Another Misidentified Indianola?

[JPK Huson 1863]

I tend to trust this book way too much, so leave these alone for he most part. Thought I better see what's up with this one, before accepting it's what it says it is?

 

[Kazziga]

This is not a misidentified one. It is THE RIGHT Indianola under construction

 

[Mike Serpa]

The Library of Congress titles this photo "Wreck of U.S. gunboat Indianola - Mississippi River Fleet." LOC #34022

An article from wikipedia supports this title: "After Vicksburg fell, and following long and difficult struggle, Indianola was refloated 5 January 1865 and towed to Mound City, Illinois, 17 January, where she was sold."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Indianola_(1862)


historynet.com reads: "The salvage party made a half-hearted attempt to raise Indianola during the night before losing their nerve. On the 26th they blew up the wreck, although a couple guns were later recovered."

http://www.historynet.com/uss-indianola-union-ironclad-in-the-american-civil-war.htm


Does this boat look in poor condition for a new ship being built or good condition for a boat that was blown up? Is it another boat entirely? Are letters visible under the man second from the right on top the boat? Were logs hewn at the build site? Were boats built at a naval yard? etc. Adding a cropped version of a larger albumen print. Not a lot of clarity in either photo.

 

[georgew]

The Library of Congress titles this photo "Wreck of U.S. gunboat Indianola - Mississippi River Fleet." LOC #34022

An article from wikipedia supports this title: "After Vicksburg fell, and following long and difficult struggle, Indianola was refloated 5 January 1865 and towed to Mound City, Illinois, 17 January, where she was sold."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Indianola_(1862)


historynet.com reads: "The salvage party made a half-hearted attempt to raise Indianola during the night before losing their nerve. On the 26th they blew up the wreck, although a couple guns were later recovered."

http://www.historynet.com/uss-indianola-union-ironclad-in-the-american-civil-war.htm


Does this boat look in poor condition for a new ship being built or good condition for a boat that was blown up? Is it another boat entirely? Are letters visible under the man second from the right on top the boat? Were logs hewn at the build site? Were boats built at a naval yard? etc. Adding a cropped version of a larger albumen print. Not a lot of clarity in either photo.

View attachment 19190

I think that you are looking at a salvage operation by Union forces. The casemate and machinery for the paddle-wheel portion of her propulsion are not evident. The weathering on the hull may be a combination of usage and submersion. You have good eyes, there are letters on the hull forward. They almost look like the kind of thing that people today spray on almost anything that seems abandoned. No sign of a pump or salvage boat in the picture. I wonder if this is a picture made during a low water period on the river? Does anyone know how much the Mississippi varies by season in this area?

 

[Kazziga]

Mike, these are some interesting questions. You and George may be right. The ship in the photo doesn't look new.
The letters are there, but they do not make much sense:

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

Thank you,very helpful since I already had a faux Indianola, is the thing, which is a photo that had her name on it, written in what looks like crayon ( realize it's not, probably some oil base pen ) . Interesting, guess it would be tough to tell whether a ship is being taken apart or being built- unless the photo had been found, like this one.

Could those letters have something to do with maybe an identification being posted on the ship, where it was to have been taken for destruction- or by whom, or who bought it maybe at auction somewhere? You know, like when someone goes through a junk yard with a can of spray paint, same thing?

 

[georgew]

Thank you,very helpful since I already had a faux Indianola, is the thing, which is a photo that had her name on it, written in what looks like crayon ( realize it's not, probably some oil base pen ) . Interesting, guess it would be tough to tell whether a ship is being taken apart or being built- unless the photo had been found, like this one.

Could those letters have something to do with maybe an identification being posted on the ship, where it was to have been taken for destruction- or by whom, or who bought it maybe at auction somewhere? You know, like when someone goes through a junk yard with a can of spray paint, same thing?

you may be on to something. Adison with two D's is a name. If you look at the vertical timbers below the letters you see a series of holes along the length of the vessel. These could have been the bolt holes for securing iron above the vessel's waterline. If true, then she had already been stripped of her iron.

