M1842 Aston Johnson Repro?

[Spunk Puppy]

Hello everyone!

As some of you may know, I am a fan and proponent of the 19th century single-shot cavalry "horse pistols", typically .54 caliber smoothbore handguns widely used in the U.S. military before the adoption of revolvers. One of my most favorite example is the M1842 Aston Johnson pistol:

Expired Image Removed

This gun was heavily used during the Mexican American War and early years of the Civil War, primarily in the south. These guns were in such high usage by our military that I always considered it odd than nobody has ever made a working reproduction of it.

Everyone, I'll cut right to it. I think we need a quality reproduction of this gun! In fact, I've felt that way for a long time, and last year I contacted Davide Pedersoli of Italy and what follows is our conversation:

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Me:

Hello, I think it would be great if your company were to produce a replica of the famous U.S. Model 1842 Percussion Pistol. I have talked to many in the black powder community and they all are wanting this model. It was used heavily before the Colt Revolver in the United States.

Thank you for considering this, if you make these, I guarantee they will sell. I will buy two at least! Thanks again.

Pedersoli:

Thank you for the suggestion.

Can you address us to a web site where we can look at the gun and collect information for further evaluations?

Best regards,

Customer Service

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Davide-Pedersoli-C/198648030179957

DAVIDE PEDERSOLI & C.
Via Artigiani, 57
I-25063 GARDONE VALTROMPIA
(Brescia) Italy
ph. +39 030 8915000
fax +39 030 8911019
www.davide-pedersoli.com

Me:

Absolutely,

Here is a gun magazine article on the Aston Johnson Model 1842 percussion pistol:
http://gunsmagazine.com/web-blast-the-astonjohnson-martial-pistol-of-1842/


Here is an informational pamphlet on it as well:
http://www.nramuseum.org/media/940325/1842 article.pdf


This is a very historical pistol in America, and I was surprised that no one was making a reproduction of it. I have spoken with several in the black powder community and they all are very interested in buying reproductions of the pistol. I would buy at least two of them myself. I think it would be great if it were in the authentic .54 caliber as well. If there is anything else I can assist you with, please let me know!


V/r

Pedersoli:

Thank you, let's stay in touch.

Will submit your inquiry to our managers for further evaluations.

Best regards,
Customer Service

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Needless to say, they seemed interested in possibly making a reproduction of this gun. I personally believe that Pedersoli makes some of the best reproduction Civil War era weapons available, and they have plenty of experience in making handguns. Their recent Harpers Ferry M1805 percussion pistol, .54 smoothbore, is a great gun. I think they could make an M1842 Aston Johnson replica and it would sell, especially with the new N-SSA smoothbore pistol event.

I urge anyone reading this to please contact Pedersoli and ask them to make an accurate repro of this gun. It would take only a moment, and our combined efforts could reward the shooting and reenacting communities with a fine, historic replica. All of the contact information is included above, but here is their customer service email:

[email protected]

Thank you all so much for your help. We can make this happen together!

V/r

Earl Burlin

 

[hrobalabama]

For some reason, the martial single shot percussion pistol has not been in demand in the gun collection fraternity.
I had a beautiful one with clear cartouches but it just would not sell at a good price at gun shows. Revolvers - yes in fair shape
sell for twice of what these historic pieces bring. I am convinced that they were more in use in the Civil War that we think.

 

[Craig L Barry]

However many of these single shot pistols were in use, it would pale in comparison to the number of M-1854 Austrian rifles imported by both sides. And there are currently no Italian made, professionally proofed reproductions of it. The reason I have always heard for the lack of variety in reproduction arms is that the cost of tooling is high, and the sales of a new product generally come at the expense of existing products. In other words, if Armi Sport or Pedersoli made a M-54 Lorenz it would cut into the sales of their Enfield and US 1861 product lines. A few years back a petition sent to Armi Sport to make the Lorenz got hundreds of signatures, IIRC something like 600. They were not impressed. It sounds like Pedersoli is more polite and receptive.

