Boyd and Gamble Q

[Enoch L. Cade]

Hello all. A quick question if I may.

Should all Boyle and Gamble swords carry a CS or some sort of stamp on the blade?

 

[gjpratt]

No. Some B&G foot officers have etched blades that would include a CS as do the staff & Fields that also have a CS cast as part of the guard. No authentic B&Gs carry a stamped CS on the ricasso or the blade. Why do you ask?

 

[R. Porter]

Shouldn't that be, "Boyle and Gamble," not, "Boyd and Gamble?"

 

[Enoch L. Cade]

No. Some B&G foot officers have etched blades that would include a CS as do the staff & Fields that also have a CS cast as part of the guard. No authentic B&Gs carry a stamped CS on the ricasso or the blade. Why do you ask?

I'm considering the purchase of a sword advertised as a B&G. I'm relatively comfortable with the key identifying features on the pommel, grip and guard but trying to determine if there are additional things to look for.

 

[bobinwmass]

I'm considering the purchase of a sword advertised as a B&G. I'm relatively comfortable with the key identifying features on the pommel, grip and guard but trying to determine if there are additional things to look for.

There are quite a few fakes out there being offered as original. Take a look at the Arizona Swords website as in his Fakes section he shows a few of the B&G fakes.

 

[bayonet]

I'm considering the purchase of a sword advertised as a B&G. I'm relatively comfortable with the key identifying features on the pommel, grip and guard but trying to determine if there are additional things to look for.

Careful if your a young collector. There are many fake CS items out there. Stick to "well known" Dealers. CS Swords sell in the thousands. In over 45 plus years of collecting I have made mistakes but recovered from them nicely. Like folks here have said over & over, buy the reference books and get educated before you buy.

 

[Enoch L. Cade]

Thanks folks. this is a dealer that's well known, I think. is there a list of "trustworthy" dealers somewhere on a forum?

 

[JackADriscoll]

And posting pics here is frequently a good idea. Lot of knowledge here

 

[gjpratt]

I'm considering the purchase of a sword advertised as a B&G. I'm relatively comfortable with the key identifying features on the pommel, grip and guard but trying to determine if there are additional things to look for.

Going a little deeper, then. The etching on B (Boyle) & Gs blades is light. Many, if not a majority+, of etched blades are very faint if not barely perceptible. Particularly if the sword was used. That effect cannot be faked, at least not effectively. Another diagnostic feature is a flaw in the blades just below the ricasso. This is not evident on all B&G swords but when it is, then it is a strong indication of authenticity.

I have one with a flawed blade and near imperceptible etching. After ownership for 20+ years, my friend and mentor, @TLHS ,examined the etching under magnification and discovered it was Burger Brothers style — a distinctive sunburst. That is a much rarer sword

 

[Enoch L. Cade]

And posting pics here is frequently a good idea. Lot of knowledge here

Thank you. I'm going to take a look at it tomorrow and will take a few pics. and if no one objects will post here. Lanyard Puller helped me avoid a terrible mistake with a fake Mississippi rifle. I appreciate y'all's help.

 

[Enoch L. Cade]

Going a little deeper, then. The etching on B (Boyle) & Gs blades is light. Many, if not a majority+, of etched blades are very faint if not barely perceptible. Particularly if the sword was used. That effect cannot be faked, at least not effectively. Another diagnostic feature is a flaw in the blades just below the ricasso. This is not evident on all B&G swords but when it is, then it is a strong indication of authenticity.

I have one with a flawed blade and near imperceptible etching. After ownership for 20+ years, my friend and mentor, @TLHS ,examined the etching under magnification and discovered it was Burger Brothers style — a distinctive sunburst. That is a much rarer sword

Burger Brothers was also a Richmond sword maker, correct? And they merged later in the war with B&G, or at least worked more closely together.

This blade does not appear to have the etching, but I am taking a magnifying glass tomorrow. What is the blade flaw that you mentioned?

And congrats own owning a blade with more value than you realized.

 

[JackADriscoll]

Thread 'Boyle & Gamble Officers Sword Cost Then and Now'

Nov 12, 2019

Boyle & Gamble was one of the largest producers of swords for the CS Army and made several different type swords. The finest ones they made were the Field & Staff officers swords and depending on condition, etching and if ID to an officer can quite expensive. Below is an invoice from B&G in 1863 and as you can see the officers sword was $28. Today they go anywhere from $5000 to $60,000.

• UCVRelics
• Replies: 2
• Forum: Edged Weapons

• 

Here's an old but good thread on them

 

[LtDan]

Here's a few pictures of a B&G foot officer's sword that I bought 30+ years ago. There wasn't much leather remaining on the grip. You can see faint etching on one side and a good example of the blade flaw mentioned above on the other side. Hope this helps.

 

[gjpratt]

Burger Brothers was also a Richmond sword maker, correct? And they merged later in the war with B&G, or at least worked more closely together.

This blade does not appear to have the etching, but I am taking a magnifying glass tomorrow. What is the blade flaw that you mentioned?

And congrats own owning a blade with more value than you realized.

@LtDan posted a great photo of the blade flaw in post 13 above.

Correct on Burger Bros.

 

[Enoch L. Cade]

This is not the boyle and gamble blade I'll be looking at later. This one is represented as a sword possibly made by E.J. Johnson of Macon, Georgia. The seller -- who has been in the business for a long time -- points to the unstopped blade fuller and the configuration of the brass guard. He notes there are others who think it may be another maker. Appreciate any thoughts.

 

[gjpratt]

Is the grip polished wood?

I am by no means an expert on E.J. Johnston swords but I have always thought that the infantry swords were characterized by polished wood grips and a stopped fuller blade. The examples I am familiar with are all high end swords that include etching on the blade. The company was a prolific sword manufacturer, however. According to Albaugh, they produced 40 infantry swords per week. That in and of itself suggests that they must have turned out quite a few more generic foot officer swords. I am unaware of such examples. Hence, my caveat. In fact, if I came across a sword like this one I would consult someone more knowledgeable.