Marching by the flank

[captaindrew]

But Casey calls "marching by the flank" a formation with 4 abreast. To me, that is no longer a line of battle. It's a doubled-up line of battle.

A related question is...what does it mean when a unit moves "by file?"

Your file would be the guys in line with you by 2 or 4. Say you are marching down a street in 4s and the road makes a right turn the order would be by files right each line of 4 makes a right turn at the turn in the road. Firing by file goes down the battle line with the first front and rear man on the right firing then so on down the line. You're right a column of 4s is not a battle line. Technically by the book any movement in any formation to the side is marching by the flank. We just tried to show how you would move by 2s or 4s. I know it's confusing, the manuals are not easy reading.

 

[infomanpa]

It can be confusing. When the company is in formation in two ranks facing front in a battle line or when they fall in and form the company and are ordered right or left face you automatically double into 4s (after counting off by 2 the #2s step up to form 4 ranks when facing right the 1s step up if facing left) which would be the normal marching formation then order forward march. To get back into a battle line by 2s you'd have to stop and either left face or in the other direction right into line which can be a little tricky especially under fire. Now imagine you are in a line of battle with the enemy in your front. You see the enemy moving to your right or left possibly trying a flanking movement and you need to counter that quickly. You would order by the right or left flank march and the battle line would simply turn and move to the right or left without doubling and go as far as needed and turn right back front into the battle line. It's much simpler and faster than going into a formal marching formation then having to reform the battle line. I wish I had a virtual chalkboard, I think I could draw it up a lot better than I could explain it. Then you have to through in marching by the oblique and wheels.

So are BOTH 2 man and 4 man ranks called "marching by the flank?" According to Casey's manual, marching by ranks of 4 is marching by the flank. You suggest that when the command to "march by the flank is given, it also means 2 per rank.

 

[captaindrew]

I haven't read Casey's but I believe it's the same as Hardee's. Technically by the book at the company level it is by 4 but the captain has the discretion to keep it at 2 which he would do if he wanted to stay in a line of battle like we mentioned before. In some cases like in skirmish drill you can move by the flank in single file.

 

[captaindrew]

The proper order would be: In two ranks, right or left face, forward march. If he just ordered right or left face the lines would automatically go into 4s

 

[captaindrew]

That would be the proper order to stay in 2s that is. Hope I'm not confusing you more by getting technical. Going back to the basics it would be a common move to move by the flank in 2s in a battle line which is I think your original question. And keep in mind while reading battle reports and accounts things weren't always done strictly by the book and some officers would word the same thing slightly different. If you can figure this stuff out at the basic level you can understand what was going on. Like I said before I have a pretty good understanding of it to a company level but reading the book still confuses me some. Getting some hands on experience with it helps a lot. There are some good youtube videos of drill that may help.

 

[infomanpa]

I just watched a scene about 1:20 minutes into Gods and Generals. Colonel Ames of the 20th Maine is instructing Lt. Col. Chamberlain in changing from line of battle into column and back. An actual diagram is shown and his men demonstrate. Cool!

 

[captaindrew]

I just watched a scene about 1:20 minutes into Gods and Generals. Colonel Ames of the 20th Maine is instructing Lt. Col. Chamberlain in changing from line of battle into column and back. An actual diagram is shown and his men demonstrate. Cool!

Going into line of battle can be tricky depending which direction you are heading and which way the battle line is to face. If I remember that scene correctly they were marching and formed a line straight ahead. Haven't watched G&G in a while but I just got the directors cut of that and Gettysburg not long ago so I'm going to have to have a marathon one rainy day soon. Hope you are getting a handle on it and we didn't confuse you too much yesterday. I was almost starting to confuse myself. When you see it in action like the scene in the movie the light bulb will go off. There are some pretty good youtube videos of companies doing drill that may help. If you have any more questions I'll try my best to help along with some of the other folks on here that probably know this stuff better than me.

 

[DixieRifles]

When the command "right face" is given, the ranks and files turn in the appropriate direction, the "ones" standing in place, and the "twos" STEPPING UP TO THE RIGHT OF THE ONES, making the four-man front for a marching column. If "left face" is given, the same procedure is followed with the vital difference it is now the "twos" that stay in place and the "ones" that step to their LEFT.

