Learning languages/phrases for units?

[WestCoastSB]

Hey folks, as an extremely amateur philologist/language learner, I am wondering if any units have taken on the challenge of learning languages associated with their respective units? I am learning Irish Gaelic and French.

Or, have you taken up learning time period dialect?

 

[marktwainenjoyer]

I have to write an entire novel in time period dialect and I'm just about tearing my hair out. -_-

 

[WestCoastSB]

I have to write an entire novel in time period dialect and I'm just about tearing my hair out. -_-

I am definitely intrigued!!

 

[FedericoFCavada]

Hey folks, as an extremely amateur philologist/language learner, I am wondering if any units have taken on the challenge of learning languages associated with their respective units? I am learning Irish Gaelic and French.

Or, have you taken up learning time period dialect?

I've got a bit of Spanish, and a measure of Portuguese... I've been trying my hand at German for quite some time, and I've been doing my level best to try to figure out Suetterlin Schrift and Kurrentschrift... Turned my hair gray!

I can't say that I've made much headway. I do have a pre-Civil War replica/reenactment uniform almost finished. The idea is that it will portray a German-speaking Texas Confederate unit: Company B of the Third Volunteer Infantry, which was equipped for in-state service with all of the stuff looted, erm, uh, "liberated" from the Federal posts commanded by David Emanuel Twiggs. This was an all-German-speaking outfit. Company F, commanded by Manuel Yturri Castillo II spoke Spanish.

 

[WestCoastSB]

I have to write an entire novel in time period dialect and I'm just about tearing my hair out. -_-

Normally speaking, how does one prepare suitable dialogue for a historical fictional novel? Primary resources, of course, but typically journals, diaries, newspapers, etc?

 

[johan_steele]

I am fluent in English, bad English, drunkennesse and GI. I've found that has prepared me well enough.

 

[7thWisconsin]

I learned Russian in order to be a better Soviet WW2 reenactor.

 

[The Ninth Ohio]

My BA is in German Lit. I drilled our guys in German and IDed about half a dozen songs the Ninth would have sung. I also prepared the cultural research for a group to portray the 24th IL at Perryville a couple years ago.

Fair warning - there seems to be a sentiment amongst people who study history and within the living history hobby, both authentic and mainstream, that you can portray a "German" by learning a couple phrases, drinking some beer, eating some wurst. However, German cultures were (and still often are) very different, not just from American, but from each other as well. This sort of impression takes a huge commitment of time and effort to do correctly, and while that may be fine with you, it may be a difficult proposition to get others to buy into that effort.

At Perryville, the effort to provide German context was largely wasted because the aggregate didn't feel it was important enough to get the cultural part right.

Imagine. The Hecker Regiment marching off to battle to the tune of "The Girl I Left Behind Me."

Good luck.

 

[The Ninth Ohio]

I've got a bit of Spanish, and a measure of Portuguese... I've been trying my hand at German for quite some time, and I've been doing my level best to try to figure out Suetterlin Schrift and Kurrentschrift... Turned my hair gray!

I can't say that I've made much headway. I do have a pre-Civil War replica/reenactment uniform almost finished. The idea is that it will portray a German-speaking Texas Confederate unit: Company B of the Third Volunteer Infantry, which was equipped for in-state service with all of the stuff looted, erm, uh, "liberated" from the Federal posts commanded by David Emanuel Twiggs. This was an all-German-speaking outfit. Company F, commanded by Manuel Yturri Castillo II spoke Spanish.
View attachment 497684

Practice makes perfect! We need more people like you - there are thousands upon thousands of pages from the Civil War era written in Kurrentschrift that have gone completely untouched and not studied.

I would suggest Witter's Schreib- und Lese-Fibel. It has worked very well for me.

 

[Story]

Start here

Google Translate

Google's service, offered free of charge, instantly translates words, phrases, and web pages between English and over 100 other languages.

translate.google.com

Google Translate

Google's service, offered free of charge, instantly translates words, phrases, and web pages between English and over 100 other languages.

translate.google.com

If you lived long enough, you can expand your vocabulary​

 

[FedericoFCavada]

Practice makes perfect! We need more people like you - there are thousands upon thousands of pages from the Civil War era written in Kurrentschrift that have gone completely untouched and not studied.

I would suggest Witter's Schreib- und Lese-Fibel. It has worked very well for me.

View attachment 497716

View attachment 497717

View attachment 497718

View attachment 497720

Vielen dank!

 

[FedericoFCavada]

My BA is in German Lit. I drilled our guys in German and IDed about half a dozen songs the Ninth would have sung. I also prepared the cultural research for a group to portray the 24th IL at Perryville a couple years ago.

Fair warning - there seems to be a sentiment amongst people who study history and within the living history hobby, both authentic and mainstream, that you can portray a "German" by learning a couple phrases, drinking some beer, eating some wurst. However, German cultures were (and still often are) very different, not just from American, but from each other as well. This sort of impression takes a huge commitment of time and effort to do correctly, and while that may be fine with you, it may be a difficult proposition to get others to buy into that effort.

At Perryville, the effort to provide German context was largely wasted because the aggregate didn't feel it was important enough to get the cultural part right.

Imagine. The Hecker Regiment marching off to battle to the tune of "The Girl I Left Behind Me."

Good luck.

