Happy Juneteenth

Joined
Oct 3, 2005
The date in 1865 when United States troops announced the end of slavery in Texas. Recently there has been discussion of making it a national holiday to celebrate the end of slavery in the United States. I'm sure posters here will support further efforts to remember and honor the sacrifices of the Civil War generation.
 

JerseyBart

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I love seeing more employers adopting the holiday and would love to see more, and would love to see more state governments and eventually the federal government adopt this as a national holiday. It's a small measure and certainly life wasn't gravy after slavery ended for freed slaves and free African Americans in the country but I can envision many amazing commemorations in the future.
 

lupaglupa

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Apr 18, 2019
Archivists at the National Archives this past Thursday located an original copy of the orders proclaiming that slaves in Texas had been freed. The orders, dated June 19, 1865, were written in an order book that is currently stored in the Archives headquarters building. Handwritten by an aide, the orders were signed by Major F.W. Emery on behalf of Major General Gordon Granger. While later copies of the orders have long been known, this copy was written on the actual date the order was given, making it the original "Juneteenth" proclamation notice.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/hist...ail&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_mustreads
 

Carronade

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I find the phrase "the connection heretofore existing between them becomes that between employer and hired labor” intriguing, the assumption that slaves would continue working for their former master, just receiving a salary, and presumably free to terminate the relationship if they chose.

It would make sense in the short term to keep producing products that could benefit both parties, but it seems a bit naïve to believe that the new system would come into effect so easily.
 

Andersonh1

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If the United States wanted to adopt a holiday celebrating the end of slavery, choosing the date the 13th amendment was ratified makes far more sense to me. Juneteenth was a Texas event, while the 13th amendment affected the entire nation. Though at this late date, a century and a half after slavery has ended, I really don't see the point in observing either. For the people who experienced slavery and then saw it end, celebrating that made sense. For those of us who have never experienced American slavery, why would we observe the end of an institution no one alive has ever known?
 
Joined
Oct 3, 2005
Different arguments can be made for different dates. Juneteenth does have a pedigree, being celebrated in the 19th century which is a point in its favor.

Anderson1's point that no one alive has experienced American antebellum slavery, so why observe its end, I think I would disagree with.
1. The end of slavery meant the creation of a biracial republic we live in now.
2. None of us has experienced British colonial rule, yet we celebrate the 4th of July.
 

Andersonh1

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Anderson1's point that no one alive has experienced American antebellum slavery, so why observe its end, I think I would disagree with.
1. The end of slavery meant the creation of a biracial republic we live in now.
2. None of us has experienced British colonial rule, yet we celebrate the 4th of July.

My view on point #2 is that what we celebrate on 4th of July is our independence, our republic that we've managed to keep since 1776. We're celebrating something we have now as much as what happened then.

Slavery, on the other hand, is something we no longer have, and I'm not sure why we need to keep celebrating its demise at this point. I can see the point for people who lived through it and came out on the other side and experienced freedom to celebrate that transition, but why should people who have not experienced American slavery celebrate its demise? That's what I don't understand.

Independence Day observances apply to a state we all enjoy now. Juneteenth celebrates the end of something no one alive has experienced and never will. It's two different things.

Maybe you see Juneteenth as an Independence Day equivalent for our black population in the US?
 
Joined
Oct 3, 2005
My view on point #2 is that what we celebrate on 4th of July is our independence, our republic that we've managed to keep since 1776. We're celebrating something we have now as much as what happened then.

Slavery, on the other hand, is something we no longer have, and I'm not sure why we need to keep celebrating its demise at this point. I can see the point for people who lived through it and came out on the other side and experienced freedom to celebrate that transition, but why should people who have not experienced American slavery celebrate its demise? That's what I don't understand.

Independence Day observances apply to a state we all enjoy now. Juneteenth celebrates the end of something no one alive has experienced and never will. It's two different things.

Maybe you see Juneteenth as an Independence Day equivalent for our black population in the US?
Aren't we, in Juneteenth, celebrating freedom? A condition which we all enjoy now?

I like your last sentence, the 4th of July marks not just the end of British rule, but much more the creation of the United States. Juneteenth marks not just the end of enslavement, but the beginning of freedom. IMHO this was a sea change for the whole country. The change in status from enslaved to American citizen is a more profound one than from English subject to American citizen. I wouldn't want to be stuck being some version of Canada, but I really wouldn't want to live in a nation OK with chattel slavery.
 

ForeverFree

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My view on point #2 is that what we celebrate on 4th of July is our independence, our republic that we've managed to keep since 1776. We're celebrating something we have now as much as what happened then.

Slavery, on the other hand, is something we no longer have, and I'm not sure why we need to keep celebrating its demise at this point. I can see the point for people who lived through it and came out on the other side and experienced freedom to celebrate that transition, but why should people who have not experienced American slavery celebrate its demise? That's what I don't understand.

Aren't we, in Juneteenth, celebrating freedom? A condition which we all enjoy now?

I like your last sentence, the 4th of July marks not just the end of British rule, but much more the creation of the United States. Juneteenth marks not just the end of enslavement, but the beginning of freedom. IMHO this was a sea change for the whole country. The change in status from enslaved to American citizen is a more profound one than from English subject to American citizen. I wouldn't want to be stuck being some version of Canada, but I really wouldn't want to live in a nation OK with chattel slavery.

Matthew is spot on. Juneteenth is a celebration of freedom for all, which we have managed to keep since the end of the Civil War.

Independence Day observances apply to a state we all enjoy now. Juneteenth celebrates the end of something no one alive has experienced and never will. It's two different things. Maybe you see Juneteenth as an Independence Day equivalent for our black population in the US?

Everybody should celebrate it (or whatever holiday is locally appropriate), not just people who were formerly enslaved, not just descendants of the formerly enslaved. We should all join in celebrating the idea that this is a free country.

- Alan
 
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