The Search for Heroes

[CSA Today]

At long last, Bobby, a voice of reason. There is one thing that all but a few can agree on.

Wait for a few to rejoice in the unknown soldier's death.

I hope there is no one here that insensitive.

"The South is not ashamed of the Lost Cause, which can never be lost as long as men preach patriotism, glorify valor, and worship sacrifice."

Reverend James S. Vance, 1897

 

[DixieRifles]

I'm trying to follow this thread to see where its going. It seems to focus ONLY on Southern deserters. Hmm. Well, most Southerners tend to believe their family hero had chores to attend to and a brief AWOL is understandable. Maybe partially true.

One of the most interesting deserters that I came across was one trooper in my ancestor's regiment(note my avatar). William A. McCane was a member of Company I, 5th Mississippi Cavalry Regiment organized in summer of 1863 and assigned to General Chalmers' cavalry division. His service records listed him as deserted on Feb 15, 1864. The next couple of cards in his records show him as held in prison in Memphis and then in April as deceased. Maybe he died of mis-treatment; or maybe he surrendered in February due to sickness or wounds.

Why is this soldier of interest to me?
William A. McCane was also recorded under the name of William Alexander McCain who had owned a large plantation near Greenwood, MS, and owned 52 slaves. After the war, the 1870 census shows his widow residing at their home along with his 20-year old son, John McCain. This John McCain would produce a famous lineage of Navy admirals and captains.

John Sidney McCain (b. Mississippi, 1851 – d. 1934) had a son John Sidney "Slew" McCain Sr. (August 9, 1884 – September 6, 1945), who was the first father-son pair ever to achieve four star admiral rank in the U.S. Navy. Admiral McCain was a pioneer of aircraft carrier operations, who in 1942 commanded all land-based air operations in support of the Guadalcanal campaign, and who ultimately in 1944–1945 aggressively led the Fast Carrier Task Force in the Pacific Ocean theater of World War II. He died four days after the formal Japanese surrender ceremony.

His son was John Sidney "Jack" McCain Jr. (January 17, 1911 – March 22, 1981) who was a United States Navy admiral who served in conflicts from the 1940s through the 1970s.
The great-grandson of the cavalry deserter was John Sidney McCain III (born August 29, 1936). John was a Navy Captain and naval aviator who was shot down and captured in Viet Nam. He later became the senior US Senator from Arizona. He was the Republican presidential nominee in the 2008 United States election.

A family of heroes descended from one deserter.

Steve

 

[CSA Today]

Colonel Henry King Burgwyn, Jr. 26th NC

"Advancing at the head of his regiment, Colonel Burgwyn personally led his men across an exposed wheat field swept by enemy artillery and musketry. Coming under a heavy converging fire of shot and shell, Colonel Burgwyn relentlessly pushed his command into the thick briars and underbrush along Willoughby run and despite momentary confusion in the ranks, reformed his line in good order on the other side, carrying the first enemy line after a sharp fight. In the desperate battle for McPherson's Woods that followed, with the lines sometimes less than twenty paces apart, Colonel Burgwyn remained at the center of the maelstrom. Knowing that his entire color guard had either been killed or wounded and despite witnessing the instant death of a volunteer colorbearer and the subsequent wounding of another, Colonel Burgwyn nevertheless grabbed the flagstaff, and with the words, 'dress on the colors,' ran toward the enemy. After turning to hand the colors to yet another brave volunteer as his men surged forward, Colonel Burgwyn fell mortally wounded. In his last moments, hearing that his regiment had broken the second enemy line. He uttered, 'I know my gallant regiment will do their duty -- where is my sword?"

