Manning's Ledge in Rose Woods

[Gettysburg Greg]

During a previous visit to the Gettysburg battlefield, my most excellent tour guide took me to a remote area of the field I was totally unfamiliar with. She took me into the Rose Woods where we came upon a large rock ledge where, she explained, that the 3rd Arkansas had fought here at this ledge for over an hour on the evening of July 2nd, 1863. The ledge provided shelter at times as well as an obstacle during the brawl here. The Arkansans were led by Colonel Manning and were facing the 86th NY, the 20th Indiana, and the 99th Pa. in the Rose Woods. It was near the ledge that the Colonel was struck in the face by shrapnel but was able to recover enough to continue to lead his men. Artist Dennis Morris created an amazing diograph that depicts the fight at Manning's Ledge as it is now called. The scene in the diagraph closely resembles a photo I took that day, so I put the print of the diograph and my photo together for comparison, shown below. Most of Mr. Morris' fine work can be viewed and purchased at All Products (diographics.com)

 

[infomanpa]

I've been trying to determine this location for the last couple of years. Evidently, it's not a settled issue. From the OR report by Manning, my vote goes to this location:

I'm wondering if it's the same place as your photo, Greg?

In Garry Adelman and Tim Smith's book on Devil's Den, they claim that the below rock formation is the ledge:

I can locate these locations on a map if anyone is interested.

 

[lelliott19]

Artist Dennis Morris created an amazing diograph that depicts the fight at Manning's Ledge as it is now called. The scene in the diagraph closely resembles a photo I took that day, so I put the print of the diograph and my photo together for comparison, shown below. Most of Mr. Morris' fine work can be viewed and purchased at All Products (diographics.com)

Thanks for sharing @Gettysburg Greg
I always love your side by side comparisons and this diograph by @dennmorr is fantastic!

 

[rpkennedy]

I've been trying to determine this location for the last couple of years. Evidently, it's not a settled issue. From the OR report by Manning, my vote goes to this location:
View attachment 472348
I'm wondering if it's the same place as your photo, Greg?

In Garry Adelman and Tim Smith's book on Devil's Den, they claim that the below rock formation is the ledge:
View attachment 472349

I can locate these locations on a map if anyone is interested.

Please do. It's been a very long time since I've walked through that section of Rose Woods and I'm curious about the different locations.

Ryan

 

[infomanpa]

Please do. It's been a very long time since I've walked through that section of Rose Woods and I'm curious about the different locations.

Ryan

It's fun exploring the woods where significant action took place and never meeting anyone else!
The map below shows the location (A) where I believe that the Manning rocks are located. I'm assuming that's also the location of Greg's picture, I will have to investigate when the vegetation and leaves are gone this fall. I think that this location is favored because the records mention Union flanking fire to the left and rear which was in range of the 17th Maine at the south wall of the Wheatfield. Location (B) is out of range of flanking fire.

 

[R. Porter]

Surely there must be some tell-tale rock damage due to small arms fire that would point to a particular location.

 

[infomanpa]

Surely there must be some tell-tale rock damage due to small arms fire that would point to a particular location.

Not necessarily. The rocks on the battlefield are pretty impervious to bullet damage. Otherwise, Devil's Den would be covered by damage. Amazingly, those boulders look the same as they did before the battle.

 

[TomWI]

I think one of my favorite debates of the battlefield is where events like this occurred, when there's multiple options and people post why their favored one is correct, backed up with writings and records. It's fascinating to me.

Been trying to match up that google earth image on my own, I assume north is oriented "up"?

 

[bankerpapaw]

Originally from Arkansas. Thanks so much for the pictures and the information about the 3rd Arkansas.

 

[rpkennedy]

It's fun exploring the woods where significant action took place and never meeting anyone else!
The map below shows the location (A) where I believe that the Manning rocks are located. I'm assuming that's also the location of Greg's picture, I will have to investigate when the vegetation and leaves are gone this fall. I think that this location is favored because the records mention Union flanking fire to the left and rear which was in range of the 17th Maine at the south wall of the Wheatfield. Location (B) is out of range of flanking fire.
View attachment 472471

I tend to agree with the more northern point for the ledge.