Pedersoli already makes a number of single shot pistols in flint and percussion. I would be kind of surprised if they opted to make another. They need unit sales in the thousands to justify the cost, more so than "I'd buy two and so would several of my friends."

 

[Grayrock Volunteer]

Producing the M1805 as a percussion altered arm actually nets Pedersoli more money than building a flintlock. They already had the tooling available so switching production was very easily done. It would be much more difficult to produce another single shot martial pistol that requires a totally different set-up to manufacture.

The Italians rarely go out of the box when it comes to producing a new muzzle loading arm (the P1853 and M1861 withstanding). Everything else they have made has been a derivation of either the French M1777, P1853, Remington M1862, or M1861. The only "unique" arm they make is the M1842, of which the produce a "Freemont" carbine variant, which would be better done as a M1847 carbine or musketoon.

 

[Jobe Holiday]

The problem with producing a M-1847 Musketoon or Carbine is that they require M-1841 Cadet sized locks and trigger guards. The large M-1842 parts are not suitable for the 1847 Models.

The "Fremont Special Model 1842" was supposed to have been made by Springfield Armory in 1847 for one of Fremont's Expeditions. This just can't be because the rear sight, which you see on it, wasn't produced until the mid-1850's!
J.

 

[Old Hickory]

You can buy an original for $495.00. Why bother with a re-pop? Just go to fulmersantiqueguns.com and get an original Aston model 1842. Yup, $495.00 and shipping's what he wants for it.

 

[Jobe Holiday]

Must be the N-SSA boys haven't seen this one yet!
J.

 

[Old Hickory]

Must be the N-SSA boys haven't seen this one yet!
J.

I think he just put it up today.

 

[Spunk Puppy]

That is a good price, but with a non-correct rammer.

Trust me, I've looked far and wide for an 1842 pistol in shooting condition. Non can be found for less than about $850 that hasn't been sanded down to hell and is rusted over... even those come in around $700 and up.

 

[Old Hickory]

For $495.00 I think I could make due with an incorrect rammer for a time, or I'd just turn a correct one on a lathe if it bothered me that much.

 

[Spunk Puppy]

Thanks, gang.

I guess I'll have to make due with my percussion converted Harper's Ferry horse pistol, which is a most excellent gun, though I have my doubts that these were much used during the ACW. Still a great fun at the range though.

 

[Southern Articifer]

A re-pro of the M1842 pistol isn't a bad idea. We'll have to wait and see how that goes. Many of my friends and myself in the NSSA and the A.C.W.S.A shoot originals. The most favorite pistol is the M1842 - either the H. Aston or the I.N. Johnson. Also, the model M1836 A. Waters or R. Johnson altered to percussion by various systems. There are very few, myself included, that shoot the M1836 in original flint. Both models are regulation .054 cal., but we find quite a variance in their actual bore size. A range of .0535 to .0562 has been noted. This is partially due to wear and age and original tolerances allowed in the boring process. What this means, is with the original pistols you will have to shop around for a bullet mold that fits your particular pistol. Worth noting, some have had theirs re-lined by Hoyt to .054. I believe he charges $85.00 for the pistols. We have also found it necessary to shim the full cock on the tumblers as the originals have heavy trigger pulls. Other than that, they're great. However, the new percussion M1805 H.F. is pretty nice. The guys are also using these and getting good scores. Here are the 2 pistols I shoot:

 

[Spunk Puppy]

A re-pro of the M1842 pistol isn't a bad idea. We'll have to wait and see how that goes. Many of my friends and myself in the NSSA and the A.C.W.S.A shoot originals. The most favorite pistol is the M1842 - either the H. Aston or the I.N. Johnson. Also, the model M1836 A. Waters or R. Johnson altered to percussion by various systems. There are very few, myself included, that shoot the M1836 in original flint. Both models are regulation .054 cal., but we find quite a variance in their actual bore size. A range of .0535 to .0562 has been noted. This is partially due to wear and age and original tolerances allowed in the boring process. What this means, is with the original pistols you will have to shop around for a bullet mold that fits your particular pistol. Worth noting, some have had theirs re-lined by Hoyt to .054. I believe he charges $85.00 for the pistols. We have also found it necessary to shim the full cock on the tumblers as the originals have heavy trigger pulls. Other than that, they're great. However, the new percussion M1805 H.F. is pretty nice. The guys are also using these and getting good scores. Here are the 2 pistols I shoot:
View attachment 90003

