Enfield P-53, bullet for accuracy?

[Racing]

Got this P-53 recently and would like to tap in on what bullet to use. Idea is 100 meter shooting for numbers mainly, but will stretch to 300 on occasion (compete) too.
Was adviced by Brett to go Hay 568 bullet, and presume that´ll be a good call. What say the rest of you?

 

[ibgreen]

First of all you need to provide information about who produced this rifle (assuming it is a reproduction). I would also suggest finding the exact board dimensions. This is typically done with a set of pin gauges.The N-SSA website and message board has vast amounts of load data for these but each rifle can be different as to bullet type, powder type/amount as well as lube used. Welcome into the rabbit hole!

 

[Racing]

It´s a Tower marked original made in 1863.
If to stay with what was used at the time i´ve come to understand that most used some sort of patched setup?
From what i´ve understood this patching seems to "scrape" the bore clean to an extent too?
Rather peculiar to me, i shoot PP in other rifles, but them being "bore cleaning".. nope. Not at all even.

 

[FedericoFCavada]

As a rule, you can fire/ shoot Minie/Burton balls very accurately from the rifle if they are sized closely to two thousandths from the true size of the bore. Sizing the bore can be awkward/ difficult given the nature of the rifling grooves used on such rifles.

If you wish to fire authentic cartridges, you'll have to get or make the correct templates for cutting the paper and forming the powder cylinder, the exterior wrap for the cartridge, a set of Pritchett bullets with either clay plugs or box-wood plugs (I've used Pritchett bullets without any plugs at all, and packed the excess paper of the cartridge inside the cavity with a blunted golf pencil...).

Brett Gibbons's publications on all things Enfield cartridge would be a big plus.

https://papercartridges.com/

If you want a set of mandrels/ dowels/ forming rods of your own, you can contact the Jefferson Arsenal:

Cartridge Kit, .577cal Enfield, 20rds | website

The British Pattern 1853 Enfield Rifle Musket was the most widely used weapon of foreign manufacture during the Civil War, and served the armies of both North and South faithfully during the conflict. The rifle was most effectively used along with specifically patterned cartridges containing a...

www.thejeffersonarsenal.com

With an Enfield cartridge, the bullet is paper-patched and lubricated with tallow. There might be some beeswax, but it is mostly just grease/tallow. On Minie/Burton balls, you'll want lubricant in the grooves. I tried to go ueber-authentic and use the eight-parts wax, one part tallow mixture, but it is way too sticky and thick. I use a 50/50 mix of bees wax and tallow (I use mutton tallow), with a drop or two of olive oil.

Check out the N-SSSA and if there are any skirmishers in your area. Skirmishers use re-usable plastic tubes to hold the powder charge and a projectile instead of paper cartridges. Much easier to use, certainly. Sort of a "no muss; no fuss" solution. You can always measure your powder charge one at a time at a loading bench of course. Be sure to only ever change a single variable at a time while you try to work up a load, and keep good notes. It can be frustrating at first, but a "rifleman persists." Once you get a bullet type that the rifle likes, you might want to get a bullet mould and casting furnace and start making your own bullets. Before I knocked the front sight off my .58 Mississippi M1841, I pretty much shot an "as cast" .575 wadcutter Minie/Burton bullet with the aforementioned lube. These days, I'm using an original rifled and sighted Model 1842. I'm sizing .685 wadcutter Minie/Burton bullets from a custom Moose Mould after lubing them by dipping the end in molten lubricant, and then forcing them through a .685 sizing die. This is for a Bobby Hoyt-relined .687" barrel diameter. I do know that with some reproduction .577 three-band Enfields, some people have had good results simply using "as cast" .575" Minie/Burton bullets. You'll want the .568" Pritchett bullets with the precise kind of paper if you want to try it out the way it was designed as a weapon system: the epitome of the muzzle-loading paper cartridge with the British rifle. Many North American shooters find the handling of the Enfield to be awkward. I think that the British line infantry stood more "square" to the target than Americans typically do, with our more "bladed" or weak-side toward the target stance. Working on accuracy, you'd want to fire from a rifle rest or sandbag or whatever. Good luck and good shooting to ya!

