Questions about hiring a guide

[John Winn]

Thanks everybody ! I really appreciate it. A tour it shall be.

 

[Brenal]

First time I was in Gettysburg we were talked into a bus tour and I must admit I had serious misgivings as we went to join the bus but that all disappeared when we discovered that my wife and myself were the only people, except for the guide and the driver, on the bus and we had a terrific tour and overview of the field only missing out Culps Hill where the buses seem not to go. The next day we had an LBG for a personalised tour of Day1 which was eye opening .Those guys are worth every cent and in subsequent trips I have always used their services for an in depth look at different parts of the battle.

 

[cash]

The most I've ever paid for a tour with an LBG is $18.

That's because it was part of a group arranged by Randy Drais, aka "Battle of Gettysburg Buff," who arranges tours most weekends in the spring/summer for groups. We all kick in $12-18 and we get an information packet, snacks and water, and the services of an LBG for 3 hours. Usually we're about 20-30 folks.

 

[John Winn]

For what is likely going to be my only chance to see Gettysburg I'm willing to pay whatever it takes. Luckily, I can afford it. I'm considering taking Eric up on his offer to put me in touch with the woman he knows for a mostly overview tour but with some emphasis on artillery as that is a special interest of mine and is something I know a little about. I'm not really a military historian - i.e. I can't tell you which regiment was where when or who commanded it and can't seem to remember those types of details after reading about them - but more of a generalist in that I do know the gist of what happened so a guide will help to fill that gap in my knowledge.

I'm just really interested to see the actual terrain with somebody who knows how things went down on the ground. I'm hoping that seeing the ground at the battlefields I'll finally get to see on the trip will help me understand them better. I think this may be especially true with respect to artillery as it was pretty much all line of sight in those days and success depended largely on good use of the landscape.

 

[Eric Wittenberg]

I'm just really interested to see the actual terrain with somebody who knows how things went down on the ground. I'm hoping that seeing the ground at the battlefields I'll finally get to see on the trip will help me understand them better. I think this may be especially true with respect to artillery as it was pretty much all line of sight in those days and success depended largely on good use of the landscape.

I have a dear friend who spent 26 years as a combat engineer in the Army, retiring as a colonel. Poor guy got shot up in Vietnam and still has problems as a result. Anyway, after walking a number of fields with him, he drilled two mantras into my brain, which are still there:

1. The terrain is THE primary source.

2. The terrain drives the action, not the other way around.

You cannot truly understand these battles--let alone write about them--without having a detailed understanding of the terrain. I never, ever think about writing about one of these actions without having spent time on the terrain so I can understand it. I did that back in November at Rappahannock Station, so I could truly understand why the Union attacks there led to two full brigades of Jubal Early's fine division being captured during the Second Battle of Rappahannock Station on November 8, 1863.

I spent eight full days on the battlefield at Trevilian Station before I ever put pen to paper. I could go on, but you get the idea.

My friend Jerry imparted words of wisdom to me, which I now pass on to you.

To quote one of my all-time favorite movies, Fast Times at Ridgemont High, "Learn it. Know it. Live it."

 

[John Winn]

I have a dear friend who spent 26 years as a combat engineer in the Army, retiring as a colonel. Poor guy got shot up in Vietnam and still has problems as a result. Anyway, after walking a number of fields with him, he drilled two mantras into my brain, which are still there:

1. The terrain is THE primary source.

2. The terrain drives the action, not the other way around.

You cannot truly understand these battles--let alone write about them--without having a detailed understanding of the terrain. I never, ever think about writing about one of these actions without having spent time on the terrain so I can understand it. I did that back in November at Rappahannock Station, so I could truly understand why the Union attacks there led to two full brigades of Jubal Early's fine division being captured during the Second Battle of Rappahannock Station on November 8, 1863.

I spent eight full days on the battlefield at Trevilian Station before I ever put pen to paper.

My friend Jerry imparted words of wisdom to me, which I now pass on to you.

To quote one of my all-time favorite movies, Fast Times at Ridgemont High, "Learn it. Know it. Live it."

I think your friend is absolutely right, especially with regards to the Civil War. These days it is no doubt still important but with GPS-guided missiles and drone attacks maybe it's somewhat of a different game. Back then, though, the terrain was critical. Take the high ground was pretty much the first rule of the day.

So I'm with you on seeing where it happened so as to really understand it. I don't need to know every company and regiment but I do think I need to see what was being attacked and defended and how it was approached.

I very much appreciate your help in furthering my education.

 

[pamc153PA]

First time I was in Gettysburg we were talked into a bus tour and I must admit I had serious misgivings as we went to join the bus but that all disappeared when we discovered that my wife and myself were the only people, except for the guide and the driver, on the bus and we had a terrific tour and overview of the field only missing out Culps Hill where the buses seem not to go. The next day we had an LBG for a personalised tour of Day1 which was eye opening .Those guys are worth every cent and in subsequent trips I have always used their services for an in depth look at different parts of the battle.

I have never seen a bus on Culp's, come to think of it. Maybe that's why I like to spend time there.

