one side or the other, I think part of the State's Rights argument, in part, does relate to those standing militias.

I feel many may look at the Confederacy while entirely looking at cotton farming and slavery with a post earlier listing 33% of the southern homes owning slaves. If true, that means there were 67% of the households that did not. Let's wonder, if we must, about the loyalty of that 67% of households and why those families went to war.

I can find but one instance of my surname associated with slavery, with a preponderance of my paternal ancestors enlisted with the south. At the same time, several in the same state enlisted with the north.

Chees

GC

 

[Story]

My problem with this is if one can trust soldiers to give an honest answer. Soldiers love to look like heroes and often talk big. So if asked why they joined, a soldier may well give an answer that is more for show than reality. Soldiers just love to rationalize. I joined because I couldn't find a job becomes I joined to save the American way of life.

...and your experience with soldiers is exactly that - yours, within the distance of your sight and over the breadth of whatever time you spent in uniform (Desert Storm +/-, from the chocolate chips in your pic).

Some men are certainly guilty of your accusations, many more are not. Thinking you can speak for the majority of them is a bit libelous. In fact, you just crapped on the reputations of all of your former comrades.

What's up with that?

Conversely, I've found an entire range of motivations with the silent majority having the more noble reasons [from men I served with/alongside over 22 years and veterans, both American and foreign].

Most of them

*JUST*

*DON'T*

*TALK*

*ABOUT*

*IT*

Furthermore, while there are always historical constants the world view of 20th century troops isn't the same as mid-19th century troops. Presuming you know how they all (or even a majority) thought - based on your own experiences - is a bedpan full of self-generated hubris.

 

[ikesdad]

The Major is correct, sir. I spent over 20 years in both the Navy and Air Force and can attest to what he stated. They will give the answer that they think one wants to hear.

 

[Viper21]

The Major is correct, sir. I spent over 20 years in both the Navy and Air Force and can attest to what he stated. They will give the answer that they think one wants to hear.

Again, that may be true for some but, certainly not an absolute for everyone. People join the military, & or fight for different reasons. Coming from a family with at least one member from every generation dating back to the American Revolution serving, I felt compelled to serve from the time I was a little boy. Oddly enough, I had zero pressure to serve from my immediate family members. I was raised by a single Mom. She was shocked, & cried when I told her I had enlisted. She didn't understand why I wanted to serve. I just felt it was my duty, & I wanted to experience what those before me had.

I have 3 sons. All 3 are on active duty. They all joined the Marine Corps (I was Army). My oldest, after 4yrs in the Marines, switched to the Army & is currently in the 82nd Airborne. My younger 2 are Marines. As hard as it may be to believe, I didn't pressure any of them to join the military, & tried hard to talk my youngest out of it...lol. I was really hoping for him to go to college. He said he may still but, wanted to serve as enlisted man as so many of his family members have. Of the 3, only my youngest has any understanding of current politics. My oldest 2 boys have next to no interest in politics & couldn't tell you who the Governor of VA is, much less discuss major political topics with a remote understanding of either side.

What's my point ? Many people enlist in the military for their own since of honor, pride, sense of duty, etc.. I joined during peace time (late 80's), & served during wartime. My boys all joined during active wartime. All of us (at the time) without much, if any, understanding of the politics of it all.

It doesn't take much for me to imagine some of the same thoughts, or personal feelings coming from my own ancestors, & or their neighbors.

 

[major bill]

I will use my own G-G-grandfather for an example. He joined the Union Army in 1863 and ended up dieing in Missouri. Why did he feel compelled to join? Well he left not letters so we must attempt to guess.

1. He felt very strongly about freeing the slaves as is evident by him joining once freeing the slaves became a goal. This is possible but there is no proof.

2. He joined out of a desire to save the Union. Fine but why did he not join in 1861 or 1862?

3. He joined to avoid the shame of being drafted. Maybe, but how would I know.

4. By 1863 the enlistment bonus convinced he to join. So did he joined for the money?

5. He wanted to join at the start of the War but needed to support his family. The enlistment bonus simply allowed him to join.

My family could argue about why he joined but in reality we can not know. I would love to believe he joined to free the slaves and the enlistment bonus did not play any part. However my desire to believe plays no part in why he joined.

 

[OpnCoronet]

To the ACW topic
I feel many may look at the Confederacy while entirely looking at cotton farming and slavery with a post earlier listing 33% of the southern homes owning slaves. If true, that means there were 67% of the households that did not. Let's wonder, if we must, about the loyalty of that 67% of households and why those families went to war.
I can find but one instance of my surname associated with slavery, with a preponderance of my paternal ancestors enlisted with the south. At the same time, several in the same state enlisted with the north.
Chees

All those who fought for and supported the war for southern(slave states) independence, were fighting and supporting a gov't of slave states, that guaranteed the right to own slaves to any of its citizens, if they chose. In other words, Slavery was the common thread that united all slave states of the confederacy in their war for independence, i.e., successful war for confederate independence guaranteed slavery, no matter the personal reasons of any of its participants

 

[Will Carry]

Welcome to the forum and that is a great question. I think they fought for different reasons. Some joined the ranks in a patriotic fervor. Some join because they had never been away from home further than they could walk and they wanted an adventure. Many joined out of peer pressure and fear of being labeled a coward. Some were drafted. Some went because the women pressured them. I don't think there were as many men who joined to preserve slavery as one might think, although many were afraid of the prospect of having 6 million free people looking for work.

 

[OpnCoronet]

Welcome to the forum and that is a great question. I think they fought for different reasons. Some joined the ranks in a patriotic fervor. Some join because they had never been away from home further than they could walk and they wanted an adventure. Many joined out of peer pressure and fear of being labeled a coward. Some were drafted. Some went because the women pressured them. I don't think there were as many men who joined to preserve slavery as one might think, although many were afraid of the prospect of having 6 million free people looking for work.

But, the States Right of every citizen of the confederacy to own slaves, was the only guaranteed reason for the states fighting, no matter any other personal reason's of any individual.