Most contemporary U.S. service men who spent time in Germany were in Bavaria, so bier, wurst, pretzels, lederhosen und so weiter is a fairly common impression of German culture.

In central Texas, there were areas settled by people from the Rhineland and other spots. I was helping some family history researchers and I was astounded that their ancestors came from the North Sea coast of what is now Nedersachsen. I was researching a man who wrote about the mid-to-late-19th century German community that settled in Grand Prairie between Fort Worth and Dallas in North Texas/ baja Oklahoma, and he was actually from near Hanseatic Rostock in Mecklenburg-Vorpommern on the Baltic Sea coast. Still another woman in cowboy cow town Bandera turned out to have ancestors from literally Berlin... So it is odd to see where people came from. In one case, I found some Elsass/Alsace immigrants who'd come over via New Orleans because one of their sons--I suspect he was a "48-er"--had gone to the US, and being without prospects, he'd joined the army and been shipped off to West Texas as a baker for the U.S. Army. He died by gunshot--no idea about the circumstances--but only after his eldest sister had married the bugler from the 8th U.S. infantry regiment. That guy was a German immigrant. They relocated to San Antonio, Texas, where he became a music teacher.

In Gillespie County, Texas, there is Fredericksburg, which was making treaties with Comanche in the late 1840s. Some traveler's accounts of 19th-century Texas have it that in San Antonio the most commonly heard language after Spanish was actually German, with English a distant third! I think a great many forum members here know about the "Treue der Union" monument built immediately after the Civil War to honor the memory of Unionists killed by Texas Rangers attempting to go to Mexico, take a ship from Matamoros to Union-occupied New Orleans, and enlist in the U.S. army. That is in Comfort, Texas. The original "free thinker" settlers there tried to name the place "Gemuetlichkeit" but obviously none of their neighbors could pronounce it, let alone spell it... So "Comfort" it became.

 

[The Ninth Ohio]

Most contemporary U.S. service men who spent time in Germany were in Bavaria, so bier, wurst, pretzels, lederhosen und so weiter is a fairly common impression of German culture.

In central Texas, there were areas settled by people from the Rhineland and other spots. I was helping some family history researchers and I was astounded that their ancestors came from the North Sea coast of what is now Nedersachsen. I was researching a man who wrote about the mid-to-late-19th century German community that settled in Grand Prairie between Fort Worth and Dallas in North Texas/ baja Oklahoma, and he was actually from near Hanseatic Rostock in Mecklenburg-Vorpommern on the Baltic Sea coast. Still another woman in cowboy cow town Bandera turned out to have ancestors from literally Berlin... So it is odd to see where people came from. In one case, I found some Elsass/Alsace immigrants who'd come over via New Orleans because one of their sons--I suspect he was a "48-er"--had gone to the US, and being without prospects, he'd joined the army and been shipped off to West Texas as a baker for the U.S. Army. He died by gunshot--no idea about the circumstances--but only after his eldest sister had married the bugler from the 8th U.S. infantry regiment. That guy was a German immigrant. They relocated to San Antonio, Texas, where he became a music teacher.

In Gillespie County, Texas, there is Fredericksburg, which was making treaties with Comanche in the late 1840s. Some traveler's accounts of 19th-century Texas have it that in San Antonio the most commonly heard language after Spanish was actually German, with English a distant third! I think a great many forum members here know about the "Treue der Union" monument built immediately after the Civil War to honor the memory of Unionists killed by Texas Rangers attempting to go to Mexico, take a ship from Matamoros to Union-occupied New Orleans, and enlist in the U.S. army. That is in Comfort, Texas. The original "free thinker" settlers there tried to name the place "Gemuetlichkeit" but obviously none of their neighbors could pronounce it, let alone spell it... So "Comfort" it became.

Very cool. Being from the Midwest, Texas Germans have always been a bit of a curiosity to me. I do not know much about them, but am glad there are those doing work on them! I'm currently working on my MA in History (going back to school after 20 years), writing about the Ohio German regiments.

 

[thomas aagaard]

we reenact the 15th Wisconsin. Sure 80% where Norwegians, but back then the difference between Norwegian and Danish was really not bigger than the regional differences. The way people in Christiania (Oslo) was likely closer to danish than the Norwegian of northren Norway.
And the biggest issue is the change in language from then to now anyway.

So we speak Danish and instruct in Danish, but the command language is still English... just like they did back then.

At our main drill event last year we had a group of Germans participate. They basically did the same. Reenact a germen unit, speak German, instruct in German, but command in English with an accent.

 

[The Ninth Ohio]

we reenact the 15th Wisconsin. Sure 80% where Norwegians, but back then the difference between Norwegian and Danish was really not bigger than the regional differences. The way people in Christiania (Oslo) was likely closer to danish than the Norwegian of northren Norway.
And the biggest issue is the change in language from then to now anyway.

So we speak Danish and instruct in Danish, but the command language is still English... just like they did back then.

At our main drill event last year we had a group of Germans participate. They basically did the same. Reenact a germen unit, speak German, instruct in German, but command in English with an accent.

Yep, the vast majority as far as I've seen simply adopted whatever manner of drill they were ordered to. I've only been able to verify two regiments using Prussian drill/German language, and perhaps a handful more that I'm still researching.

That is very interesting about Norwegian and Danish being so similar back then. How similar are the languages?