Tracking down L.W.

[ConfederateCanuck]

Hi folks. I know there are some incredibly talented people on the Forum that can track down obscure information....so I will ask you all for some help tracking down L.W., the man that pinned in his initials into the left side of my P1853 Enfield.

I know there must have been literally thousands of soldiers with those initials, so I am NOT under the illusion that I will EVER identify the specific soldier ....but it would be great to see a list and know that one of those men on the list may have carried that musket. First of all, can anyone tell me how many soldiers had those initials? Where can I go look up their names and their regiments?

Of course, some will say that the initials could have been pinned in after the war, but I have a feeling that's not the case (or maybe its just wishful thinking).

This photo shows the "pinned in" initials (i.e. it looks like a pin was used to make the individual dots that form the letters LW).

 

[UCVRelics]

how many soldiers had those initials

there will be thousands of them. I have had them with 3 initials and could not track them down. IMHO it will be just about impossible.

 

[Fairfield]

I'm very much afraid that @ucvrelics is right. Do you have any idea as to the state? There were 2078 men with those initials in the Confederate army and 5712 more in the Union army.

 

[ConfederateCanuck]

I'm very much afraid that @ucvrelics is right. Do you have any idea as to the state? There were 2078 men with those initials in the Confederate army and 5712 more in the Union army.

Well, I thank you for answering the question about the number of men. As I said, I expected thousands and I know its impossible to find the guy. If I knew where to look up their information, I'd spend some time looking through the list. I am curious, nothing more.

Great information...heartfelt thanks.

No idea about state....again I am not trying to establish provenance of my Enfield to 1 soldier...but its kewl to know he might be one of those 7 thousand.

No definitive evidence of whether the gun is Union or Confederate (no state markings, no JS Anchor, etc), but the Birmingham manufacturers names on key parts align with one of the Top 5 suppliers of Enfields to the Confederacy. So, maybe...maybe...the list of 2,000 Confederate soldiers is the list I should look at first.

 

[ConfederateCanuck]

Forgot to say...a list of 2,078 (or even 7,000) is way better than a list of 1-2 million ACW soldiers.

 

[UCVRelics]

Forgot to say...a list of 2,078 (or even 7,000) is way better than a list of 1-2 million ACW soldiers.

Not really as you will never know. I put it the category of "Things that make you go HUM"

 

[ConfederateCanuck]

Not really as you will never know. I put it the category of "Things that make you go HUM"

Yes, agreed...one can only wonder, but never really know. I do find the speculation interesting, though.

 

[UCVRelics]

Yes, agreed...one can only wonder, but never really know. I do find the speculation interesting, though.

I could not find this one on a Cook & Bros cavalry carbine that was part of the Alabama contract and it was 3 letters and he was cavalry to boot

 

[ConfederateCanuck]

I'm very much afraid that @ucvrelics is right. Do you have any idea as to the state? There were 2078 men with those initials in the Confederate army and 5712 more in the Union army.

Where did you get these numbers? Is there a website that lists all the soldiers names? Is this website freely accessible by the public? I'd love to be able to access this. Since you were able to pull the numbers so quickly it sounds like there may be various search functions to simplify database searches.

 

[Fairfield]

Where did you get these numbers? Is there a website that lists all the soldiers names? Is this website freely accessible by the public? I'd love to be able to access this. Since you were able to pull the numbers so quickly it sounds like there may be various search functions to simplify database searches.

I took it from Historical Data Systems which has a nominal subscription ($25). It is possible to search by unit and by name. I used the latter, truncating both fore- and surname to the initial letter--first for all Confederate and then for all Union.

 

[lupaglupa]

Where did you get the gun? If you knew something of it's history that might help you narrow things down. Likely not to a specific soldier but maybe the side.

 

[Package4]

Forgot to say...a list of 2,078 (or even 7,000) is way better than a list of 1-2 million ACW soldiers.

