Seafaring question…

[Cazm]

Am not sure which thread this belongs in…

In the novel I'm writing, I have a schooner sailing from Halifax (Nova Scotia), to Boston with a cargo of goods and horses. Though the schooner is flying a neutral flag, a Union iron-clad warship is tracking it because it knows a Confederate spy is on board. The schooner's captain espies the warship further out in the Atlantic, south-east of Yarmouth, Nova Scotia. If we put the schooner at about the mid-way point between Yarmouth and Boston, how far could the captain see, using his telescope? 5 nautical miles? More? (I'm such a landlubber!) Many thx.

 

[Doc_Ralph]

Am not sure which thread this belongs in…

In the novel I'm writing, I have a schooner sailing from Halifax (Nova Scotia), to Boston with a cargo of goods and horses. Though the schooner is flying a neutral flag, a Union iron-clad warship is tracking it because it knows a Confederate spy is on board. The schooner's captain espies the warship further out in the Atlantic, south-east of Yarmouth, Nova Scotia. If we put the schooner at about the mid-way point between Yarmouth and Boston, how far could the captain see, using his telescope? 5 nautical miles? More? (I'm such a landlubber!) Many thx.

View attachment 534003

Naval Telescopes

Though telescopes have a long history they were only produced in quantities to be widely available in the late 18th century. Problems of lens polishing, lens composition, and manufacturing were slo…

ageofsail.wordpress.com

Hope this helps …
YHS,
Doc Ralph

 

[DaveBrt]

Am not sure which thread this belongs in…

In the novel I'm writing, I have a schooner sailing from Halifax (Nova Scotia), to Boston with a cargo of goods and horses. Though the schooner is flying a neutral flag, a Union iron-clad warship is tracking it because it knows a Confederate spy is on board. The schooner's captain espies the warship further out in the Atlantic, south-east of Yarmouth, Nova Scotia. If we put the schooner at about the mid-way point between Yarmouth and Boston, how far could the captain see, using his telescope? 5 nautical miles? More? (I'm such a landlubber!) Many thx.

View attachment 534003

The first question is what the weather is. If clear and sunny, then the second question is how high is the man who is seeing the ship. If you are on the deck of a small schooner, you can see about 5 miles to the horizon -- you can see beyond the horizon if the target is tall enough for its upper works to be seen, even though the waterline cannot be seen. For your story, we need to know how high the ironclad rises out of the water -- monitors would probably not be identifiable from a schooner's deck any farther than the horizon (5 miles). If it is larger than a monitor, you can go with 7 or 8 miles. No one is going to fault you if you use anything between 5 and 8 miles, so use what your story needs withing those ranges.

 

[captaindrew]

I've spend most of my life on the ocean until a few years ago and can tell you it would be hard spotting an ironclad more than a couple miles away even with modern binoculars. Now if he was being followed by a large sailing warship you'd spot that from much further away, 5 miles or maybe more on a clear day. You can see big modern container ships and cruise ships from way out on a clear day.

 

[JackADriscoll]

Would an era ironclad be capable of this kind of duty?

 

[captaindrew]

Would an era ironclad be capable of this kind of duty?

I was thinking the same thing although I'm not very knowledgeable on the CW Naval action. I would think being pursued by a sailing or steam warship would be a more accurate scene.

 

[Sheltowee]

Will say that the cargo of goods and horses kind of surprises me. Was Nova Scotia an exporter of horses? Just not what I would expect from a maritime province…. But I've never been there.

Best wishes!

 

[JackADriscoll]

Canada exported quite a few horses during the war years like 30000

The Tragic Tale of the Canadian Horse — CANADIANA web series

It’s been called “The Horse of Steel” and “The Little Iron Horse.” It’s a distinctly Canadian breed, with roots stretching back more than 300 years to the early French-Canadian pioneers. It had to be a rugged breed to survive the rigours of the Canadian climate — but as strong as it is, the Canadia

thisiscanadiana.com

 

[captaindrew]

Doing a little searching around out of my own curiosity, this scenario actually sparked my interest in who would be patrolling Northern waters, I think a US Revenue Cutter like the USRC Levi Woodbury (pictured) would be a much more likely ship to be pursuing your schooner. The navy had it's hands full down south with the blockade. I would do a search on the revenue cutter service during the Civil War. I'd like to learn some more myself.

 

[Rhea Cole]

I respectfully assert that you need to do some period research. Considered the greatest maritime historical novelist of all time, Patrick O'Brian based his 14 volumes on actual events. Log entries will tell you everything you need to know about all manner of routine events such as sighting other vessels.

No disrespect, but my wife & I are the only folks in this thread who have been blue water tall ship sailors.

A 150' (+) tall topmost sails of a man of war could be seen on the horizon long before the ship is hull up on the horizon 14 miles away.

From the fighting tops or cross trees a lookout can see over the horizon, 100' to 100'. You are asking a question without providing pertinent data.

F.Y.I., Union ironclads did not chase merchantmen off Nova Scotia. They were not blue water vessels.

Horses? If your cargo is horses you have a host of things to explain.

 

[Stryker65]

@Cazm What year is this taking place? I can find what naval vessels were in the area at this time, if I have a time range.

Doing a little searching around out of my own curiosity, this scenario actually sparked my interest in who would be patrolling Northern waters, I think a US Revenue Cutter like the USRC Levi Woodbury (pictured) would be a much more likely ship to be pursuing your schooner. The navy had it's hands full down south with the blockade. I would do a search on the revenue cutter service during the Civil War. I'd like to learn some more myself.

