Cartridges

[Dmax90]

How many ammunition cartridges would 1 soldier carry on them and what would happen if they ran out in battle? And were the cartridges supplied by the military or was each soldier responsible for their own?

 

[Stony]

The military issued them before battle. 60 I believe. Fix bayonets.

 

[John Winn]

The standard cartridge box carried forty. Often, just before a shootout, extra rounds were issued which would have to be carried in pockets. The government supplied them. If the shootout lasted a long time - such as with those entrenched - ammunition would have to be brought up to the lines to replenish that originally issued.

 

[Drew]

They also didn't generally have "cartridges" as we understand them. Some of that appeared relatively late in the war and mostly on the Union side. They fired muzzle loaders and had to load powder and ram shot down a barrel to fire. If you were good, you might get two shots per minute this way. When they ran out, they hollered to the rear to bring more up.

 

[Tin cup]

Confederate, Federal, or both?

Kevin Dally

 

[Dmax90]

Confederate, Federal, or both?

Kevin Dally

Both

 

[Patrick H]

This thread does raise an important question in my mind: I understand that soldiers were issued their cartridge ammo, but were they also trained to "roll their own"? I've got a hunch the southern boys who were not always as well-supplied, might have become proficient at rolling cartridges out of whatever powder, ball and paper they could scrounge. Seems to me the paper would be the variable element in that scenario. However, if you could bite the end off the cartridge and if you were satisfied you could get enough exposed powder down the tube to achieve ignition, then I think you'd be tempted to try it with newspaper if that's all you could find. I think most would be willing to try it if they had no other recourse.

Of course, this is all PURE speculation and I might be way off base, so I won't be offended if any of you guys tell me I'm just enjoying a fantasy here. My speculation assumes the boys could get powder and ball. That might be way off base. Still, if I were out of government rolled cartridges, I'd scramble and try to come up with something in a real hurry. You see my point.

With regard to guerrilla units operating in Missouri, I am pretty certain they "rolled their own" as needed. I've read accounts of them doing it--or perhaps loading chambers with loose powder and ball. The one essential thing they could not improvise was pistol caps. Those had to be smuggled to them--or captured from Yankees.

 

[Drew]

My speculation assumes the boys could get powder and ball.

I think you're right, Patrick. I'm not aware of any serious shortage of powder and ball during the war. Food, shoes, yes, but not ammunition. I suspect they yelled (colorfully) when the latter was running low and got what they needed.

 

[Tin cup]

I seriously think that folk are not paying attention to how well the Confederate Arsenal system worked during the war!

Good reading on the Subject of the Confederate Arsenal's...
http://www.amazon.com/dp/089096632X/?tag=civilwartalkc-20
http://www.amazon.com/dp/1577471512/?tag=civilwartalkc-20
http://www.amazon.com/dp/1577471792/?tag=civilwartalkc-20

Kevin Dally

 

[mikekj]

The Confederacy lacked and wanted for a lot of things, but ammunition was not one of them. The powder mill at Augusta, Ga. was cranking out powder and at a quality that was unequaled even by the north.

Paper cartridges were being produced at many, many places. Macon, Charleston, Augusta, Atlanta, Fayetteville, Selma, etc.

Soldiers in the field would not have access to paper and powder for rolling their own. IF they had the know-how.

 

[John Winn]

I don't think the average soldier ever "rolled their own". It's actually fairly difficult to produce a cartridge of the era and requires not only the right type of paper but also paper cut correctly, small twine, lead, molds, and some tools. Those using shotguns or smoothbore weapons would, of course, be a different group but the average soldier I'd think got his cartridges issued and government-made.

Educate me if I'm wrong.

 

[Patrick H]

To mikekj: This is good to know. I am pretty ignorant about these things, as I tried to express previously.
To John Winn: I know it's fairly difficult. I've seen it done on youtube, and it didn't look easy. Glad to know the regular armies could get the ammo they needed. However, I am satisfied that guerrilla units improvised, as needed. Not saying it was easy. Just saying they did whatever was required.
Thanks to both of you guys for your input here. This is why I keep coming back. I learn something new almost every time!

