Help..Do Drummer Boys have records?

[ARW]

I have a new mystery to solve and hope someone has an idea to help me. I have a cousin 3x removed, Horace Furman, who has a Veteran 1861-1865 marker on his tombstone. This picture is from Find a Grave and they list him as Pvt. Since my son lives need this cemetery he checked and verified the marker is there. First problem he was born April 4, 1851, you can do the math. I have searched the Penn State CW Database and do not find him. His brother and all their cousins are there. Also searched for a PA Veterans card but nothing there. There is a possibility it is there by mistake. There was a Horace in the 105 PVI but his widow applied for a pension in Iowa before this Horace died in PA and it is the wrong wife name.
I have not done research on musicians in the war so need some advice. Since he was underage I think this might be a place to look. Were drummer boys put on the regimental records? Did some regiments just look the other way? Appreciate any thoughts you might have.

 

[Jimklag]

Only if they've been convicted.

 

[John Winn]

I'm not really familiar with the records of young musicians but I did research one veteran who initially enlisted as a musician at 14. Because he thought his father would come get him he used an alias. In his pension application he said that about a month after he enlisted his regiment decided they had too many drummers and so they sent him to another regiment. There he was given a rifle and was recorded as a private. He remained a private to the end of the war and fought in quite a few big battles.

So, there's one documented case of a drummer of a young age having an official record.

In Oregon all the surviving G.A.R. records are digitized and can be searched. Perhaps you could see if you can find any local chapter records. Also, make sure you look for newspaper stores mentioning him. Lots of times the old vets were noted when they participated in reunions, parades, G.A.R. functions, and the like. Obituaries of that era almost always mentioned it if a man was a veteran, sometimes even providing some detail and/or G.A.R. chapter membership. A month's subscription to newspapers.com is only about $8; might be worth the gamble. Oh, and if your county has an historical society contact them and see what they can find.

Good luck on your hunt.

 

[tbuckley]

In the rosters of Ohio regiments, drummers would be listed as musicians. Maybe Pennsylvania did the same.

 

[John Hartwell]

All musicians, including drummer boys, should have service records within their respective regiments, and they should be named in the CSR index cards.The only Horace in the Pa. regiments was the Sgt of the 105th you already found (curiously even with the same middle initial), and he died in Iowa in 1892.

Are you certain your Horace H. was an ACW veteran? His grave is marked by a GAR flag holder, but these can easily be moved to an incorrect grave by error or vandalism. I suggest your best bet might be to contact the Cemetery Commissioners (or whatever title they go by), to find out why the grave is being decorated -- if it's a mistake, it should show in their records.

Otherwise, he may have enlisted under an alias, or served with a regiment from another state. If he, for instance, ran away from home to enlist, he might well have done both.

I also find no obituary in a search of the genealogybank.com newspaper archive (which includes a Danville paper of the period), though I do find notices of the administration and audit of his estate in April-June, 1905.

 

[ARW]

All musicians, including drummer boys, should have service records within their respective regiments, and they should be named in the CSR index cards.The only Horace in the Pa. regiments was the Sgt of the 105th you already found (curiously even with the same middle initial), and he died in Iowa in 1892.

Are you certain your Horace H. was an ACW veteran? His grave is marked by a GAR flag holder, but these can easily be moved to an incorrect grave by error or vandalism. I suggest your best bet might be to contact the Cemetery Commissioners (or whatever title they go by), to find out why the grave is being decorated -- if it's a mistake, it should show in their records.

Otherwise, he may have enlisted under an alias, or served with a regiment from another state. If he, for instance, ran away from home to enlist, he might well have done both.

I also find no obituary in a search of the genealogybank.com newspaper archive (which includes a Danville paper of the period), though I do find notices of the administration and audit of his estate in April-June, 1905.

Our thought is this could be a mistake. Don't think it is a GAR marker as it only has "Veteran 1861-1865" on it. If he is a vet he may not have joined the GAR. He has a cousin who we recently found enlisted under his mother's family name. Just dumb luck on that one as he also changed his first name.
The 105th was organized in Pittsburgh and this Furman family is from the other side of the state so don't think there is a connection.
Not sure who takes care of this cemetery, have to research that as well. Sometimes it is best to walk away and come back later with a clear mind.






