French Frigate in the James River?

[Sid J.]

Mary Chestnut speaks of going downriver, presumably the James River, in December 1863 to see a French Frigate. Can anyone identify this ship and what it was doing there?

I am reading the 1905 edition A Diary from Dixie, the editors didn't add any comments about this. Does the Woodward edition add information in this regard?



Passage in question:

"The first of December we went with a party of Mrs.
Ould's getting up, to see a French frigate which lay at
anchor down the river. The French officers came on board
our boat. The Lees were aboard. The French officers were
not in the least attractive either in manners or appearance,
but our ladies were most attentive and some showered bad
French upon them with a lavish hand, always accompanied
by queer grimaces to eke out the scanty supply of French
words, the sentences ending usually in a nervous shriek.
"Are they deaf?" asked Mrs. Randolph.

The French frigate was a dirty little thing. Doctor
Garnett was so buoyed up with hope that the French were
coming to our rescue, that he would not let me say "an
English man-of-war is the cleanest thing known in the
world." Captain —— said to Mary Lee, with a foreign
contortion of countenance, that went for a smile, "I's
bashlor." Judge Ould said, as we went to dinner on our
own steamer, "They will not drink our President's health.
They do not acknowledge us to be a nation. Mind, none
of you say 'Emperor,' not once." Doctor Garnett interpreted
the laws of politeness otherwise, and stepped forward,
his mouth fairly distended with so much French, and
said: "Vieff l'Emperor[…]"

Excerpt From
A Diary from Dixie / As written by Mary Boykin Chesnut, wife of James Chesnut, Jr., United States Senator from South Carolina, 1859-1861, and afterward an Aide to Jefferson Davis and a Brigadier-General in the Confederate Army
Mary Boykin Chesnut
This material may be protected by copyright.

 

[RedRover]

The vessel in question was referenced in the Richmond Sentinel, Dec. 4, 1863 too...

 

[rebelatsea]

The only French Man of war that I know of in American water was the Chanticleer, which was a sloop of war and was supposed to be the station ship at Charleston. I say supposed to be because it seemed thar HMS Rinaldo did all the running about with communications to and from the British and French Consuls there.

 

[Story]

The only French Man of war that I know of in American water was the Chanticleer, which was a sloop of war and was supposed to be the station ship at Charleston. I say supposed to be because it seemed thar HMS Rinaldo did all the running about with communications to and from the British and French Consuls there.

The French ship might have removed itself from the bombardment in December 1863?
Charleston remained under intermittent bombardment from August 1863 until it was evacuated in February 1865. Though only five individuals would be killed by the cannonade, Charlestonians moved north of Calhoun Street and along the Ashley River. The downtown area became known as the "Shell District." The historic churches, houses, and graveyards were dam- aged and some destroyed by Union shells. When Jefferson Davis visited Charleston in November 1863, he declared that it was better to leave the city "a heap of ruins" than to surrender.

 

[archieclement]

Possibly French dispatch steamer Gassendi.

Lost Capitol Hill: The Visit of the Gassendi | The Hill is Home

Given that France was the first ally that the United States had, it is remarkable that it was not until the Civil War that a French warship visited the capital of the United States. However, this is exactly what the newspapers of the time insisted was the case when the Gassendi visited the...

thehillishome.com

It had also put in at Norfolk from where the diplomat proceeded to Richmond.

 

[Sid J.]

I found some things in the Naval OR I, vol 9.

NEWPORT NEWS, April 11, 1864-6 p.m.

Captain De Marivault, of the French man-of-war Tisiphone, called on me this morning.
The French man-of-war Grenade and one transport are also in the roads.
Captain D. expects another transport in a few days. He will be ready to go up James River with one transport day after
to morrow. He asks if he is at liberty to pass up when he is ready, and I have replied that he can go at the time mentioned …
Please instruct me if this movement of tobacco is to go on now, and
any report is required of quantity moved Each transport is to be towed by a French man-of-war. Genera Butler informed me the other day that he would telegraph the War Jepartment as to this movement of tobacco at this time, to which he said he had no objections.
Please reply by telegraph.

S. P. LEE,
Acting Rear-Admiral.


NAVY DEPARTMENT, April 15, 1864
The French tobacco question is with the State Department, and
requires no action from you.

GIDEON WELLES,
Secretary of Navy.

Acting Rear-Admiral S. P. LEE,
Comdg. North Atlantic Blockading Squadren, Hampton Roads.

 

[Sid J.]

The vessel in question was referenced in the Richmond Sentinel, Dec. 4, 1863 too...

View attachment 558380

That matches he time frame. This had to be with some sort of "flag of truce" arrangement between the belligerents.

 

[Sid J.]

Also this same volume

Report of Captain Gansevoort, U. S. Navy, regarding matters pertaining
to the squadron during the absence of Acting Rear-Admiral Lee.

U. S. IRONOLAD ROANOKE,

Newport News, Ta., January 8, 1864. ADMIrAL: I have the honor to report that everything is quiet here
since you left
• S. Sebago arrived here from New York, bound for the East Gulf Squadron; came in to correct her compasses
On December 23 the U.S. S. Grand Gulf arrived here …

On January 6 the French steam sloop of war Phlegeton arrived here
from the West Indies with stores for the Grenade and Tisiphone.

 

[Sid J.]

Also this same volume

Report of Captain Gansevoort, U. S. Navy, regarding matters pertaining
to the squadron during the absence of Acting Rear-Admiral Lee.