GG Grandfather John M. Carlisle -- Chaplain 7th SC Inf.
GG Uncle James H. Carlisle – signer of SC Ordinance of Secession
G Grandfather Nathaniel L. McCormick—Private, Battery E 40th [3rd] N C Artillery
G Grandfather Thomas M. Bolton – Private, Co. G 19th Va. Inf.
G Uncle Dougald McCormick--Private Co. D 46th NC Inf.
G Uncle Duncan McCormick – Private, NC Home Guard
G Uncle Alexander Mc Cormick –1st Sgt, Co. B 6th Ms Inf.
G Uncle Murdoch McCormick—Private, Ms Home Guard
G Uncle James W. Bolton – Private, Co. B (Rives) Nelson Light Artillery (Va.), 1864 Co. G, 19th Va. Inf.
G Uncle Albert G. Bolton – Private, Co. F 27th Va. Inf.
G Uncle Alexander H. Bolton – Private, Co. D 7th Va. Inf.
G Uncle Lindsey C. Bolton – Private, Co. B. 1st Va. Reserves
G Uncle Thomas D. Boone – Captain,. Co. F 1st NC Inf.
G. Uncle James D. Boone -- Quartermaster sergeant, Co. F 1st NC Inf.
G Uncle John W. Boone -- Private, Co. D 59th (4th Cav.) NC, 1st NC Inf. Co. F
G Uncle Peter Lindsey Breeden—Captain, Co. E, 4th SC Cav.
G Uncle A.J. Breeden – Private, Co. E. 4th SC Cav.
Cousins –Daniel McKinnon, Luther McKinnon, John N. McKinnon, McKay McKinnon, Murdoch McKinnon -- all privates in Company E 40th (3rd) NC artillery [heavy]

 

[rpkennedy]

Pickett's Division understandably suffered from a great deal of desertion after Gettysburg. Apparently, according to Kathy Georg Harrison and her partner in "Nothing But Glory", many of the missing drifted away from the army during the retreat to return home. I'll have to look it up but I think she says that many of them returned before winter.

R

 

[Republican Blues]

I hope there is no one here that insensitive.

"The South is not ashamed of the Lost Cause, which can never be lost as long as men preach patriotism, glorify valor, and worship sacrifice."

Reverend James S. Vance, 1897

So far it would seem not, but I do know of a photograph of Union dead at Andersonville, on FB, that had a comment of "fertilizer"........that nearly made me swear off EVER doing a Confederate impression ever again

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

I've been lost the last few days reading Elijah Hunt Rhode's diary, yes I realize most Yank types here have already read it. I'd actually recommend it to the 'Other Side' , too! He's 'All for The Union', of course, although does not tend to go into long-winded, anti-South diatribes. Elijah writes of MANY heroic actions he witnesses personally during his career by soldiers in both armies, downplays some of his own unbelievable actions. He's one of the heros, saving his men quite a few times with no regard for his own neck. If this single diary/journal contains so many incidents of true heroism along one man's path, can you imagine how many actually took place, day to day? Lost in history now, but they're there.

One of the reasons it's taking me so LONG to get through this, is I'll stop on one of these heros and go look up 'Whateverhappenedtohim'. Some died, some made it through- it transpires none of these heroic deeds were singular-these people just DID this kind of thing. Rhodes really does give equal respect to Confederate soldiers and equal disdain to Union men who fall short, like one he mentions hung for spying. Yes, he's extremely solid on his reasons for being a Union man, no bones about it, he just has much respect for a solid, brave and smart soldier on either side. He never says 'hero', doesn't have to.

The desertion records I'd have think would be equal, pretty much. Be tough to slam a man for doing so, too-can't imagine being rocketed out of normal, everyday life into one which featured getting shot at for a living with zero previous experience. It must have just been too much for some, bottom line. I just looked up a record for a friend, whose relative paid a substitute in the draft. The substitute deserted! I wonder what on earth happens in that case?

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

And REALLY??? Fertilizer? That much nauseating, despicable, hatred this many years afterwards? That is as awful now as it would have been 150 years ago. It's also more than a little creepy- you could be say, in Walmart next to one of these cretins and never know it. Ok, maybe the smell would be an indication.

 

[ole]

And REALLY??? Fertilizer? That much nauseating, despicable, hatred this many years afterwards? That is as awful now as it would have been 150 years ago. It's also more than a little creepy- you could be say, in Walmart next to one of these cretins and never know it. Ok, maybe the smell would be an indication.

"They" are out there. Fortunately, our Confederates are not cretins and do present supported arguments. Now and then we get a hit, but "they" don't last long ... something about their inability to remain civil.

Sides are respected here, and rational arguments. It remains that this is a civil Civil War discussion board.

 

[DanF]

Any of the Confederates that actually stayed and fought despite continual near starvation, lack of clothing and footwear etc. and are deserving of respect.

I can even understand many of the deserters who did not desert from cowardice but largely because of the pleading letters from home telling them how their wife and children were starving and had no clothing except rags to wear.

