Lost Fleet....CSS Virginia II

[5fish]

Here is a link the Lost Fleet or James River Squadron which was sunk in the latter days of the war. There was a CSS Virginia II was one of the ironclads in the squadron. Why she go out and take on the union blockade fleet like her name sake did? She was suppose to be similar in design to her name sake.


http://www.numa.net/expeditions/lost-confederate-fleet/

 

[TinCan]

Those would be very interesting dives.

 

[ErnieMac]

Interesting - thanks for posting. Quite a bit of good info concerning Civil War era vessels on a number of the other links.

 

[rebelatsea]

Here she is. Her official name was CSS Virginia. The II is a relatively modern addition usually used to distinguish between her an

d her more famous forebear.

 

[5fish]

The Confedecary had three ironclads and did little with them. The CSS Fredrickburg at least had a few gunboat battles but the other two kept running around. The James River Squadron had three ironclads an achieved little with them.

 

[AndyHall]

If NUMA is looking for it, the Lost Confederate Fleet is likely to stay lost.

 

[rebelatsea]

The Confedecary had three ironclads and did little with them. The CSS Fredrickburg at least had a few gunboat battles but the other two kept running around. The James River Squadron had three ironclads an achieved little with them.

Put that down to the Flag officers - Mitchell virtually had to be forced to act. Semmes was the only aggressive Commander and he arrived far too late.

 

[rebelatsea]

If NUMA is looking for it, the Lost Confederate Fleet is likely to stay lost.

The locations of all three wrecks are already known Andy.

 

[rebelatsea]

Here she is. Her official name was CSS Virginia. The II is a relatively modern addition usually used to distinguish between her anView attachment 73159 d her more famous forebear.

BTW the two lines aft of the casemate are not rudder cables, there should be two in the equivalent position forward of the casemate too, they mark the edges of the centre portion of the cambered deck.

 

[5fish]

One can say by the time the Confederacy had three ironclads the Union navy had many more then that. Maybe its a case of to little to late for the Confederacy in the James river and Chesapeake Bay area.

 

[Jamieva]

It was important to locate them because the Port of Richmond, which is a deep water port, is further upstream from Drewry's Bluff. Didn't want any of these big ocean going vessels hitting them.

 

[rebelatsea]

One can say by the time the Confederacy had three ironclads the Union navy had many more then that. Maybe its a case of to little to late for the Confederacy in the James river and Chesapeake Bay area.

Indeed yes, but at the time of the Trents Reach fight ,they only had a double turret monitor and USS ex CSS Atlanta on the James.

 

[rebelatsea]

It was important to locate them because the Port of Richmond, which is a deep water port, is further upstream from Drewry's Bluff. Didn't want any of these big ocean going vessels hitting them.

I believe they are all located and buried in what is now a cut off from the James.

 

[Mark F. Jenkins]

I had some minor correspondence a few years back with a diver that was planning on diving on the wrecks. I never heard anything more about it, so I'm guessing nothing ever came of it.

 

[Dilandu]

The Confedecary had three ironclads and did little with them. The CSS Fredrickburg at least had a few gunboat battles but the other two kept running around. The James River Squadron had three ironclads an achieved little with them.

They have really unlucky day at Trent's Reach. It was the clear demonstration of Murphy's law; everything that could gone wrong - gone wrong, and the (numerically) superior Confederasy Squadron pointless poked the obtackles, recieved a good dose of Dahlgrens, and widthrew.

 

[Dilandu]

Actually, it's quite interesting, what could be the day of 24 january 1865, if the Confederacy fleet was able to breach the obstructions in time, without running around the most powerfull ships? They have three ironclads, five gunboats and three torpedo boats against Union's "Onondaga", "Spuyten Duyvil" and two gunboats. Of course, "Onondaga" was the formidable opponent, and Jame's River Squyadron would, probably, unable to use all numerical superiority due to limited area in river... but still interesting!

 

[rebelatsea]

Actually, it's quite interesting, what could be the day of 24 january 1865, if the Confederacy fleet was able to breach the obstructions in time, without running around the most powerfull ships? They have three ironclads, five gunboats and three torpedo boats against Union's "Onondaga", "Spuyten Duyvil" and two gunboats. Of course, "Onondaga" was the formidable opponent, and Jame's River Squyadron would, probably, unable to use all numerical superiority due to limited area in river... but still interesting!

Onondaga apparently had to run down river so she had enough room to turn and enter the fight.

 

[Mark F. Jenkins]

Onondaga apparently had to run down river so she had enough room to turn and enter the fight.

Or so that was William A. Parker's assertion...

I've mentioned elsewhere that I playtested a minatures rule set at a local game shop a number of years ago-- I don't think the rule set ever saw publication, but it used the Thoroughbred 1:600 range-- and I had the Fredericksburg and Richmond, another fellow had the Virginia II, and the Union player was given the Onondaga and (ahistorically) the Atlanta. If the results were anything to go by, I think we proved that, if the Confederate ironclads don't have trouble with grounding and if their attack is pressed home. they could break through to City Point. As the scenario played out, Virginia II drew off Onondaga, while my two ironclads did not pause to engage either Union ironclad but just fired on the fly as they charged downriver.

I wonder how it would have gone had Semmes been in command, rather than Mitchell. But it's definitely true that the Confederate James River ironclads had challenges maneuvering in "their own" river.

 

[JeffBrooks]

If they had gotten to City Point, what would have happened? The place was so packed with logistics for Grant's army that every cannon shot the Southerners fired into the place would have caused damage. I would imagine that they would have concentrated their fire on the docks and any ammunition depots they could spot. But wouldn't the Yankees have pretty substantial heavy artillery in the area to pound the ships until they were rattled to pieces? Would this be the equivalent of a suicide mission?

 

[Mark F. Jenkins]

If they had gotten to City Point, what would have happened? The place was so packed with logistics for Grant's army that every cannon shot the Southerners fired into the place would have caused damage. I would imagine that they would have concentrated their fire on the docks and any ammunition depots they could spot. But wouldn't the Yankees have pretty substantial heavy artillery in the area to pound the ships until they were rattled to pieces? Would this be the equivalent of a suicide mission?

It would have been a situation much as Lt. Isaac N. Brown said of his run of the Arkansas through the Federal fleets above Vicksburg; they would have been "without fear of hitting a friend or missing a foe." They could have caused a massive amount of damage. Whether they could have then ascended the river again to regain Richmond, though, is another question.