NF Irrelevant Gettysburg Scenes

[KianGaf]

I'm watching the movie for the 100th time I'll make no apologies for that , I just love it. I've watched the normal release and the directors version. In both versions there are quiet a few useless scenes that add nothing. I've no issues with the movie being long as I'd watch it all the live long day as the Calvary would say. The most irrelevant scene in my opinion would be after Chamberlain meets with Joseph Bucklin. After the meeting a soldier walks up to chamberlain informally which I'd say wasn't the case in the day and introduces a young soldier who is the best at cussing in Maine. It's make no sense and adds nothing to the story I don't understand what Ron Maxwel thought it added even to the directors cut.

 

[Cavalier]

You are not alone watching it 100 times or more. Been watching it since it was released, first the theater, then the video, now the dvd. However its the battle scenes I'm most interested in. I am not crazy about Shaara's take on Lee, Longstreet and Stuart but you can't have everything can you. I am glad to know I'm the only one with this addiction.

John

 

[danny]

It's the continual dialogue between Chamberlain and the Irish guy that wears on me.

And, I think the recurring emphasis on "is this good ground" is overplayed

IMO

 

[John Hartwell]

Well, pvt Bucklin's role was to explain (none too accurately, as it turns out) the motives of the unwilling 'hot-heads' from the 2nd Maine. So, the scene wasn't really irrelevant. The other (Dan Burns, whose Preacher father "knows more fine cuss words than any man in Maine") was just a bit of comic relief, something to smile at.

More irrelevant was much of the annoying "'round the campfire" stuff involving Pickett, Kemper, Fremantle, etc, etc. Though that, too, served as comic relief. "On just which side of your family are you descended from a ape, George?"
And Harrison, the spy, coming to Longstreet asking to be given a musket is just silly.

I will add that I think the battle scenes were a good bit too long. And, just how many times do the first lines of Pickett's troops (seen from a variety of different angles) pass out of the woods and through the line of artillery? 3? 4? 5? But, I do understand: they spent so much money for all those people and all that footage that they wanted to use it somewhere.

But, lets face it, if any of those "irrelevant" scenes were removed, we'd miss them.

 

[JerseyBart]

JEB and Lee scene...never happened and has likely caused a lot of grief for people trying to explain the situation realistically.

 

[Jamieva]

Well, pvt Bucklin's role was to explain (none too accurately, as it turns out) the motives of the unwilling 'hot-heads' from the 2nd Maine. So, the scene wasn't really irrelevant. The other (Dan Burns, whose Preacher father "knows more fine cuss words than any man in Maine") was just a bit of comic relief, something to smile at.

More irrelevant was much of the annoying "'round the campfire" stuff involving Pickett, Kemper, Fremantle, etc, etc. Though that, too, served as comic relief. "On just which side of your family are you descended from a ape, George?"
And Harrison, the spy, coming to Longstreet asking to be given a musket is just silly.

I will add that I think the battle scenes were a good bit too long. And, just how many times do the first lines of Pickett's troops (seen from a variety of different angles) pass out of the woods and through the line of artillery? 3? 4? 5? But, I do understand: they spent so much money for all those people and all that footage that they wanted to use it somewhere.

But, lets face it, if any of those "irrelevant" scenes were removed, we'd miss them.

The Fremantle fire scene is insufferable.

 

[7thWisconsin]

Chamberlain et al walking by the random A tent with the lyre painted on it. I've never been able to figure out how those guys happen to fit into the story of a regiment marching to where it's going to fight.

 

[John Hartwell]

The Fremantle fire scene is insufferable.

Fremantle is portrayed as an "Upper Class Twit."

 

[mofederal]

I miss the long version of Gettysburg they used to show on TNT around Jul 4th. It had more footage in it than the Director's Cut does. I really liked to watch it. Then poof! They no longer show it. The did the same thing with Midway, making it longer with the cut out footage. I liked that they showed the Battle of Coral Sea. I was in it, and I enjoy the longer versions of it.

 

[KianGaf]

Fremantle is portrayed as an "Upper Class Twit."

I must read up more on the real man. If he bought his commission like a lot of upper class or Gentlemen as they were known then he probably was an upper class Twit. I'd consider a few of his scenes as padding to the story aswell.

 

[rebelatsea]

Arthur Fremantle was a professional soldier from a distinguished family. It was a meeting with Raphael Semmes in Gibraltar which prompted him to request leave of absence to go to America. Oddly he was sympathetic to the Union in his own words with a dislike of slavery but entered the war through the South. His actual status is very peculiar, not having official status and thus in modern terms "a tourist" of sorts. Nonetheless he left England in the Royal Mail Steamer Atrato and landed in Matamoros from HMS Immortalite, crossing the border into Texas at Brownsville.