I have no fondness for the Confederate cause but I can and do respect the courage and sacrifice of the individuals who fought in it's army.

 

[CSA Today]

Desertion was certainly a problem for both armies with most of the focus, on this forum at least, with Confederate desertion. One vociferous Northern poster replied that I had to be making up a local story about Federal deserter asking a lady (Mrs. Kate McNeil) for food then leaving his rifle propped up against a tree. The descendant of Mrs. McNeil (Newtons) still have the rifle unless they fairly recently sold it. The poster's reasoning that the story couldn't be true was that "Sherman's Army by that time of the war wasn't having an issue w/ desertion." It is probably true that Sherman's men didn't desert in as great a numbers as Grant's AOP at the same time, but then too there was no reason considering who Sherman was fighting, on his march through Georgia and the Carolinas, and who Grant was fighting in Virginia. But given the rate of Federal desertion for 1864- 1865, I for one don't have problem believing Sherman had at least one to desert from his army.

J.G. Randall and David Donald 's footnote 28 on the bottom of Pages 329 and 330 of their Civil War and Reconstruction write:

(28) On September 11, 1865 the provost marshall general estimated the total number of desertions from the army to be 195, 255, not including drafted men who failed to report. Offic.Rec., V, 109. On December 31, 1865,it was stated that 278, 644 desertions had been reported, but many of those reported had been sick on the march, injured without official knowledge, or otherwise justifiably absent. According to the same report the monthly desertions in 1863 averaged 4,647; in 1n 1864 they averaged 7333. Ibid., 757-758. See Shannon, II, 179n., and, for a general treatment of the whole subject, Ella Lonn, Desertions during the Civil War.

 

[ExNavyPilot]

I might be off track a bit in not talking about desertion, but I understood the topic of this thread to be the inclination of many people to avoid the warts and pimples of history, especially family history, and to sugar-coat their findings. The article on desertion was intended to point out that not all our ancestors were always heroic.

In my genealogy research, especially dealing with my Civil War ancestors, I tend to appreciate finding the facts no matter where they lead. None of my ancestors were Generals--far from it--the highest ranking of them actually made Corporal. A couple lasted only a few weeks after mustering and then were discharged for disease or other medical issues. A couple more didn't enlist unitl the summer of 1864; perhaps the $1,000 bounty had something to do with their new-found patriotism. One of my GGGrandfathers was evidently involved in an altercation with some of his company-mates against some civilians in Wisconsin (during the draft riot period), apparently off-duty; one soldier and one civilian were killed. My relative was one of a half-dozen men who wer court martialled, but luckily he was acquitted. At the end of the war he ended up being detailed as a cook in a military hospital in KY.

A couple of ancestors actually did something rather heroic, though in very minor ways. One saved a comrade, who was shot through the lungs, by carrying him off the field after their position was overrun at Chickamauga. The other got typhoid fever in camp in Missouri not long after mustering in, then developed gangrene and had several toes amputated. He was offered but refused a medical discharge. After healing and setting off to rejoin his unit, he got smallpox. After he finally recovered and rejoined his unit, he fought at Prairie Grove and Vicksburg, reenlisted, then fought at Ft Blakely (Mobile), and then was sent to Texas to watch Maximilian's activities across the Mexican border, not mustering out until May 1866. Oh, and when he initially enlisted he said he was 19, but was really 16.

This, to me, is real history. You can keep the glory and the parades and the fancy dress uniforms and the ubermensch heroics. I like it the way it normally comes; messy, conflicted, ambiguous....real.

 

[DixieRifles]

everyday life into one which featured getting shot at for a living with zero previous experience.

In preparation for anniversary of Shiloh, I'm re-reading "Shiloh Bloody April". There were several Union regiments answered the long drum roll having never fired their gun or never marched in formation. Some stood their ground as long as they could endure; others ran at the sight of long rows of butternut clad troops.

My favorite example is the 13 Light Ohio Artillery. They were still getting accustomed to their equipment when their commanders ordered them to a position 150 yards in front of the Union line. The first incoming round blew up one of their limbers. The entire battalion fled.

Is this desertion? Seems like some commanders should have been put on trial ----more than just lost of commission.

Steve

 

[BillO]

In preparation for anniversary of Shiloh, I'm re-reading "Shiloh Bloody April". There were several Union regiments answered the long drum roll having never fired their gun or never marched in formation. Some stood their ground as long as they could endure; others ran at the sight of long rows of butternut clad troops.

