Shoulder stocked beauties!

[Rusk County Avengers]

Last weekend I attempted a virtual tour of the Mason-Dixon Line military museum in Jefferson, TX, and these two beauties were brought out of the vault to share here for everyone to enjoy.

https://civilwartalk.com/threads/mason-dixon-line-museum-jefferson-tx.173940/

The owner of the museum, Tom Moss was present with me at "CWT Invades Vicksburg" last fall and made waves, and CWT has touched him so, lots of stuff from museum not normally on display, or on display will get brought out from time to time to take pictures of and share here.

But on to the guns!!! These were taken with my phone camera, and I'm still getting used to it so I apologize if they're not the best. In the future I see me taking a light and maybe a digital camera to get better pictures.

Before anyone gets too excited, the Dragoon isn't what it seems....

Its a Brevette Colt Dragoon from Belgium. From the CW era though. The apparent Beaumont-Adams revolver is mint, but it being shoulder stocked and some other details make it a headscratcher.

Hmmm, serial number didn't come out well. I'm not sure I like the camera on my new phone because its a lot clearer there than here!

Feel free to leave comments, I'm curious to hear everyone's thoughts, especially on the Adams revolver! (Which I wish I was allowed to shoot, even if stupid due to its condition and all.)

 

[Rusk County Avengers]

Also I may try to enhance and clear up some of these pictures on my computer later.

 

[Jeff in Ohio]

That is not a Beaumont Adams revolver; it is a Webley Wedge Frame revolver or sometimes called a Webley-Bentley revolver, a less expensive revolver than the one-piece frame Adams. These were made by many Birmingham makers, often not marked with the maker. Were the proofs on this the London proofs with a Crown over a letter V and Crown over letter P, or the cross-scepter mark of a Birmingham proof?
The stocking was likely a post-factory addition.

 

[Rusk County Avengers]

That is not a Beaumont Adams revolver; it is a Webley Wedge Frame revolver or sometimes called a Webley-Bentley revolver, a less expensive revolver than the one-piece frame Adams. These were made by many Birmingham makers, often not marked with the maker. Were the proofs on this the London proofs with a Crown over a letter V and Crown over letter P, or the cross-scepter mark of a Birmingham proof?
The stocking was likely a post-factory addition.

Shows how much I know of English revolvers. Except for that knob on the grip it looks "Adams-ish"

Except for the proof marks on the frame I tried to get a good picture of, and a Birmingham proof, (I think it was on the cylinder) its completely unmarked.

I knew that knob was very Webley-esq, but having never even heard of a Webley Wedge Frame/Webley Bentley I called it an Adams. I've never even known Webley had a cap'n'ball revolver. Which its owner calls it Webley.

 

[Rusk County Avengers]

Thinking back, except for the Birmingham marks on the cylinder, "London" on the top strap and the patent number the gun is completely unmarked. Now having a name I'm reading a dang good article at College Hill Arsenal.

Webley Wedge Frame Revolver

Webley Wedge Frame Revolver

collegehillarsenal.com

 

[Mark A]

The Webley Wedge Frame revolver. Marked LONDON on the top strap, J. ADAMS on the right side frame and PATENT No. 2466 on the left side frame. They are Confederate associated revolvers.

 

[Rusk County Avengers]

Going back and looking at photos of Beaumont-Adams revolvers, and this oddball, I'm really able to forgive myself for falling into an Adams trap.

I've always read and studied American percussion revolvers and very little of foreign ones. That needs to change...

On the other hand, is there any known shoulder stock variations for this gun?

Also the gun here came from a Louisiana home if I remember right.

 

[Mark A]

Safe to say this is the only Webley Wedge Frame revolver that I've ever seen with a stock attachment. I think the revolver and stock were manufactured post-Civil War by a few years.

 

[Jeff in Ohio]

Likely the London mark on the barrel was intended to be a misleading mark meant to suggest quality; these were made by many Birmingham makers, and sometimes they were marked and sometimes not; that Birmingham proof on the cylinder suggests it was made there.

 

[CowCavalry]

I've never even known Webley had a cap'n'ball revolver. Which its owner calls it Webley.

Years ago I read a write up on a Webley percussion revolver, IIRC it was a 5 shot .577 caliber monster. The author loaded and fired it, was very interesting.

 

[Lanyard Puller]

The Webley Wedge frames which came to the South, appear to have been in the 2,xxx to Bentley marked types in the 31xx-32xx serial number range. Later presentation types are in the low 5xxx range.

Nelson Clements had a contract to deliver 5000 revolvers to the Houston Quartermaster. It would appear that far fewer made it through the blockage if the contract was completed, which is unlikely as the known examples are in a very narrow serial number ranges of the total production of around 6500 pieces.. One of these revolvers adorns the cover of The English Connection. The big bore revolvers were 54 bore or .442 caliber.

The cased example below is s/n 2525. Also notice the very distinctive "micro groove" rifling on these revolvers. The brown leather holster is English made.

 

[Rusk County Avengers]

Safe to say this is the only Webley Wedge Frame revolver that I've ever seen with a stock attachment. I think the revolver and stock were manufactured post-Civil War by a few years.

Next time I'm over there I'll see about getting better pictures. This was kind of an off the cuff "Hey lets post pictures to advertise the museum and see if anyone notices this oddball English revolver!" I don't know if the stock was added later as someone suggested, the stock and its oddball attaching mechanism is very high quality.

How long after the war were these made by the way?

 

[Jeff in Ohio]

Mine is serial 3268 and engraved on the topstrap is D BENTLEY Patent

 

[Mark A]

Next time I'm over there I'll see about getting better pictures. This was kind of an off the cuff "Hey lets post pictures to advertise the museum and see if anyone notices this oddball English revolver!" I don't know if the stock was added later as someone suggested, the stock and its oddball attaching mechanism is very high quality.

How long after the war were these made by the way?

The Webley revolvers we are talking about in the 2xxx to 5xxx serial number ranges were probably all made between 1857-1861. The revolver you pictured is different in that our pictured guns all have flat sided frames, the gun in your photos seems to have a small recoil shield integral with the frame on its left side. Your pictured gun appears to have a five digit serial number while our revolvers have very low four digit serial numbers. Lastly the cylinder on your pictured gun does not have rings etched around the front while our guns all have rings around their cylinders. These design differences indicate to me that your Webley is a late production (post-war, 1868-70?) gun.

 

[UCVRelics]

Nice pieces. You be sure to tell Tom he will be missed at Shiloh. Who am I going to get to do the welcome CWT artwork?

 

[Rusk County Avengers]

Nice pieces. You be sure to tell Tom he will be missed at Shiloh. Who am I going to get to do the welcome CWT artwork?

Oh I'm sure something could be arranged on the artwork, I know Tom's been busy drawing some of the most evocative, and unflattering artwork I've ever seen concerning a certain Speaker of the House here lately....

I'll let him know and see what kind of artwork he can cook up for CWT next time I see him.