 

[pamc153PA]

I have a dear friend who spent 26 years as a combat engineer in the Army, retiring as a colonel. Poor guy got shot up in Vietnam and still has problems as a result. Anyway, after walking a number of fields with him, he drilled two mantras into my brain, which are still there:

1. The terrain is THE primary source.

2. The terrain drives the action, not the other way around.

You cannot truly understand these battles--let alone write about them--without having a detailed understanding of the terrain. I never, ever think about writing about one of these actions without having spent time on the terrain so I can understand it. I did that back in November at Rappahannock Station, so I could truly understand why the Union attacks there led to two full brigades of Jubal Early's fine division being captured during the Second Battle of Rappahannock Station on November 8, 1863.

I spent eight full days on the battlefield at Trevilian Station before I ever put pen to paper. I could go on, but you get the idea.

My friend Jerry imparted words of wisdom to me, which I now pass on to you.

To quote one of my all-time favorite movies, Fast Times at Ridgemont High, "Learn it. Know it. Live it."

Hope you don't mind if I add one of my favorite mantras when it comes to the battlefield to your Fast Times quote: Get out and walk it.

 

[jharold587]

The tour buses can not make some of the turns on culps. They also do not go to Barlow's Knoll.

 

[pamc153PA]

The tour buses can not make some of the turns on culps. They also do not go to Barlow's Knoll.

You are right! And nice to hear from you again!

 

[E_just_E]

So, what about getting out on the personal car tour - does that happen ? What's your opinion of a self-guided tour ?
Thanks again.

Because nobody answered that part:

The self-guided car tour is the official tour of the park, that has signs and stop numbers that you follow and stop. You can get in the Bookstore for something like $10-15. It has 2 narrated CDs (so you need a car with a CD player.). It goes on a single loop across the battlefield and that is the fatal fault of this tour and any other Gettysburg tour: A single loop (even with the best guide) is not good enough. So you get with the battlefield auto tour, in this order:

Day 1 - pretty decent tour, unless you want to know what happened inside the town
Fast Forward to Pickett's charge and Day 3, as far as the confederate point of view when they were thinking about it
then back to Hood's assault of the LRT in day 2 and some of the day 2 events in the Devils' Den and Wheatfield area, then back to the Day 3 at the High Watermark and the Bachelder mythology,
then off to Culps Hill for a day 2 and day 3 mix.

Major gaps:

- The battle through the town in Day 1
- The battle for Cemetery Hill in the evening of Day 2
- Pickett's Charge
- The aftermath
- A sense for the sequence of events

And I am afraid that this is exactly what Guides would do too in a "guided" tour.

So, If you really want a complete (but brief) tour of the Battle, ask a guide, whether he/she can give you a chronological tour no matter how many times you have to circle the battlefield or have to go on foot or on city streets. That should probably take about 6-7 hours if done right.

Caution: Not all guides have both points of view in their heads (you usually going to hear the Union side - and the Union side of something like Pickett's charge is the most boring thing you could hear - goes like this: They came from all over, we shot them with double canister and with our rifles, they died or gave up and either ran away or surrendered.), so that's another question you need to ask to get a complete view of the events.

Trying to compress the acts of 200,000 people in about 20,000 acres in 96 hours in a single tour is a tremendous challenge

If a guide cannot give you more than the self-guided car tour, I'd frankly go with the car tour, but I have a different perspective and fewer guide buddies than others here

One more thing: Yes the terrain explains the battle, unless the terrain has been altered. Having someone knowledgeable of the terrain back then and the alterations you see today, definitely helps

 

[lelliott19]

@John Winn the first time we went to Gettysburg (several years ago) we knew nothing really. At the time, I did not have the benefit of knowledgeable folks here to help. We just showed up at the Vis Center and hired the next available NPS LBG for a 2 hour tour in our car. The cost was really not much more than a bus tour for 2 so we figured it was a no-brainer.

So when we met him, on the spot, he asked what we'd like to see. We told him we had never been there before but would like for him to show us where Woffords Brigade was. (The hubby's gg grandfather 16th GA was in Woffords.) He did a great job - with no prior warning!!!! He wound up spending nearly 3 hours with us on the battlefield, instead of 2 that we paid for. Could have been just luck of the draw, but as @Eric Wittenberg said, they do have to have at least a cursory knowledge of a lot of material just to pass the test.

That night, after such a wonderful experience, I got on the internet and engaged the services of @John F. Cummings III for Spotsylvania which we were scheduled to visit 2 days later. John was fabulous!!!! Im not sure how I lucked into finding him AND having him be available, but I did and he was. John was especially awesome because he uses then and now pictures of the battlefield in his tours. We loved that part!!!

Now we hardly go anywhere without researching, carefully choosing, and engaging the services of a knowledgeable guide - at least for our first trip to a battlefield. Just my two cents.

 

[Nathanb1]

Laura, ditto. We got much more than we paid for! And I can't stress enough (as Eric said) the importance of having someone knowledgeable to drive. Terrain was one of my main concerns, having been recently indoctrinated by the great Ed Bearss....so we got it. One of the most valuable things was seeing the sight lines and understanding what each side could see....and not see.

 

[cash]

I have never seen a bus on Culp's, come to think of it. Maybe that's why I like to spend time there.

I've seen buses up there. There's a bus parking spot for them, too.

 

[bdtex]

Not planning on getting to Gettysburg this year. Next year hopefully. But this is just a great thread period for what to look for in a guide and the kinds of questions to ask them before and during a tour.

 

[civilken]

If you are going in September with all the people from this form including me I don't believe you need a guide. I would not put myself against some of the people here but I know Gettysburg like the back of my hand and I'm sure there are plenty who know better. Just get a group go out and talk and walk I'm sure you'll have a ball.