As an example, between April 1, 1864, and December 30, 1865, the US Navy had 78 ships "searching for Confederate cruisers and blockade runners". These were sidewheel and screw steamers, sailing and screw sloops, barks, sailing ships ... and one ironclad monitor (the USS Monadnock). However, this ironclad was patrolling Cuba, and would not be in Maine.

 

[R. Porter]

I would not think that monitors with their low freeboard would be suitable for anything but rivers and coastal waterways during mild weather (think USS Monitor vs a storm on the Outer Banks). That would seem to leave sailing ships and steamers, which, I believe, would have been faster than ironclads. Speed was very helpful in chasing down a blockade runner. In the case of a sailing ship, masts and sails would have stuck up over the horizon long before the hull came into view. In the case of a steamer, coal smoke could rise high above sail level giving away its position before any part of the physical ship came into view.

Horses does sound like an odd choice of cargo, but if there is documentation of them being shipped by boat through the waters you plan to use in the story from a port that your ship sails out of, then go for it and in the appendix at the end of the book where you talk about your sources and any liberties you may have taken in the name of poetic license you can educate your readership on the accuracy of your ship's cargo.

 

[Rhea Cole]

This is the Ali Babas' Cave of Civil War naval sources.

Link:

NavSource Naval History - Photo Archive Main Index

In the Old Navy Steam & Sail index are every commissioned vessel of both the U.S. Navy & C.S.S. Navy. There are photos, illustrations, vessel details, & histories of service. If you want to know what Union & CSA vessels were doing at any given time, here is the source.

Note: The Monitors are listed in the battleship index.

Link:

NavSource Online: Battleship Photo Archive

This is a source I often recommend. It is the report on the cargo carried by a blockade runner. Apart from the arms, the manifest included a large number of tools & household items. All of the items are illustrated.

Link:

The blockade runner, Modern Greece, and her cargo : Bright, Leslie S : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

Bibliography: p. [195]-203

archive.org

 

[JackADriscoll]

I would not think that monitors with their low freeboard would be suitable for anything but rivers and coastal waterways during mild weather (think USS Monitor vs a storm on the Outer Banks). That would seem to leave sailing ships and steamers, which, I believe, would have been faster than ironclads. Speed was very helpful in chasing down a blockade runner. In the case of a sailing ship, masts and sails would have stuck up over the horizon long before the hull came into view. In the case of a steamer, coal smoke could rise high above sail level giving away its position before any part of the physical ship came into view.

Horses does sound like an odd choice of cargo, but if there is documentation of them being shipped by boat through the waters you plan to use in the story from a port that your ship sails out of, then go for it and in the appendix at the end of the book where you talk about your sources and any liberties you may have taken in the name of poetic license you can educate your readership on the accuracy of your ship's cargo.

If I was writing it I'd probably play it as personal horses of a character.

 

[Rhea Cole]

It would be useful to refer to how to load & unload horses in:

The artillerist's manual, compiled from various sources, and adapted to the service of the United States : Gibbon, John, 1827-1896 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

Book digitized by Google from the library of Harvard University and uploaded to the Internet Archive by user tpb.

archive.org

You don't necessarily need to write about how to handle loading & unloading horses, but you neeed to know it.

 

[USS ALASKA]

I would do a search on the revenue cutter service during the Civil War. I'd like to learn some more myself.

The Long Blue Line: Civil War operations of the Revenue Cutter Service | Naval War - At Sea & Along Inland Waterways

The Long Blue Line: Civil War operations of the Revenue Cutter Service Posted by Diana Sherbs, Thursday, April 19, 2018 This blog is part of a series honoring the long blue line of Coast Guard men and women who served before us. Stay tuned as we highlight the customs, traditions, history and...

civilwartalk.com

HTHs,
USS ALASKA

 

[rebelatsea]

LOL, I think the poor Cadet got more than they expected. No criticism - well dome everyone. Just underlines what a wealth of knowledge we have in CWT

 

[Stryker65]

This is the Ali Babas' Cave of Civil War naval sources.

Link:

NavSource Naval History - Photo Archive Main Index

In the Old Navy Steam & Sail index are every commissioned vessel of both the U.S. Navy & C.S.S. Navy. There are photos, illustrations, vessel details, & histories of service. If you want to know what Union & CSA vessels were doing at any given time, here is the source.

Note: The Monitors are listed in the battleship index.

Do you know where one can find a record of the command changes for every ship? I haven't been able to, thus far.

 

[Fairfield]

Consider contacting the Maine Maritime Museum (https://www.mainemaritimemuseum.org/) with your questions. Not only is Maine on the route your ship would be following but this museum has a research function (I know this because of the the former directors of our historical society volunteers there).

 

[13 IL Cav & 64 GA Inf]

Am not sure which thread this belongs in…

In the novel I'm writing, I have a schooner sailing from Halifax (Nova Scotia), to Boston with a cargo of goods and horses. Though the schooner is flying a neutral flag, a Union iron-clad warship is tracking it because it knows a Confederate spy is on board. The schooner's captain espies the warship further out in the Atlantic, south-east of Yarmouth, Nova Scotia. If we put the schooner at about the mid-way point between Yarmouth and Boston, how far could the captain see, using his telescope? 5 nautical miles? More? (I'm such a landlubber!) Many thx.

View attachment 534003

Hate to say this, but it depends on the weather and the scope that he was using, along with the height above water from which he was looking. Good weather, good glass, low elevation on board, would still enable well over 5 miles.