Pattern 1853 carbine??

Deadbeat

Cadet
Joined
Oct 23, 2019
Hello. After watching for a while, I decided I needed to join and participate. I have a curious Pattern 1853 "carbine" that I could use some help on. It is a 2 band carbine with a 24" barrel and multiple inspection marks. I believe it is a cut down version of a pattern 1853 rifled musket because it doesn't have a bayonet lug, the ladder site is positioned in the same location as a rifled musket, and it has 3 rifle grooves.


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More interesting is the series of marks on the barrel. I beleive it was originally a British ordinance (VR under the crown on the lockplate) but has a "s" stamped through the final acceptance mark (crown over arrow) on the barrel, and another acceptance mark (crown over Tt over arrow).I believe this was the procedure when a rifled musket failed to meet the specifications because of damage in the field. The gun was then returned to be refurbished and could only be sold commercially. I assume this accounts for the number of inspections marked on the barrel.


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Additionally, there is a faint crown over 18 just behind the trigger and a "L" or "L1" over "65" and another view? mark on the right stock.


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I am curious on where the gun may have been sold the second time around and what the L 68 may mean on the butt tang.
Thanks in advance.
 
Interesting thread! I am still leaning towards this being a cut down Pattern 53 due to the front sight and, as you mentioned, the rear swivel location. The interesting part is the very professional nature of the gun and it's not missing the front sight. I suspect the modifications may have been performed by a Birmingham Small Arms Trade member. If so, it was sold commercially after the modifications. To Who?, Where? No idea.
 
Interesting thread! I am still leaning towards this being a cut down Pattern 53 due to the front sight and, as you mentioned, the rear swivel location. The interesting part is the very professional nature of the gun and it's not missing the front sight. I suspect the modifications may have been performed by a Birmingham Small Arms Trade member. If so, it was sold commercially after the modifications. To Who?, Where? No idea.
It's a nice looking piece, I'm curious to what the experts have to say on this one myself. One of them will see this before too long.
 
I know you are looking for answers, but with something like this...who knows? It looks like an amalgamated weapon to me. This much can be said with certainty. It is not an Enfield pattern artillery carbine. The barrel proof marks and lock plate have government acceptance marks (broad arrow, etc) and a date of 1858. The rear sight on the barrel and rear sling swivel location suggest those parts begin their service to the British War Department as a P53. Those parts are characteristic to that model. As to when the stock and barrel were shortened to their present length, we can't be certain. Often when there is an X where this is found here on the barrel (and stock flat), it is a condemnation mark.The govt barrel proof marks are also over-stamped with an S, indicating the gun was sold out of service.

So just from I can see and putting 2 + 2 together, I would say somebody at some point bought a condemned British government service P53 and made this out of it.
 
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