 

[Lanyard Puller]

@Racing
quote; "It's a Tower marked original made in 1863"

I'd suggest that you find the proof marks, and other marks, especially on the barrel. It is almost impossible it could be made in 1863 and be in this condition. Possibly a Parker-Hale, Petersoli, or Navy arms production and a modern copy.

As for shooting it, I'd also recommend the NSSA site for loading information

 

[Racing]

Impossible, not by far.
I state that it´s an original as i know it to be. It´s an Enfield export version, to my knowledge the exact same gun delivered for the US civil war, and yes it is in essence about new.

While the US civil war raged there was an uprising in Warzaw in Poland, and these men needed arms. So 900 Enfield export was ordered, bought and paid for and loaded on a ship that set sail for Poland.

Now. As that ship was about to enter the Baltic sea it got boarded by Swedish customs (the absolute south point of the country) as it was decided on that the ship had entered Swedish waters.

In short these 900 rifles got impounded, and there they stayed. For quite a while..

Then one day it was decided on to sell the guns off, which the founder of one of Swedens major newspapers did, Lars Johan Hjerta, and he did.. bar one.
The bar one being this rifle.

Nope. This thing ended up at Swedish regiment I-15 in Borås, not far from where i live.. and there it reached the wall of the officers mess where it came to reside....

When the new mess was built in 1914, one of the first things to enter was again this Enfield. Somewhere along the line though someone took the hammer off, i guess to spare the nipple, and that got misplaced as far as i know. We´ve replaced the hammer with another Enfield one of the time, and i guess all is golden.
Anywhoooo...
There the rifled hung ´til 2012 when I-15 was dismantled and the rifle followed one of the officers home. At HIS home in turn, again a wall hanger. Until last year when the officer in case called my good friend up who´s ALSO a former officer of I-15 ...knowing that my friend is into black powder. So. Rifled changed hands again, this was last october.
Now. Me and my friend are in charge of anything black powder at the club and he know´s that i´m into both US made carbines and rifles of the time as well as British and French made ones, the one day recently.. "this Enfield is really way more you than me, how a about a barter? A trade?"
So i handed him my Gallager carbine and all is good, i guess. Since i´ve been diving into what gives as far as making this rifle perform.

As it used to belong to this good friend of mine, that has fired it, i wanted to be absolutely sure of the conditions of threads and what not as i plan to do the same.
These days we look after these old war horses as they were certainly NOT back in the day, so using it sparingly to me is about living history. Wings of time if you wish, and i truly regard myself the caretaker of it more than the owner. Ditto for for instance my Whitworth 451 military match.

As it turns out, "very good working order" would be an understatement.

..n yes. The other side of the lockplate certainly carries the Tower marking coupled with 1863. As "impossible" as it might strike anyone.

So uhu. Be that as it may.This is an original Enfield export made in 1863, as "impossible" it might be seeing its condition (well it´s basically new so.. no argument and very understandable i guess). No matter, here it is and you´re looking right at it.
Nope.
Not a "virgin", while close to it why i reason as such that as it´s not... it is ok to use it as long as it´s done with judgement, insight and knowledge.
But yes. This is how these rifles looked, to the color n number, as the boys of the US civil war took delivery. Here it is, the reference.

Now. I happen to own an original Whitworth too that i use loads and have posted on here before. Ditto for several WR Monkey tails and in turn other "451" rifles.
In short, i´m an avid black powder shooter/competitor while rather novice on the Enfield. Hence my asking

...like this Felix Escoffier 451 rifle. Absolutely wonderful piece of kit, sporting all of the "Whitworth trios" findings while, of course, "keeping it French". Thus 1 turn in 21 inches.. of course.. LOL. None the less, 45 caliber and what have you. In the pic good friend Patric going at it.

So. That said and settled (i hope?) back to the original Q.
Would the Hay bullet be a good choice as a starting point? Yes, as noted above i talked it over with Brett (yes, of paper cartridges) and see no reason to Q his words on the matter, but would like others input on the matter too.
Point being that i live across the Atlantic and due that, and that many a mold is US made we simply CNC cut our own.