U. S. IRONOLAD ROANOKE,

Newport News, Ta., January 8, 1864. ADMIrAL: I have the honor to report that everything is quiet here
since you left
• S. Sebago arrived here from New York, bound for the East Gulf Squadron; came in to correct her compasses
On December 23 the U.S. S. Grand Gulf arrived here …

On January 6 the French steam sloop of war Phlegeton arrived here
from the West Indies with stores for the Grenade and Tisiphone.

This could mean either Grenade or Tisiphone could have been up the James River in December.

Did the US and the French have some sort of Tobacco export deal with the CSA?

 

[Rhea Cole]

Sidebar: Interesting incident involving foreign councilors & a British ship observing an attempt to break the Charleston blockade.

On January 20, 1863 two CSA ironclads, Palmetto State & Chicora attacked the wooden hulled inner formation of the blockading fleet. Of the ten warships, one was sunk, one damaged the rest scattered. Beauregard declared the Charleston blockade broken. However, when Union ironclads arrived, the CSA vessels retreated back into the harbor.

British, French, & Spanish councils at Charleston sailed outside the harbor to observe if the blockade had been raised & reported that the station had not been abandoned. (William N. Still Jr., Iron Afloat, p. 124)

General Beauregard provided the steamer General Clinch to carry the councils out to observe. They transferred to HBMS Petrel.

The attack by the CSN Palmetto State & Chicora on the ten wooden hulled blockaders is little known. It is one of the few encounters between CSN ironclads & the USN.

Link:

https://civilwarnavy.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Summer2020_What-Steamer-is-That-Browning.pdf

CSN Chicora Link:

Miscellaneous Photo Index

CSN Palmetto State Link:

Miscellaneous Photo Index

Auxiliary vessel General Clinch Link:

https://www.history.navy.mil/research/histories/ship-histories/confederate_ships/general-clinch.html

 

[Sid J.]

An earlier thread

French ships at City Point, 1864? | Naval War - At Sea & Along Inland Waterways

I saw this while looking in the OR for something else. Does anyone know what was up with these French ships? PETERSBURG, April 24, 1864. General S. COOPER, Adjutant and Inspector General: The two French men-of-war and two merchantmen at City Point have been ordered out of the river by...

civilwartalk.com

has some information about French Ships seeking to remove Tobacco and working with governments for approval.

 

[Sid J.]

Secretary of State Seward negotiated an "Informal convention" with French Ambassador Mercier Nov 23 1863, regarding shipment of tobacco purchased prior to March 4 1861 to French buyers.

https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924051367088&view=1up&seq=1160&q1=Tisiphone+

So likely the Tisiphone was in the James December 1863 and visited by Chesnut etc.

 

[Sid J.]

Or the Grenade?

NY Times December 7, 1863


WASHINGTON, Sunday, Dec. 6.

Richmond papers of the 3d have been received here.

The Examiner states with certainty that no successor to BRAGG has yet been appointed by the President. HARDEE now commands the army, and will continue to do so, until a Chief shall be appointed.

The same paper says: "Amid the reverses that have recently befallen the Confederate arms in East Tennessee, it is gratifying to learn that in West Tennessee our army is springing up like magic to resist the invading foe, and to defend West Tennessee, West Kentucky and North Mississippi to the Tallahatchie -- all of which district has been formed into a department, to be known as the Department of West Tennessee, under the command of Col. R.V. RICHARDSON."

The Richmond Whig says: "It is understood that the French war-steamer Grenade has visited the James River for the purpose of arranging for the removal of the French tobacco in store in this city. Our Government long ago gave its consent; but the blockading power has objected until now. We learn that within the next two weeks a fleet of six or eight vessels will arrive in the James River, for the purpose of loading with this tobacco."

 

[RedRover]

Super! That's apparently the HIMS (His Imperial Majesty's Service) Grenade. Earlier it had visited off Charleston.

 

[rebelatsea]

Gassendi was too early in the war. I cannot find a Tissiphone later than the xebec lost in 1816, It was likely to be the Phlegeton, screw corvette and or the Grenade, screw gunboat.

 

[Story]

On January 6 the French steam sloop of war Phlegeton arrived here

Lack of details could indicate that this hull made it's way into French hands

PHLEGETHON paddle sloop, RIM (1840)

I found some things in the Naval OR I, vol 9.

NEWPORT NEWS, April 11, 1864-6 p.m.

Captain De Marivault, of the French man-of-war Tisiphone, called on me this morning.

Nearest *maybe*, seems to be a popular Royal Navy name

French xebec 'Le Tisiphone' (1812)

French xebec 'Le Tisiphone' (1812). Dates of service, name changes, previous and next incarnations, dimensions, armament, commanders, officers and crewmen, actions, battles, sources

threedecks.org

The French man-of-war Grenade and one transport are also in the roads.

??

Étincelle-class gunboat - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Belfoured]

According to this site Tisiphone was a 6-gun French paddle corvette commissioned in 1854.

www.shipscribe.com/marvap/322c.html

 

[rebelatsea]

According to this site Tisiphone was a 6-gun French paddle corvette commissioned in 1854.

www.shipscribe.com/marvap/322c.html

That's interesting, because it's not listed in "French Navy Ships 1816 - 1859 shipscribe.

 

[Belfoured]

That's interesting, because it's not listed in "French Navy Ships 1816 - 1859 shipscribe.

It is. If you look at that list and click on "Corvettes", it's covered by "Tanger class". It was a two-ship class, so they list by the first ship in the class. It was broken up in 1875 (Tanger was broken up in 1889).

 

[rebelatsea]

It is. If you look at that list and click on "Corvettes", it's covered by "Tanger class". It was a two-ship class, so they list by the first ship in the class. It was broken up in 1875 (Tanger was broken up in 1889).

Thanks I need better glasses !