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[Seduzal]

That's an interesting question? I have no idea how to answer it...

 

[BrianB]

(a) Civil War musicians, even young ones, were properly enlisted and borne on muster rolls. So, there would be a CMSR for him

(b) He could have served under an alias - but I find no pension card cross-referencing an alias. He could have served, but never applied for a pension.

(c) Could he have served in the Spanish American War?

 

[ARW]

Thanks to everyone who replied. I am coming to the conclusion that he did not serve and that somehow that flag marker was put there by mistake. There is no trace of him anywhere in military records. I do not think he was in the Spanish War as he was a widow with two young kids at that time. After some research I know more about his son than I do about him. His son worked the oil fields in OK, was a Sergeant in WWI and is buried in the National Cemetery in Los Angeles. Looks like his son was never married as all the documents I have found always list different people as contacts but never a wife.
All that said I am not just writing him off yet. I have a lot of other ancestors that took me years to find what I was looking for. Keep those ideas coming.......I live for the hunt,

 

[AbramSam]

My Ancestor enlisted at age 14. He is listed as "musician" in the regiment rolls. My 95 year old Great aunt tells us he was a drummer boy so it all seem to add up for us. Im sorry i should have added he was in a Pennsylvania regiment..that was the original question

 

[Badgercwcollector]

Did he belong to the Son's of Union Veterans (SUV) ?

 

[ARW]

Did he belong to the Son's of Union Veterans (SUV) ?

Don't think so. His father was not a Veteran.

 

[Zella]

I've had some musicians crop up in genealogy, but I don't think any of them were drummers. Found a fifer and a bugler. One Confederate and one Union, both had CSRs.

The best part is even with that "rich" musical heritage, I'm pretty much tone deaf.

 

[Lr60Cl30]

The answer is yes. 2g grandfather Pvt. George Washington Palmer, Co. I, 143rd Pa. Inf. was a drummer. Got permission to enlist from his father due to young age. Captured at Gettysburg and sent to Belle Isle. His brother was a drummer as well: Granville Palmer, Co. B, 152nd New York Inf. shell shocked at Petersburg. Lastly Pvt. Charles H. Warren (my surname), a very young bugler with Co. M, 15th Kansas Cavalry. Kicked by a horse and nearly blinded by dust from Price's raid. Records are readily available for young musicians.

 

[19thGeorgia]

He may have been simply hired as a musician and was not enlisted.

Cooks could be either enlisted or hired.

 

[ARW]

The answer is yes. 2g grandfather Pvt. George Washington Palmer, Co. I, 143rd Pa. Inf. was a drummer. Got permission to enlist from his father due to young age. Captured at Gettysburg and sent to Belle Isle. His brother was a drummer as well: Granville Palmer, Co. B, 152nd New York Inf. shell shocked at Petersburg. Lastly Pvt. Charles H. Warren (my surname), a very young bugler with Co. M, 15th Kansas Cavalry. Kicked by a horse and nearly blinded by dust from Price's raid. Records are readily available for young musicians.

Interesting. I had 3 cousins in the 143rd Co K at Gettysburg. Whenever I see someone else from the 143rd I have to wonder if they knew each other. They spent a lot of time just sitting around in camps over those years. The 143rd Pennsylvania entered the field at Gettysburg with 465 men. 21 were killed, 141 wounded, and 91 captured or missing for a total loss of 253 men.

 

[AbramSam]

The answer is yes. 2g grandfather Pvt. George Washington Palmer, Co. I, 143rd Pa. Inf. was a drummer. Got permission to enlist from his father due to young age. Captured at Gettysburg and sent to Belle Isle. His brother was a drummer as well: Granville Palmer, Co. B, 152nd New York Inf. shell shocked at Petersburg. Lastly Pvt. Charles H. Warren (my surname), a very young bugler with Co. M, 15th Kansas Cavalry. Kicked by a horse and nearly blinded by dust from Price's raid. Records are readily available for young musicians.

wow..that is fascinating..my 3g grandfather was a drummer in the 143 pa, Co G. Samuel C. Parks I feel Samuel & George would have to known each other and possibly spent some down time together?? They we probably close in age and had the same responsibilities...I never tire of the stories and information that fuels my imagination from this site...