Like for instance these for said Whitworth rifle. Thus... albeit we could cut molds out the fabled i wanted to ask others what´s their preference

Point in case being that i´ve been told these Enfields can be VERY picky on fudder, and that´s why i asked.
Sorry if that was unclear by any measure.

Pritchet i see some shy away from? What´s been said due the rather vast difference in diameter vs the bore?
FWIW i plan to cut me a "tray" for setting plugs for the bullet in case too, no matter which is arrived on.

So? Any insight?

 

[Lanyard Puller]

I stand corrected on your P53. It should be an excellent shooter.

 

[poorjack]

I shoot a Parker Hale P58 in N-SSA competition. I shoot the RCBS Hogdon bullet with a taller base plug to slightly alter the C/G forward and thin the skirt a bit. Bullet is cast at .580, sized to .576. Load data- 42g 3f Swiss, RWS caps, beeswax/lard/lanolin lube dipped on base rings only. I think it shoots ok when I do my part-

 

[FedericoFCavada]

One of my maternal 3x great-grandfathers was a soldier between 1846 and 1873 I-XIX Fältjägerkår. So for part of his army service he would have used this m/40-48 tappstudsare after 1849:

 

[FedericoFCavada]

Brett A. Gibbons, Handbook for the School of Musketry (2018), pp. 52-55:
"... shortly after the start of the Civil War the US Army changed [from a .575 swaged Minie/Burton bullet for a .58 cal.] to .574-inch bullets to ease loading in .577-cal Enfield rifles. Sizing dies are commercially available, and if you plan to seriously shoot your rifle with Minie bullets, you will absolutely need one.

The Minie (Burton style is expanded upon firing into the grooves of your rifle barrel by the combined effects of pressure in the hollow cavity pushing the 'skirt' out, and by the upsetting or bumping-up that effects all soft lead bullets. ... the expansion of the Minie is not instantaneous, but occurs as the bullet begins to move a few inches down your rifle barrel. Because the expansion is gradual, this means fouling often accumulates faster in your barrel when shooting Minies, especially nearer the breech, and this can often make loading hard after a limited number of rounds and necessitating cleaning before firing can continue. Initially the charge was 60 grains of powder, and this was increased to 65 grains with the adoption of the .574-cal bullet. ... While [Enfield cartridge] was more expensive and complex to manufacture, for ease of loading and control of fouling build-up there is no better cartridge to be found. The Enfield cartridge used a .550-caliber (or, earlier, a .568-caliber) bullet with a base plug that facilitated a very rapid expansion upon firing, instead of the somewhat more gradual expansion like the American Minie bullet. ... The service charge was 68 grains of very good powder; the modern commercial equivalent is about 72 grains of Fg or 1.5Fg powder. Generally, they are not as accurate at very close 'bench rest' ranges as the Minie bullet, but the ease of loading and excellent fouling control are outstanding battlefield qualities that the British authorities desired more than mere 'tight groups.' In practical experience with original and reproduction P1853 Enfield rifles, an 8-inch group at 100 yards is respectable. A similar comparison with original and reproduction M1861 Springfield rifles, shooting American Minies, produces on average about a 6-inch group at 100 yards. ... "

 

[Racing]

An absolute wonderful Tappstudsare!
If there´s one of them i cherish from around here it´s the m/1851 chamber loader for the Swedish navy.
An absolute cannon of a rifle, in approx 16mm caliber and will take an EASY 120 grains beneath that 620grain pill. REAL high build Q and due that, to a degree at least i suppose, reasonable accuracy too.

Here friend Stefan going at it at the range. This thing, when loaded up to the brim, kicks like a friggin mule. But have to say, still rather accurate. If my info is correct developed to shoot far across open water.

Yeah, and yes. We cut the mold for that one too..

Then. EXCELLENT shooting with that 58! Very impressive! Kudos! Thank you for sharing your recipe!