 

[Albert Sailhorst]

When we went as Infantry to the 150th Gettysburg, some Pards and I rolled about 1,500 rounds......True, that's different then it would be with a Minie Ball, but it was still fun (and not difficult) to do.....

 

[TerryB]

If you totally ran out of ammo in a battle and you were not being overrun or in a place in line too important to pull out, your regiment could be pulled out of line to resupply at the ammo train. If you were in a bad way, orders would be given to take ammo from the dead. Out of ammo Confederates are said to have picked up rocks and thrown them during at least two battles. I read a Union soldier's account, posted on this site, where he describes this.

 

[Tin cup]

The CS called them "Laboratories" for a good reason!

Kevin Dally

 

[AUG]

George Norton Galloway of Co. G, 95th Pennsylvania Volunteers noted in his account of the May 12 fight at the Mule Shoe, Spotsylvania that pack mules were used to bring extra ammunition to the ranks.

"To keep up the supply of ammunition pack mules were brought into use, each animal carrying three thousand rounds. The boxes were dropped close behind the troops engaged, where they were quickly opened by the officers or file-closers, who served the ammunition to the men. The writer fired four hundred rounds of ammunition, and many others as many or more. In this manner a continuous and rapid fire was maintained, to which for a while the enemy replied with vigor."
http://civilwarhome.com/bloodyangle.html

A number of Confederate accounts note that when low on ammunition a runner had to be sent back or "run the gauntlet" behind the works. Both sides were fighting each other right over the entrenchments and stray bullets were flying everywhere behind, so it was quite dangerous when running to the rear, on either side.

 

[Poor Private]

In the book Civil War Curiosities by Webb Garrison, published in 1994 by Fall River Press, Chapter 13 entitiled Outmoded Weapons,page 137 comments about this issue. (I am paraphrasing).
Col. Redwood of the 55 Virginia considered the shotgun better than nothing, because when the company was called into camp, no man had any other firearm. Because they were brought by their owners or requiationed from the community, their weapons wre a hodgpoge. Which chambered 4 buckshot, various gages of double-barrels, down to small single-barrel squirrel guns.
The next paragraph contiues saying the since factory-made ammuntion was not available, Redwood and his comrades eventually received powder,ball, and buckshot in bulk. Then said the Viginian,"each man made cartridges to fit the arm he bore, using a stick whittled to it's caliber as a former."

 

[thomas aagaard]

They also didn't generally have "cartridges" as we understand them. Some of that appeared relatively late in the war and mostly on the Union side. They fired muzzle loaders and had to load powder and ram shot down a barrel to fire. If you were good, you might get two shots per minute this way. When they ran out, they hollered to the rear to bring more up.

They did use cartridges... of paper. And with a clean musket 3 shots is doable...
But the exact weapon and exact type of ammo do effect this. Using a springfield with endfield ammo is a bit easier than an enfield with enfield ammo... and naturally doing so when kneeling behind you breastwork under fire is a bit different than doing it on a modern calm firing range...

This youtube movie do cover the two main types pretty well. (1855 and 1861)

And no, the soldiers usually didn't make cartridges... and cartridges was one of the things the south did not lack.
(they made many and also imported many from the UK... and they are a bit different )

 

[John Winn]

They did use cartridges... of paper. And with a clean musket 3 shots is doable...
But the exact weapon and exact type of ammo do effect this. Using a springfield with endfield ammo is a bit easier than an enfield with enfield ammo... and naturally doing so when kneeling behind you breastwork under fire is a bit different than doing it on a modern calm firing range...

This youtube movie do cover the two main types pretty well. (1855 and 1861)

And no, the soldiers usually didn't make cartridges... and cartridges was one of the things the south did not lack.
(they made many and also imported many from the UK... and they are a bit different )

Thanks ! That's the best video I've seen on how cartridges were made. It also cleared up some confusion on my part as to the different types - I'd seen demos of both and was a bit confused. Now I know.

 

[Drew]

This youtube movie do cover the two main types pretty well. (1855 and 1861)

Great video, thanks for posting. Here is another of a "Virginia Infantryman" loading and firing. Sounds like he's standing near a modern highway. Doing this in actual combat under fire is beyond my comprehension.