Ryan

 

[Gettysburg Greg]

It's fun exploring the woods where significant action took place and never meeting anyone else!
The map below shows the location (A) where I believe that the Manning rocks are located. I'm assuming that's also the location of Greg's picture, I will have to investigate when the vegetation and leaves are gone this fall. I think that this location is favored because the records mention Union flanking fire to the left and rear which was in range of the 17th Maine at the south wall of the Wheatfield. Location (B) is out of range of flanking fire.
View attachment 472471

I also did a Google Earth map and followed my path to the ledge and it was exactly where you have labeled it. Here's my similar map-arrow points at the ledge.

 

[DixieRifles]

In Garry Adelman and Tim Smith's book on Devil's Den

What is the title of this book— or are you referring to 2 books?
Im a fan of Timothy Smith.

 

[rpkennedy]

What is the title of this book— or are you referring to 2 books?
Im a fan of Timothy Smith.

Devil's Den: A History and Guide.

Ryan

 

[121st PA Vols]

Devil's Den: A History and Guide.

Ryan

Interesting. This is in the area from which (boulder formation) a CSA infantrymen shot brigade commander Col. Caldwell (fringe of The Wheatfield/Houck Ridge) July 2nd per men of his 5th NH Regt.

Edited to say Cross's brigade. (it was quite a night!?!)

 

[infomanpa]

I think one of my favorite debates of the battlefield is where events like this occurred, when there's multiple options and people post why their favored one is correct, backed up with writings and records. It's fascinating to me.

Been trying to match up that google earth image on my own, I assume north is oriented "up"?

Correct.

 

[infomanpa]

I tend to agree with the more northern point for the ledge.

Ryan

I also did a Google Earth map and followed my path to the ledge and it was exactly where you have labeled it. Here's my similar map-arrow points at the ledge.

Location B has been generally accepted by many, but my problem with that location is that I don't see how flanking fire could have reached there from the distance of the nearest Union firearms. (@Tom Elmore also agrees that location A is more likely.) I would love to have someone explain to me the rationale behind the location B determination.

 

[dennmorr]

This area has always been a bit personal to me as my Great Great Uncle fought there with the 86th NY. I have had some pleasant conversations with some of Van Noy Manning's descendants who viewed my work.
Dennis

 

[DixieRifles]

Originally from Arkansas. Thanks so much for the pictures and the information about the 3rd Arkansas.

My ancestor(2XGr-Uncle) Barton Pritchard was in the 3rd Arkansas and died on 2nd July.
I dont know where he is buried. I bought this figure for my birthday.

 

[Tommyg84]

I just walked all of Rose's woods. I mean... all of it. I still have no clue which is accurate. The problem is that neither make sense. A doesn't work for me because it is far too close to where the Indiana troops would be. I also fail to see how it could be used as a makeshift breatswork. It doesn't provide much cover and the "ledge" itself is rather hidden... it just doesn't seem like a good firing position.

B makes much more sense to me because it is far far better of a firing position.... however I do feel it is too far away.

I'm going with B.... A is far too close and too little cover. B is too far and probably offline a bit but is far better cover where a lot more men could take shelter.

 

[infomanpa]

Location B has been generally accepted by many, but my problem with that location is that I don't see how flanking fire could have reached there from the distance of the nearest Union firearms. (@Tom Elmore also agrees that location A is more likely.) I would love to have someone explain to me the rationale behind the location B determination.

I just walked all of Rose's woods. I mean... all of it. I still have no clue which is accurate. The problem is that neither make sense. A doesn't work for me because it is far too close to where the Indiana troops would be. I also fail to see how it could be used as a makeshift breatswork. It doesn't provide much cover and the "ledge" itself is rather hidden... it just doesn't seem like a good firing position.

B makes much more sense to me because it is far far better of a firing position.... however I do feel it is too far away.

I'm going with B.... A is far too close and too little cover. B is too far and probably offline a bit but is far better cover where a lot more men could take shelter.

I've been through Rose Woods again, recently and have been studying more maps. I'm swinging around to thinking that Location B (the southern position) might be right after all. Looking at Laino's map below (red dot marks the rocks), it is possible that flanking fire from Union troops could have reached the 3rd AR from the 99th PA, the 20th IN or even the 17th ME because they were all within the 300 yard rifle range of fire.