EXcellent explanation. With only 1 reenactment under my belt some 20 years ago, I easily recalled the maneuver.
I was an ROTC drill team commander so we practiced a lot of razzle-dazzle maneuvers.
This maneuver was almost like ordering a Swing Right on a small scale of 2 men.

 

[infomanpa]

Going into line of battle can be tricky depending which direction you are heading and which way the battle line is to face. If I remember that scene correctly they were marching and formed a line straight ahead. Haven't watched G&G in a while but I just got the directors cut of that and Gettysburg not long ago so I'm going to have to have a marathon one rainy day soon. Hope you are getting a handle on it and we didn't confuse you too much yesterday. I was almost starting to confuse myself. When you see it in action like the scene in the movie the light bulb will go off. There are some pretty good youtube videos of companies doing drill that may help. If you have any more questions I'll try my best to help along with some of the other folks on here that probably know this stuff better than me.

Thanks, captaindrew....you did not confuse me. I did go back to Casey's manual and it helped make sense out this. Unfortunately, I did not have much luck finding youtube videos.

 

[Phiip McBride]

This thread has been a hoot to read. After nearly 20 years of reenacting in an active company in a 5 company battalion which actually drilled as a battalion, I can best say there is no substitution for being on the drill field for a long morning of practice. And no substitution for moving up the ranks and learning the maneuvers from the roles of privates through captains. As someone said, it does make your head spin. Those old boys may not have been college grads and many were barely literate, but by golly, they mastered some complicated geometry on the job. Frankly, I love it.

 

[captaindrew]

Thanks, captaindrew....you did not confuse me. I did go back to Casey's manual and it helped make sense out this. Unfortunately, I did not have much luck finding youtube videos.

Glad your making some sense out of it. If you search youtube for Hardee's infantry tactics or civil war drill a bunch of stuff will come up. Again I've read Hardee's many times over but I haven't read Casey's but I've always been taught it is pretty much Hardee's for Yankees. If there's any differences I'd love to know. Guess I should read it for myself one of these days. Now to throw a wrench in the works the company I fall in with up north in the summer uses Gilham's. The movements are pretty much the same but there are some big differences in the manual of arms.

 

[infomanpa]

Glad your making some sense out of it. If you search youtube for Hardee's infantry tactics or civil war drill a bunch of stuff will come up. Again I've read Hardee's many times over but I haven't read Casey's but I've always been taught it is pretty much Hardee's for Yankees. If there's any differences I'd love to know. Guess I should read it for myself one of these days. Now to throw a wrench in the works the company I fall in with up north in the summer uses Gilham's. The movements are pretty much the same but there are some big differences in the manual of arms.

Unlike Hardee's manual, Casey included an extra section of brigade, division and corps formations and maneuvers. You should check it out. As you said, the rest of it is similar to Hardee. And thanks for the youtube search hints, I found the videos.

 

[thomas aagaard]

Glad your making some sense out of it. If you search youtube for Hardee's infantry tactics or civil war drill a bunch of stuff will come up. Again I've read Hardee's many times over but I haven't read Casey's but I've always been taught it is pretty much Hardee's for Yankees. If there's any differences I'd love to know. Guess I should read it for myself one of these days. Now to throw a wrench in the works the company I fall in with up north in the summer uses Gilham's. The movements are pretty much the same but there are some big differences in the manual of arms.

There are two versions of Hardee, with the 1855 version using the manual of arms for rifles and the revised edition having a modified manual of arms.
Similar Gilhams use the manual of arms for muskets.
And the US infantry tactics 1861 got both the manual of arms for muskets and the one for rifles.
But when it come to the movements... (company and battalion level) they are all based on the French 1845 drill book that Hardee translated/plagiarized.

 

[infomanpa]

There are two versions of Hardee, with the 1855 version using the manual of arms for rifles and the revised edition having a modified manual of arms.
Similar Gilhams use the manual of arms for muskets.
And the US infantry tactics 1861 got both the manual of arms for muskets and the one for rifles.
But when it come to the movements... (company and battalion level) they are all based on the French 1845 drill book that Hardee translated/plagiarized.

Also, Winfield Scott's 1835 manual was used by the American Army before Hardee published his book.

 

[thomas aagaard]

But that one is different in both manual of arms and evolutions.