If you´re after exotic shooters though, the Norweigan later chamber loader. The m/1860. Sports a hexagonal rifling like the Whitworth, just a tad slower twist rate.

In contrast to the m/1851 which is a *amn cannon the 1860 is light and nimble, very to the point and shoots excellent when handed the fudder it needs.

 

[Racing]

I shoot a Parker Hale P58 in N-SSA competition. I shoot the RCBS Hogdon bullet with a taller base plug to slightly alter the C/G forward and thin the skirt a bit. Bullet is cast at .580, sized to .576. Load data- 42g 3f Swiss, RWS caps, beeswax/lard/lanolin lube dipped on base rings only. I think it shoots ok when I do my part-
View attachment 447849

In short what you´re saying is that the Enfield of mine might, from an accuracy standpoint, work just as well if not better with a regular Minie/Burton? In short an expanding base bullet per "normal", while sized such that the bump up needed is absolutely minimal?
Fooled around with that a wee bit with an original Lorenz in 54cal and have to say it was harder to get right than i had believed. We got there, but sure took a bit of playing around.
As i call it the main difference between the "US way" and the "British way" is what´s touched upon above.
That the Brits were more interested in keeping the rifles running at all costs. Thus the paper patching, and even so called cleaner bullets on occasion.

For the sake of comparsion. One rifle rather common for comps around here is the m/1860 "Wredes" rifle. Approx 50 caliber, and is more often than not used to great success with a 480" expanding base bullet sans any clay plugs or whatever. They´re greasers but that said work very very well in most Wredes rifles.
It being the basically last of the muzzle loaders of the Swedish army.

 

[poorjack]

In short what you´re saying is that the Enfield of mine might, from an accuracy standpoint, work just as well if not better with a regular Minie/Burton? In short an expanding base bullet per "normal", while sized such that the bump up needed is absolutely minimal?
Fooled around with that a wee bit with an original Lorenz in 54cal and have to say it was harder to get right than i had believed. We got there, but sure took a bit of playing around.
As i call it the main difference between the "US way" and the "British way" is what´s touched upon above.
That the Brits were more interested in keeping the rifles running at all costs. Thus the paper patching, and even so called cleaner bullets on occasion.

Speaking as an American where we do not recognize the authority of the crown, it is perfectly conceivable to get the Enfield shooting extremely well with "Burton" style minies. In the US, there is a competition shooting organization called the North South Skirmish Association. We compete with rifled muskets and other American Civil War arms, and that includes artillery. Our competition is all shot from the offhand position and blends accuracy AND speed, so extensive "bench rest" techniques can be very counterproductive as can "historic" ammunition. But back to the "style" of minie, there are a number of styles of minies that have been devised over the years and some shoot better than others depending on a number of variables. And yes, that group in the previous picture was with a RCBS Hogdon minie, from my Parker Hale P58. I have a Parker Hale "musketoon" that shoots every bit as good with the exact same load.

Here's a link to a source for samples we commonly shoot-

Bullets

And one of our mould manufacturers-

Products | Moose Moulds

moosemoulds.com

A couple things hold true across all "minie" ball rifles if you're interested in accuracy on target-
1) Use only pure lead, keep the lead pot hot, like 850f
2) Size minies to .001" under actual measured bore size
3) Use only quality, real black powder. 2f or 3f, both work but fouling will vary. Swiss is best.
4) Use only quality caps- RWS preferred. Schuetzen are ok.
5) Use natural based lube- NOTHING in the base unless you want to pull your hair out over flyers. I use beeswax/lard/lanolin and only dip lube the rings.
6) Heavy (think "service") charges are not necessary unless you are shooting long distance. Most of my guns use 42-48g 3f. I've found that I can get equivalent performance from 2f but I have to increase the charge level by 4-5g and fouling is often a bit worse with 2f.

Historically speaking, there were ammunition types with plugs put into the base of some of the minie designs, but if you're serious about competition shooting, you do not want the flyer problem that inevitably occurs. The plug can change the weight distribution of the bullet if it falls out or shatters leading to a bullet way off the mark. Some think filling the base with lube helps, but it doesn't. What it does is contaminate your powder charge so there is inconsistent pressure on ignition due to some powder being "killed" by lube. Another variable to look at is the size of the orifice in the nipple. Larger is not better. One more thing to remember, the historic service ammunition was designed to be reliable first of all. Accuracy, well if it happened, then great.