Not necessarily, many went by their given name on the muster rolls, but went by middle or nick name, so you might add another couple of thousand. So maybe 10,000+ possibilities. I have always tended to think the pinned markings were northern as they were less conspicuous. There was a beautifully pinned musket in the visitor's center at Monocacy, complete with Corps insignia.

 

[ConfederateCanuck]

Where did you get the gun? If you knew something of it's history that might help you narrow things down. Likely not to a specific soldier but maybe the side.

No story came with the musket. The names of the Birmingham manufacturers suggests Confederate, but the muskets could also have been captured from the blockade runners...less likely but still a possibility. There will never be a definitive provenance for it.

 

[ConfederateCanuck]

Not necessarily, many went by their given name on the muster rolls, but went by middle or nick name, so you might add another couple of thousand. So maybe 10,000+ possibilities. I have always tended to think the pinned markings were northern as they were less conspicuous. There was a beautifully pinned musket in the visitor's center at Monocacy, complete with Corps insignia.

Was pinning common? Do you have a picture of that musket?

The date on the lockplate is 1862. Is it fair to say that most 1862s were Confederate? They had locked up most of the Birmingham manufacturing capacity early in the war.

 

[Package4]

No story came with the musket. The names of the Birmingham manufacturers suggests Confederate, but the muskets could also have been captured from the blockade runners...less likely but still a possibility. There will never be a definitive provenance for it.

Unless there are specific marks on the piece just a BSA or BSAT means nothing as they supplied to both sides.

 

[Package4]

Was pinning common? Do you have a picture of that musket?

The date on the lockplate is 1862. Is it fair to say that most 1862s were Confederate? They had locked up most of the Birmingham manufacturing capacity early in the war.

No it could be either, you would need to find inspector and importation marks, in fact the North imported just as many from the BSA as did the South.

 

[Package4]

Was pinning common? Do you have a picture of that musket?

The date on the lockplate is 1862. Is it fair to say that most 1862s were Confederate? They had locked up most of the Birmingham manufacturing capacity early in the war.

The North did not need to import mid to later in the war as their manufacturing caught up, but early on they grabbed what they could get and had ready currency.

 

[Package4]

What are some of the other marks on the gun?

 

[ConfederateCanuck]

My Enfield was made in 1862 by one of the Top 5 suppliers of Enfields to the Confederacy. Various manufacturers of key components include W&C Scott (a Top 5 supplier) and William Hilsley (allso associated with Confederate Enfields). Its a .577 (25 gauge) rather than the Union preference for .58s (24 gauge). There is a "James" in the ramrod channel might belong to C.W. James, another Top 5 Confederate supplier according to The English Connection (page 54; ..."C.W. James and W&C Scott...probably the most prolific Birmingham suppliers to the Confederacy"). There is a "J. Sutton" too in the ramrod channel but that might be the "setter up" guy ... no clear link to Confederate suppliers.

T&CG on the ramrod spoon...also associated with Confederate Enfields.

BURR on the underside of the barrel but I have no idea if there is a Confederate association.

No way to say Confederate for sure, but there is some Confederate "smoke".

 

[Package4]

My Enfield was made in 1862 by one of the Top 5 suppliers of Enfields to the Confederacy. Various manufacturers of key components include W&C Scott (a Top 5 supplier) and William Hilsley (allso associated with Confederate Enfields). Its a .577 (25 gauge) rather than the Union preference for .58s (24 gauge). There is a "James" in the ramrod channel might belong to C.W. James, another Top 5 Confederate supplier according to The English Connection (page 54; ..."C.W. James and W&C Scott...probably the most prolific Birmingham suppliers to the Confederacy"). There is a "J. Sutton" too in the ramrod channel but that might be the "setter up" guy ... no clear link to Confederate suppliers.

T&CG on the ramrod spoon...also associated with Confederate Enfields.

No way to say Confederate for sure, but there is some Confederate "smoke".

Those manufacturers sold to both sides, you would still need import inspectors marks JS, IC, or other, if it were an E.P. Bond then you would be in the ballpark. The North almost exclusively imported Enfields in .577.