What is this? Question on Enfield bayonet marking

[Cato3rd]

I bought this Enfield bayonet a few years ago from a digger at a flea market in Virginia. I bought it and saw this star/asterisk mark on it. No other marks or stamps on it besides this. I've looked online and couldn't find anything that resembled that mark on it. I'm hoping someone here knows what it is because I can't figure it out. Thanks in advance for helping.

Dimensions:
Socket length- 3 inches
Entire length- 20 inches
Passes the "penny test"

 

[JOHN42768]

Markings on British and Commonwealth Bayonets

Looks like the Cypher Great Britian "Sold out of Service"

 

[Cato3rd]

Markings on British and Commonwealth Bayonets

Looks like the Cypher Great Britian "Sold out of Service"

Thank you for the helpful link

 

[OldSarge79]

At first glance, it might look like a Sold Out Of Service mark, the opposing broad arrows, but there appear to be 8 points coming out from the center, not 6. Frankly, it doesn't have the style I have seen on other opposing broad arrow markings.
Sold Out Of Service would come only from a Board of Ordnance bayonet. Are there any other markings at all on this one?

Pardon the poor lighting on the following photo but the best I could do on short notice. It's from British Ordnance Muskets of the 1830's and 1840's by Adrian Roads.

@Old Soldier might give a more definitive answer.

 

[Cato3rd]

At first glance, it might look like a Sold Out Of Service mark, the opposing broad arrows, but there appear to be 8 points coming out from the center, not 6. Frankly, it doesn't have the style I have seen on other opposing broad arrow markings.
Sold Out Of Service would come only from a Board of Ordnance bayonet. Are there any other markings at all on this one?

Pardon the poor lighting on the following photo but the best I could do on short notice. It's from British Ordnance Muskets of the 1830's and 1840's by Adrian Roads.

@Old Soldier might give a more definitive answer.

View attachment 554869

Nothing that I could find on the usual spots for markings. Unless I'm missing something but I just can't find any other markings

 

[OldSarge79]

While the corrosion could mask markings, I don't see anything to indicate an Ordnance bayonet.
It does catch my attention that the rear of the socket shows an apparent uneven thickness. It may not be made in England.
Is the screw hole in the retaining ring centered or off-center? Hard to tell in your photo.

 

[Cato3rd]

While the corrosion could mask markings, I don't see anything to indicate an Ordnance bayonet.
It does catch my attention that the rear of the socket shows an apparent uneven thickness. It may not be made in England.
Is the screw hole in the retaining ring centered or off-center? Hard to tell in your photo.

The screw hole does look off center. The digger told me he dug it out near Harrisonburg, Va out of a camp site

 

[OldSarge79]

Could you post a photo of the screw hole on the other side?

 

[Cato3rd]

Could you post a photo of the screw hole on the other side?

What do you think it is?

 

[Old Soldier]

At first glance, it might look like a Sold Out Of Service mark, the opposing broad arrows, but there appear to be 8 points coming out from the center, not 6. Frankly, it doesn't have the style I have seen on other opposing broad arrow markings.
Sold Out Of Service would come only from a Board of Ordnance bayonet. Are there any other markings at all on this one?

Pardon the poor lighting on the following photo but the best I could do on short notice. It's from British Ordnance Muskets of the 1830's and 1840's by Adrian Roads.

@Old Soldier might give a more definitive answer.

View attachment 554869

The sold out of service mark is much longer, -X- this is more circular and much smaller. It is a 'star' - * - (actually two '+' crossed = 8-point) which, on a rifle means 'rusty bore' (two stars means VERY rusty!). Given the conditiion, it would seem appropriate. These were the first ones to get disposed of. I doubt if this is an issue bayonet since there is no examiners mark on the flat. There were plenty of private purchase ones sent over - two regiment of Union (c2,000) and about 70,000 to the rebs. (No service rifles or bayonets were sent over the pond except for some v old sold-out-of-service with civilian proofs)
I suspect the mark was applied in Britain (I have no knowlege of CS/US markings for condition) and the bayonet deemed serviceable enough for export so was shipped out (let the Yanks clean it up!).

 

[OldSarge79]

I've never seen that "star" mark. If the screw hole is off-center, it's difficult for me to see.
Are there any other imperfections?
(off-center fuller on the face of the blade, irregular curves at the base of the blade, etc)

 

[Cato3rd]

The sold out of service mark is much longer, -X- this is more circular and much smaller. It is a 'star' - * - (actually two '+' crossed = 8-point) which, on a rifle means 'rusty bore' (two stars means VERY rusty!). Given the conditiion, it would seem appropriate. These were the first ones to get disposed of. I doubt if this is an issue bayonet since there is no examiners mark on the flat. There were plenty of private purchase ones sent over - two regiment of Union (c2,000) and about 70,000 to the rebs. (No service rifles or bayonets were sent over the pond except for some v old sold-out-of-service with civilian proofs)
I suspect the mark was applied in Britain (I have no knowlege of CS/US markings for condition) and the bayonet deemed serviceable enough for export so was shipped out (let the Yanks clean it up!).

Interesting, very good information. So basically sold them and told them to use some elbow grease to fix them up. That would explain the faint file marks on it

 

[Cato3rd]

I've never seen that "star" mark. If the screw hole is off-center, it's difficult for me to see.
Are there any other imperfections?
(off-center fuller on the face of the blade, irregular curves at the base of the blade, etc)

Here is one of the fuller. It does look a bit off center. The spine does seem a bit "wobbly". Like it will curve one way and then the other down the length of the blade. Hard to get a picture of that

 

[OldSarge79]

It's difficult to see the fuller edges with clarity.
All I can say is, IF all of those points, and perhaps others, are indeed manufacturing imperfections, it is possible that it's Confederate manufactured, but I'm hesitant to suggest that.
There were two known makers in the South contracted to make bayonets for the Pattern 1853 musket, and known examples are few and far between. I have one which is Louisiana numbered and don't expect to ever see another.

There are also modern reproductions floating around which are poorly made and intentionally aged, so the waters are muddied even further.

Yours could very well still prove to be British made. Sorry I can't be more definite.

Don't get your hopes up but it might be worth showing to Paul Johnson if you get a chance. He is supposed to be at the Doswell show next weekend.

 

[Cato3rd]

It's difficult to see the fuller edges with clarity.
All I can say is, IF all of those points, and perhaps others, are indeed manufacturing imperfections, it is possible that it's Confederate manufactured, but I'm hesitant to suggest that.
There were two known makers in the South contracted to make bayonets for the Pattern 1853 musket, and known examples are few and far between. I have one which is Louisiana numbered and don't expect to ever see another.

There are also modern reproductions floating around which are poorly made and intentionally aged, so the waters are muddied even further.

Yours could very well still prove to be British made. Sorry I can't be more definite.

Don't get your hopes up but it might be worth showing to Paul Johnson if you get a chance. He is supposed to be at the Doswell show next weekend.

That's good to hear. I was debating on showing up to the Doswell show. It's not too far from me. Fortunately I only bought this bayonet for 100 bucks. I was going to use it in a relic board I'm creating with some other odds and ends. I got a bullseye canteen that was painted gold that came out of a GAR hall. But like you said, IF it is a confederate made bayonet then I think I'll use a less rare one for the board lol

 

[OldSarge79]

Great! I'll have a table at the show and would love you to come by. If you don't know Paul Johnson, I would be glad to introduce you.
Look for a table with 3 muskets on a rack laterally, several bayonets and a good sized framed portrait of Theodore Roosevelt, somewhere in the middle of the main floor. That'll be me.