 

[RSMorris]

Impossible, not by far.
I state that it´s an original as i know it to be. It´s an Enfield export version, to my knowledge the exact same gun delivered for the US civil war, and yes it is in essence about new.

View attachment 447778

While the US civil war raged there was an uprising in Warzaw in Poland, and these men needed arms. So 900 Enfield export was ordered, bought and paid for and loaded on a ship that set sail for Poland.

View attachment 447779

Now. As that ship was about to enter the Baltic sea it got boarded by Swedish customs (the absolute south point of the country) as it was decided on that the ship had entered Swedish waters.


View attachment 447780

In short these 900 rifles got impounded, and there they stayed. For quite a while..

View attachment 447781

Then one day it was decided on to sell the guns off, which the founder of one of Swedens major newspapers did, Lars Johan Hjerta, and he did.. bar one.
The bar one being this rifle.

View attachment 447782

Nope. This thing ended up at Swedish regiment I-15 in Borås, not far from where i live.. and there it reached the wall of the officers mess where it came to reside....

View attachment 447783

When the new mess was built in 1914, one of the first things to enter was again this Enfield. Somewhere along the line though someone took the hammer off, i guess to spare the nipple, and that got misplaced as far as i know. We´ve replaced the hammer with another Enfield one of the time, and i guess all is golden.
Anywhoooo...
There the rifled hung ´til 2012 when I-15 was dismantled and the rifle followed one of the officers home. At HIS home in turn, again a wall hanger. Until last year when the officer in case called my good friend up who´s ALSO a former officer of I-15 ...knowing that my friend is into black powder. So. Rifled changed hands again, this was last october.
Now. Me and my friend are in charge of anything black powder at the club and he know´s that i´m into both US made carbines and rifles of the time as well as British and French made ones, the one day recently.. "this Enfield is really way more you than me, how a about a barter? A trade?"
So i handed him my Gallager carbine and all is good, i guess. Since i´ve been diving into what gives as far as making this rifle perform.

View attachment 447784

As it used to belong to this good friend of mine, that has fired it, i wanted to be absolutely sure of the conditions of threads and what not as i plan to do the same.
These days we look after these old war horses as they were certainly NOT back in the day, so using it sparingly to me is about living history. Wings of time if you wish, and i truly regard myself the caretaker of it more than the owner. Ditto for for instance my Whitworth 451 military match.

View attachment 447785

View attachment 447786

As it turns out, "very good working order" would be an understatement.

View attachment 447787

View attachment 447788

View attachment 447789

View attachment 447790

..n yes. The other side of the lockplate certainly carries the Tower marking coupled with 1863. As "impossible" as it might strike anyone.

View attachment 447791

View attachment 447792

So uhu. Be that as it may.This is an original Enfield export made in 1863, as "impossible" it might be seeing its condition (well it´s basically new so.. no argument and very understandable i guess). No matter, here it is and you´re looking right at it.
Nope.
Not a "virgin", while close to it why i reason as such that as it´s not... it is ok to use it as long as it´s done with judgement, insight and knowledge.
But yes. This is how these rifles looked, to the color n number, as the boys of the US civil war took delivery. Here it is, the reference.

Now. I happen to own an original Whitworth too that i use loads and have posted on here before. Ditto for several WR Monkey tails and in turn other "451" rifles.
In short, i´m an avid black powder shooter/competitor while rather novice on the Enfield. Hence my asking

View attachment 447793

...like this Felix Escoffier 451 rifle. Absolutely wonderful piece of kit, sporting all of the "Whitworth trios" findings while, of course, "keeping it French". Thus 1 turn in 21 inches.. of course.. LOL. None the less, 45 caliber and what have you. In the pic good friend Patric going at it.