I must read up more on the real man. If he bought his commission like a lot of upper class or Gentlemen as they were known then he probably was an upper class Twit. I'd consider a few of his scenes as padding to the story aswell.

He wrote a book "Three Months in the Southern States" based on his diary. Unfortunately I don't know who the publishers here were, but it was printed in Mobile by S.H. Goetzel & Co. in 1864.

 

[KianGaf]

https://read.amazon.co.uk/kp/embed?...linkCode=kpe&ref_=cm_sw_r_kb_dp_KyQhFbJWT6ZAF

They have the book on Amazon.

 

[Blockaderunner]

Available to read free here: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/20928/20928-h/20928-h.htm

Well worth a look. An entertaining read.

 

[KianGaf]

Available to read free here: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/20928/20928-h/20928-h.htm

Well worth a look. An entertaining read.

Excellent , that was a good find.

 

[Llewellyn]

Having the Fremantle character allows the director to explain events and Lee's strategy to the movie audience in the guise of explanatory conversation between Longstreet/Berenger and the slightly-out-of-touch Brit. It's a pretty common theatrical device.

Having said that, the portrayal of the man is teeth-clenchingly stereotypical. No doubt the actor, James Lancaster, was taking direction, but as a Brit I am always relieved when the movie narrative moves on.

Fremantle did not wear uniform at the battle; even so, the clobber that the movie costume department have him rigged up in is way, way off the mark.

Chances are that Fremantle had purchased his commission and advancement, and it is undeniable that the system led to incompetents achieving rank that they could never have achieved by ability alone. By 1863, though, the system was on its last legs, having been seen to fail disastrously in the Crimea. It would be abolished in 1871, but it's true to say that even though commission by purchase was no more, social status and family connections counted for a lot in the selection of British officers for many decades to come.

 

[KianGaf]

His account is well worth a read. It's been very enjoyable so far. I find reading in on the laptop very handy as I can have google maps open. I'm not that familiar with the locations he describes so it helps to better visualise where he is.

 

[Patrick H]

I completely agree with @John Hartwell about all the campfire chat. In fact, a lot of the chat throughout the movie was an utter bore to me. I know a lot of it was written to explain to the viewer what they were about to see, why it was important to get into thus and such a position, when the long range artillery was going to open up, who belonged to whose corps, which soldier came from which fine family, etc. etc. etc. etc. ...but a lot of it dragged on and on. On the other hand, the sheer spectacle of a lot of this movie just left me awed and amazed. I have often said of this movie and of "Lincoln" that they're good movies and could be MUCH better if they were each edited to be about an hour shorter. Don't mistake me for an all-action fan. I despise more current movies that are too fast paced and look like video games.

 

[KianGaf]

Its amazing what Ron Maxwell thought what was important and what wasn't. Id question the fact that George Meade gets around ten seconds of screen time. I'm not sure how much he gets mentioned in the source material as I haven't read the Killer Angels.

 

[Llewellyn]

The scene where Tom Chamberlain speaks to three Confederate prisoners, ("See you in hell, Billy Yank," etc.) based on Winslow Homer's painting "Prisoners From the Front" always strikes me as very effective, though the inspiration for the painting was an incident which took place a year later, at Petersburg.

Bondarchuk had done something very similar in 1970 in Waterloo, where some parts of the charge of the Scots Greys are an immaculate reconstruction of an 1881 painting by Elizabeth, Lady Butler. Her viewpoint was directly in front of the charging horses, and Bondarchuk managed to get his camera in a similar position.

There are a few movies where an actual incident captured by an artist or a camera is faithfully reproduced (raising Old Glory on Iwo Jima has been done a few times, for example.)

I wonder what influenced Maxwell to set up the prisoner scene ?

 

[Kurt G]

The scene where Tom Chamberlain speaks to three Confederate prisoners, ("See you in hell, Billy Yank," etc.) based on Winslow Homer's painting "Prisoners From the Front" always strikes me as very effective, though the inspiration for the painting was an incident which took place a year later, at Petersburg.

Bondarchuk had done something very similar in 1970 in Waterloo, where some parts of the charge of the Scots Greys are an immaculate reconstruction of an 1881 painting by Elizabeth, Lady Butler. Her viewpoint was directly in front of the charging horses, and Bondarchuk managed to get his camera in a similar position.

There are a few movies where an actual incident captured by an artist or a camera is faithfully reproduced (raising Old Glory on Iwo Jima has been done a few times, for example.)

I wonder what influenced Maxwell to set up the prisoner scene ?

Those slow motion shots of the Scots Greys were amazing.