Very neat! I would love to hear more about your competitions with these guns. I would love to enter the N-SSA for the smoothbore pistol match but here in Kansas, there is no N-SSA entities that I'm aware of, a great shame.

I wish I could find an M1842 in good shooting condition for a reasonable price. All the online auction sites seem high.

 

[tbuckley]

That is a good price, but with a non-correct rammer.

Trust me, I've looked far and wide for an 1842 pistol in shooting condition. Non can be found for less than about $850 that hasn't been sanded down to hell and is rusted over... even those come in around $700 and up.

That is the original rammer, it's just backwards.

 

[Spunk Puppy]

That is the original rammer, it's just backwards.

Oh... that makes sense! Looks like somebody else snagged it though.

 

[frontrank2]

My Uncle Frank had one of these in his collection. A couple of years after he died, an antique dealer paid my Aunt Martha a visit and purchased this pistol and a couple of other old guns for a less than fair market share. I would've loved to buy that gun myself. Aunt Martha wouldn't sell him the 1808 Springfield flintlock rifle. The dealer told her it was worth $300 but she wasn't interested. After she passed, I inherited it.

 

[Southern Articifer]

That is the original rammer, it's just backwards.

Well no, its not on backwards. These hinged rammers are direction specific. If put on backwards, they will not fold in a smooth arc and the ramrod will not go back in the ramrod channel full length. The one on my pistol was drilled and tapped on the wrong side - a Monday morning / Friday afternoon piece of work. However, it did get the sub-inspector stamp on the back side of the hinge link. There are a very very few of these I've seen that have this fault. I've thought about replacing it for cosmetic purposes with a re-pro which have the screw on the correct side but then my original cleaning tools will not fit the modern threads at the end of the ramrod as they do now. Which brings up a point, would these type of details be noted on a re-pro M1836 or M1842?

 

[Spunk Puppy]

This brings up a question from me: does anyone have ANY literature on these guns? I've yet to find a single book on the subject of these kinds of pistols... a shame indeed. There are tons of books on the old Colt revolvers, but not one the single shot military pistols that preceded them. I find this to be unfortunate.

 

[Old Hickory]

I don't hold much interest in single shot pistols myself, so I don't search out information on them, however Fladerman's would have at least a few paragraphs on them as well as other single shot American military pistols. Pick up a copy, but don't trust the prices as they tend to be out of date before the books are printed. There may also be bibliographies noted where you can find more information in the back.

 

[Southern Articifer]

This brings up a question from me: does anyone have ANY literature on these guns? I've yet to find a single book on the subject of these kinds of pistols... a shame indeed. There are tons of books on the old Colt revolvers, but not one the single shot military pistols that preceded them. I find this to be unfortunate.

While there's no book dedicated to the M1836 and M1842, there are a few that devote chapters and several pages to these pistols plus much more on U.S. military firearms in detail. The best I've found that details the afore mentioned pistols is "Historic Pistols, The American Martial Flintlock 1760-1845" by S. Smith and E. Bitter. Next is, "U.S. Military Small Arms 1816-1865"by R. Reilly - chapter 5 - Hand guns. There's a lot about the M1842 pistols in there. Also, "U.S. Military Firearms" by Maj. J. Hicks. It's an older book but covers the pistols we've been discussing. Again, in the matter of a re-pro of a M1842 any company making a copy should study these listings as well as original pieces. I'd also like to note auction catalogs are an excellent source of research for these pistols. There are literally 100's of these I've seen in catalogs over the years.