So. That said and settled (i hope?) back to the original Q.
Would the Hay bullet be a good choice as a starting point? Yes, as noted above i talked it over with Brett (yes, of paper cartridges) and see no reason to Q his words on the matter, but would like others input on the matter too.
Point being that i live across the Atlantic and due that, and that many a mold is US made we simply CNC cut our own.

View attachment 447794

Like for instance these for said Whitworth rifle. Thus... albeit we could cut molds out the fabled i wanted to ask others what´s their preference

Point in case being that i´ve been told these Enfields can be VERY picky on fudder, and that´s why i asked.
Sorry if that was unclear by any measure.

Pritchet i see some shy away from? What´s been said due the rather vast difference in diameter vs the bore?
FWIW i plan to cut me a "tray" for setting plugs for the bullet in case too, no matter which is arrived on.

So? Any insight?

This has to be by far, the greatest post in the history of the internet.

 

[Tanglewood]

This has to be by far, the greatest post in the history of the internet.

The "impossible" statement by Lanyard Puller was actually "It is almost impossible it could be made in 1863 and be in this condition."
(bold added by me).
After reading the history of this fantastic example, I'd call that an accurate assessment. How this P53 survived in this condition is a great story and almost miraculous. Thank goodness the I-15 regiment preserved it as a keepsake and it survived to this day in this condition and wound up in good hands.

 

[Racing]

Hey.
As i write, understandable and no argument, seeing the condition it´s in.
IOW, i would most likely have made the same assessment if someone walked in stating they sit on a pristine P-53.
However, there it is. Not trying to write anyone on their nose, but the truth remains. Me, i´m just glad and excited i was offered the gun as i was.
So. Now to make it shoot.

Anyways.
@ poorjack.
Thanx a mill. Always good to compare notes. Black powder shooting is vivid and kicking here in Europe too. I guess the epicenter could be considered Britain to this day by many, but for instance due Balazs of Cap n Ball the long distance cup was just held in Hungary. I had a personal issue (close friend died) show why i couldn´t attend, sorry to say. That said, be adviced that there´s like almost 700mill ppl within the EU, so no shortage as far as that at least.
We don´t get as many different flavor powders as you do over here, while Pyro as well as T7 and what not is available but.. most use either Swiss or "Wasag" (Graf i believe?) anyway.
RWS primers, certainly it being of the approx same origin. To tell as it is it´s about all we use.

Me i do compete and as noted am involved too. That said our legislation is such that the guns exempt permits are the originals, why these are used extensively to this day, and that´s kind of where i fit in as i run a shop where i work on them. Doing that is always a balance act i guess, but that said there´s like a ton of ppl that think that THEIR specific whatever is the museum piece of them all - which they are of course not.
Thus, i try and "keep it real" if you know what i mean. That´s not saying i don´t get "them" through the door, cause i do. Like recently i was asked to put an old 3d model Dragoon back to shooting condition.

..which is of course a treat. Yep. British proof marks all over but sure made in the US (me i´m a half breed by the way, thus..)

There ARE vast differences between the US and over here though, thinking shooting alone. Just take the Whitworth rifle, which is insanely expensive your side of the pond, here it´s just.. expensive. 3k-5k$ will get you a decent one.

Yes. Of course there´s those of us running replicas like the Pedersoli guns and what not, it´s just that the amount of guns on permit can be cramped for space and due that we can not really fill our cabs to the brim with them replicas. Just the way things are, legislation being the issue to be honest.

To give you an idea. I wanted a Kropatschek 8mm in 8*60 it being the "last dying scream" of blackpowder. So i dug a nice one up down in France that i imported up here (in other words within the EU)

A nice one as it´s a permit gun to me. It being an 8mm "10 shot" (takes 8 in the tube, one on the lifter and one chambered) and it´s using a metallic gas tight cartridge = permit.
That means that it takes up space on my equivalent of what the Brits call an FAC. Firearms card. The permit is for life though, once through the process involved you´re good. Made in 1886. This though a revised version making that she runs "both ways". Ie; blackpowder and smokeless both. To me though it´s about blackpowder (and duplex to an extent).
Irony, for lack of better words, is that most your side of the pond ain´t even aware of the Kropatschek, which was really a mile stone in rifle development (..which the French in turn "transformed" into the 8mm Lebel - worlds first smokeless gun en masse, and so the story goes..)

