Confederate Wounded at Vicksburg

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My GG Grandfather Pvt. Elias Green Mancill of Co. E - 42nd Alabama, was severely wounded at Vicksburg. He survived but was later discharged do to being unable to serve physically, in January of 1864. What puzzles me is that he is not listed in the parole records after the surrender. Through my research I have been trying to piece together the events between his wounding (which I suppose occurred most likely on May 22 when the 42nd position was attacked during the assault on the 2nd Texas lunette) and his discharge many months later.

My question to the experts, is there any evidence of wounded evacuated out of Vicksburg during the siege, especially during the initial months? I have scoured this site (and many other sources) looking for anything on this but have not found anything. Could this just be a case of lost records? I have seen parole records that indicate the individual signed while in the hospital so if he was still in the hospital facilities it would seem he would have been recorded there. This is a big mystery to me and any information any of you may have is greatly appreciated.

 

[johan_steele]

That's an interesting quandary. There are a couple possible explanations.

Some badly wounded CS troops were moved to a US hospital shortly after the surrender and are known to have fallen through the cracks of the paroles.

As I understand it some other wounded were transported to a floating hospital and got lost in the parole process.

Also some wounded not thought likely to survive or unidentified didn't initially receive paroles.

Another option is he wasn't wounded on May 22 but was a victim of sharpshooting during the seige. Which often resulted in head wounds which when not fatal were often permenantly debilitating.

Iirc there were 2 CS hospitals and 4 US ones during seige and during the occupation reduced first to two then finally just one. US & CS surgeons did work together for a while. There were still CS wounded in the hospital at least as late as November of 63.

 

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Thank you, the US hospital and floating hospital is a new path to investigate. That helps a lot.

He was wounded in the right arm, luckily I have a copy of his discharge papers which indicate this.

Unfortunately the crease on the paper runs right through some important wording that I cant discern. Translating this document in full is another one of my "projects".

 

[johan_steele]

Iirc the Hospital Ship was the USS Red Rover or Red River I don't recall which.

Some of the worst wounded were moved upriver to hospitals in Memphis. Whether that included CS wounded I don't know.

 

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Thank you again, I will investigate these.

 

[DaveBrt]

Thank you, the US hospital and floating hospital is a new path to investigate. That helps a lot.

He was wounded in the right arm, luckily I have a copy of his discharge papers which indicate this.
View attachment 175115
Unfortunately the crease on the paper runs right through some important wording that I cant discern. Translating this document in full is another one of my "projects".

Which part is giving you problems? I can probably help.

 

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In the portion where space is given for "entitled to discharge by reason of..." my current translation is as follows:

"Shell wound of the right arm at ?battle? of Vicksburg, ? ? ? preventing him from serving in any of the departments as per Surgeons ? ? January 8th 1864 approval ? his discharge made by ?Commission? of Dept. ?, ? Dept."

 

[DaveBrt]

In the portion where space is given for "entitled to discharge by reason of..." my current translation is as follows:

"Shell wound of the right arm at ?battle? of Vicksburg, ? ? ? preventing him from serving in any of the departments as per Surgeons ? ? January 8th 1864 approval ? his discharge made by ?Commission? of Dept. ?, ? Dept."

shell would of the right arm received at Vicksburg Miss permanent disabling him from service in any of the Departments; as pr Surgeons Certificate dated Jany 8th 1864. Approved and his discharge ordered by command of Genl. Johnson, Comg. Dept.

 

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Admirable work sir! I thank you dearly for helping me with this.

 

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I guess the next question would be if this injury resulted in an amputation, would this discharge document mention this? As amputations were so common would they be considered an assumed condition in this case and not noted.

Any ideas on this?

I am also curious if an enlisted man with an amputated arm could still serve in any capacity, I have not devoted any time to researching this so I apologize if this is an amateur question.

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

Wow, how crazy, to be able to gather such specific information about one, wounded man at Vicksburg? This forum is amazing.

Since you're on a hunt, will probably not mind scouring records and books? Noticed the Sanitary Commission tended to write everything down, issued a huge amount of official reports and had aid workers who kept an awful lot of journals, wrote quite a few books post war. With Red Rover at Vicksburg, it's possible someone will have described how wounded made it from the city to the floating hospital? Internet Archives, Hathitrust and LoC all tend to have accounts from Sanitary Commission staff.