 

[georgew]

Thank you,very helpful since I already had a faux Indianola, is the thing, which is a photo that had her name on it, written in what looks like crayon ( realize it's not, probably some oil base pen ) . Interesting, guess it would be tough to tell whether a ship is being taken apart or being built- unless the photo had been found, like this one.

Could those letters have something to do with maybe an identification being posted on the ship, where it was to have been taken for destruction- or by whom, or who bought it maybe at auction somewhere? You know, like when someone goes through a junk yard with a can of spray paint, same thing?

It just hit me that the machinery on the deck of the vessel seems to attach to a 90 deg fitting and then down through the deck on both sides. The location is about where you would expect to find the side-wheels for the Indianola's hybrid propulsion system. They seem to be inboard which doesn't make much sense. But it also occurs that the they may be supports for pump lines used to raise the hull during salvage

 

[Mike Serpa]

Mike, these are some interesting questions. You and George may be right. The ship in the photo doesn't look new.
The letters are there, but they do not make much sense:

View attachment 19206

MADISON?

 

[JPK Huson 1863]

I realize I don't know anything on ships, but the writing is just not careful enough to be anything official or permanent- like the ship's name, must indicate something else.

Gee whiz. I can't believe it's possible to get so much specific information from this photo. I see part of a ship and some teeny tiny men. Wow.

 

[Mike Serpa]

Screen shot from http://hdl.huntington.org/cdm/compoundobject/collection/p16003coll6/id/3594/rec/5

The Indianola - Wrecked - ; Being Broken Up & Machinery Removed. The note say to see vol. 6 page 71 of Miller's Photographic History of the Civil War for a different description. A screen shot is below.

My experience of 0 years, 0 months, 0 weeks, 0 days as a shipbuilder leads me to believe it is being disassembled.

 

[Mark F. Jenkins]

I don't buy the 'damage' in the second image for a moment. It's clearly a doctored version of the first image, complete with men standing in the same places and poses.

That aside...

If it's being disassembled... why are the hog chains still up? What's the purpose of maintaining the form of the hull if it's merely being broken up?

Also, the most common way of recovering the metal parts from riverboats was to set fire to them. Taking it apart piece by piece doesn't make sense.

So, for now, I'm still betting on 'construction' rather than wrecking/salvage.

 

[1stMS-Arty]

The second photograph says "building the Indianola" so it is not claiming the photo to be the wreck. They do appear to be the same photo the second one has a blemish of some kind.

Also I believe the Indianola was refloated and towed off....so the photo could very well be showing the hull in preparation to be towed.

Look at the line going completely down the hull that appears to show a water mark....as if it had been in water up to that point. Very consistent with the level of the river rising and lowering. Farragut himself said at times he could see the wreck while he was passing up and down the river in spring of 1863. I believe he also states sometimes the wreck was not visible.

Another case for salvage is the presence of sailors and officers....almost all the people in the photograph appear to be naval personnel. Why would the be present during construction?

It appears the armor plates are still in place along the hull. I believe the armor was one the last thing added to ironclads during construction but I suppose it could have been added to the hull at an early phase. But look at the alignment of the plates immediately behind the letters on the front of the hull. They appear to be out of alignment with the rest of the plates.

The hogging chains would probably be left in place for the towing process.

Also there is another photo allegedly showing the Indianola "under construction" but I believe it was probably taken at the same time as the other photograph...

More naval officers and sailors......note the propeller and apparently more out of place armor plates........

 

[1stMS-Arty]

Certainly could explain why a salvage operation might resemble construction. They had to get into floating shape.

Also this photo of Pook turtles under construction has a very different look to it than the Indianola photos.
Expired Image Removed

 

[Mark F. Jenkins]

I just don't know. The stern shot looks even more to me like it's on some sort of building ramp or structure. But the supposition of getting her into floating shape resembling a launching is well-taken.

 

[1stMS-Arty]

Another possibility is that it was photographed at Mound City while being dismantled.
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