My favorite example is the 13 Light Ohio Artillery. They were still getting accustomed to their equipment when their commanders ordered them to a position 150 yards in front of the Union line. The first incoming round blew up one of their limbers. The entire battalion fled.

Is this desertion? Seems like some commanders should have been put on trial ----more than just lost of commission.

Steve

I don't think thats desertion. That 's called making a rapid retrograde movement. Really though if they got their stuff back together and went back in it could and should have been overlooked.

 

[ole]

They weren't the only ones to run.

 

[Diana9]

This, to me, is real history. You can keep the glory and the parades and the fancy dress uniforms and the ubermensch heroics. I like it the way it normally comes; messy, conflicted, ambiguous....real.

Giving your post a "like" didn't seem adequate. Wanted to say "I love your post."

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

There are SO many posts to like, plus I'm sure I looked like an idiot while scrolling down, running the gamut of all the emotions, from mad/sad/laugh/sorrow-hope no one was watching. The 'rapid retrograde movement' made me laugh out loud and scare the dog just now. I am SURE many troops were alive at the end of the war through deploying that one!

Yes, when I joined here, it seemed clear no one was truly re-fighting any of the 'causes'that way, not to the point of 'fertlizer'. Reading first hand accounts, written as they happened, it didn't seem there were even many then. If someone is going to be shocking, they're going to be shocking no matter which side they're on or what century they live in. Those are the kinds of unspeakable things said for effect. You do wonder, too, if the 21st century person who wrote that would last 10 minutes on an 1800's battlefield. I'm thinking no. Big talk for sitting in front of a computer on a soft posterier.

 

[Republican Blues]

You do wonder, too, if the 21st century person who wrote that would last 10 minutes on an 1800's battlefield. I'm thinking no. B

I agree, much less in such a place as Andersonville, or Elmira, Camp Douglas, Florence, Salsbury, Belle Isle, Fort Delware, Camp Chase, Etc Etc Et

 

[Bob Owen]

No sane person today would stand to be slaughtered!

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

I have almost zero 'spare' time at the moment, just managed to finish Elijah Hunt Rhode's diary. Gosh. I did keep getting distracted with battles, people and events and then going to look them up so this book- took forever and ever. He wrote of 2 seperate instances of desertion in the Union army, both with consequences which were TOUGH. One death another I think hard larbour for years? It's possible as the war wore on, the North had the ability to follow up with their discipline, detailing men to these squads of capture. It's a heck of a deterant- death. The South suffered from lack of resources across the board, I'm guessing may not have been able to follow up on their deserters so determindly?My point being it could have been just plain less risky to leave one army after a certain point.

It was odd. You catch a whiff of compassion from this battle hardened veteran, in the closing days of the war when Rebel deserters came acrosss the lines.

This book made me deeply thoughtful. It's forward is great, where the author states that Rhodes writes without the flowing rhetoric of later years found in other war reminincences. His pages on Gettysburg, for instance make the hair on the back of your neck stand on end. SO many men just walking into death- you know quite honestly they were all heros. Gives you the chills.

 

[CSA Today]

Private William J. Barbee (circa. 1838—18 January 1864)

1st Texas Infantry, C.S.A.
Battle of Gettysburg, Pennsylvania
2 July 1863

"Although detailed as a courier to the division commander, Private Barbee joined his regiment near Devil's Den during the hottest part of the engagement. Eager for action, Private Barbee climbed a high prominent rock and with wounded compatriots passing him loaded muskets, opened fire on the enemy. Although dangerously exposed to a storm of enemy fire by his defiant, erect stance on the rock, Private Barbee continued to discharge his weapons until knocked from his position by a bullet to his right leg. Despite his wound, he promptly re-climbed the rock and continued to fire at the enemy. Moments later, a bullet to the left leg tumbled him from his perch, but again he crawled to the top of the rock and fought on. After having fired more than two dozen rounds, a third more, serious wound to the body knocked Private Barbee into a crevice where despite his cries for aid so that he might continue the fight, he lay trapped on his back until freed at the battle's end. His reckless example of brazen valor solidified the battle line during the height of the fighting and remained an inspiration to his comrades for the rest of their lives."

Source: Gregg S. Clemmer, Valor in Gray, The Recipients of the Confederate Medal of Honor, p.35