BCPR is alive around here too though, while for the most part on a smaller scale. Popular guns that aside are often the various US made carbines of the civil war, many were exported over here for for instance the Franco/Preussian war of 1870-71 and are thus around ample. Ditto for revolvers, i believe the French bought like 30k Remington revolvers for said conflict alone out of US storage.

So yes. The originals are used way more often around here than in the US i´d say, no matter if handgun or long gun. In many European states in turn the USE of these guns are under permit, to us up here in Viking land.. not so much. So.. we take care of them and we shoot them every chance we get.

 

[Racing]

Knowing i´m straying here, an original Colt 1860 Army n me at the range. 30 grains of Wasag underneath a J&D pill. Yep. It being in good working order it can sure stretch to this day, and rings steel at 50m with ease.
That gun is exempt to me.

Lovely gun though. Photo courtesy friend Patric Rosberg.

 

[poorjack]

Racing- check your PM

 

[ResearchPress]

Got this P-53 recently and would like to tap in on what bullet to use. Idea is 100 meter shooting for numbers mainly, but will stretch to 300 on occasion (compete) too. Was adviced by Brett to go Hay 568 bullet, and presume that´ll be a good call. What say the rest of you?

Speaking as an American where we do not recognize the authority of the crown, it is perfectly conceivable to get the Enfield shooting extremely well with "Burton" style minies. In the US, there is a competition shooting organization called the North South Skirmish Association. We compete with rifled muskets and other American Civil War arms, and that includes artillery. Our competition is all shot from the offhand position and blends accuracy AND speed, so extensive "bench rest" techniques can be very counterproductive as can "historic" ammunition. But back to the "style" of minie, there are a number of styles of minies that have been devised over the years and some shoot better than others depending on a number of variables. . . .

The .568 bullet and cartridge was used by Rifle Volunteers in NRA(UK) competition in the 19thC. However, here in the UK 'historical' ammunition doesn't feature in competition today, despite a rise in recent years of interest in the Pritchett bullet and cartridge.

I shoot an RCBS Minie with a shallow base cavity which suits my original Short Rifle with 1 in 48 twist. I'm using a larger charge than will often be seen suggested; 80 grains of Swiss No. 4 (1.5Fg) - but most of my shooing is not at short range. Besides short range shooting (50m offhand / 100m prone) the MLAGB have competition for Enfield rifles at 200, 300, 500 & 600 yards; 200 is prone and offhand, other distances prone - the military sling is the only support permitted. This year I was 2nd at 200yd prone, 4th at 300yd, and won 200yd offhand, plus 500 & 600yd prone.

For anyone not familiar with shooting the Enfield, then Bill Curtis' short treatise on Managing the Enfield may be of interest, covering the rifle, equipment, ammunition, shooting, sighting, cleaning and bedding.

David

 

[Old Soldier]

As myself and others have said in other threads, be careful with these 'export' Enfields. It looks a fairly standard 'Type 3', but without 'doughnut' screws on the bands. They are not government inspected and many are not to the same standard as the issue rifles. Most were made in Birmingham, like this one - Deakin the barrelmaker is Birmingham based as the proof marks show - G.E.Ryan sounds very Irish, but the Irish gunmakers often had English subsidiaries and works. However, none bear government (Enfield) inspectors marks. The parts are sometimes not interchangeable. Any serial numbers on the barrel are usually done for the contract and are rarely recorded. The 'Tower' on the plate was common for parts assembled from different makers, with no V.R under the Crown, but the date is likely to be correct and, as such, was likely destined for America originally.

From reports, the shooting can be quite erratic, but that is usually from old and used (and abused?) examples. Even government inspected arms - most of which have seen some service - shoot erratically today. (The issue ones are quite rare as most Type 3 and 4 were converted to Snider breechloaders) I would hope this one doesn't. Good shooting!.