 

[DaveBrt]

I guess the next question would be if this injury resulted in an amputation, would this discharge document mention this? As amputations were so common would they be considered an assumed condition in this case and not noted.

Any ideas on this?

I am also curious if an enlisted man with an amputated arm could still serve in any capacity, I have not devoted any time to researching this so I apologize if this is an amateur question.

The discharge paper says he could not serve in any department, so that should be settled. Once discharged, he could have been hired by a government bureau as a clerk or hired by a defence contractor. It would very much depend on his health and what skill he had with his remaining arm.

 

[DixieRifles]

There was a Confederate hospital established by Texas troops at Enterprise. It is said some of the wounded from Vicksburg were sent there. Ive always wondered if they really meant those CS units operating outside the seige.
Also after the surrender, the Exchange Camp was set-up at Enterprise. But would Confederate prisoners have been sent there after the surrender? Think not.
Link on the Texas Hospital.
http://custermen.com/DixieBoys/TexasCemeteryA.htm

 

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Yes this is true. I think I may have phrased this question incorrectly. What I should have said was generally speaking could an enlisted man (not my grandfather specifically) still serve a military role missing an arm. Is there evidence of this. I am just curious.

 

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My Grandfather was in the 42nd Alabama so he would have gone to the camp at Demopolis, which he very well may have at some point before he was discharged. The missing piece is what happened between the wounding, the surrender and his January 1864 discharge. Its the fact that he is not listed on the Parole records that has me scratching my head.

Does anyone know if the NPS Parole lists for Vicksburg are based on the copies of the Parole Certificates that still exist or are their Parole documents based on something else. I am wondering if this could be a case where his Parole record has simply been lost. What is strange is that his brothers who were with him at Vicksburg are not on the Parole list either, though they continued on fighting with the 42nd till the end of the war.

 

[johan_steele]

Sanitary Commision records are another source that has been mentioned as should Christian Commision. While they may not mention names there are a lot of minutia in there as well as peripheral info that may be of interest.

There was also an order of Catholic nuns operating in the Vicksburg hospital and on the Red Rover. What records are available from them I don't know.

 

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Excellent, thanks.

 

[Championhilz]

Yes this is true. I think I may have phrased this question incorrectly. What I should have said was generally speaking could an enlisted man (not my grandfather specifically) still serve a military role missing an arm. Is there evidence of this. I am just curious.

Yes, soldiers did sometimes remain in the military after losing a limb to amputation - here is the link to a story I wrote about Harrison K.W. Childress, a member of the 19th Mississippi Infantry who was wounded at Gaines Mill in 1862 and had to have an arm amputated. He remained in the army after he recovered from his wound: https://mississippiconfederates.wor...ht-h-k-w-childress-19th-mississippi-infantry/

 

[johan_steele]

Are we certain his arm was amputated? I can't read the posted record so if I'm missing the obvious please pardon me.

One thing often mistaken is the assumption that the only answer was amputation which just isn't true.

There are stories of men caught in shell blasts having only superficial external wounds but internal injuries that ranged from minor to catastrophic. I'm reminded of a CS soldier killed by a shell. Physically he looked fine but was quite dead likely due to the concussion.

I have a brother in law who was the victim of a hit & run. With the exception of a vicious bruise you wouldn't have known he was injured. But his collar bone was badly broken and he couldn't use that arm for the best part of a year. So there are a variety of possible explanations.

Now that neither he or his brothers are on the parole list is quite curious. If possible I would verify they're on the muster roll then see about getting the parole records for the 42nd. You may have a case where men refused to give their real name on the parole or may have been among the men who were cut off and unable to get back to Vicksburg after Champions Hill & The Big Black Bridge fight.

An interesting mystery.

 

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No I am not certain about his arm, thats what I am trying to find out. You make a good point it could have been severe internal injuries. I do know he languished bed ridden for a year or so before his death in 1903. Whether this is attributed to his wound at Vicksburg I do not know. Im just trying to piece together his story as complete as possible. On to more leads, I appreciate everyone's input.