ACW battery?

[archieclement]

I was wondering if anyone has seen a complete battery done? Assume it would be rather rare as a 6 gun battery would required 120 or up horses for guns, caissons, limbers. So assume 4 gun battery would took 80 or more.

If not what's the closest you've seen done approaching an actual complete battery?

 

[Old Breck]

First Section and the Liberty Rifles regularly puts full batteries in the field.

1.5M views · 24K reactions | Returning to camp to rest and refit. This weekend 1st Section successfully portrayed the complete Battery C, 1st New York Light Artillery as it recuperated and resupplied in the weeks after the Battle of Antietam. | 1st

Returning to camp to rest and refit. This weekend 1st Section successfully portrayed the complete Battery C, 1st New York Light Artillery as it recuperated and resupplied in the weeks after the...

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1st Section

1st Section. 16,710 likes · 2,049 talking about this. The First Section is an authentic horse-drawn artillery living history organization dedicated to accurately portraying the common soldier of the...

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The Park — The Liberty Rifles

www.libertyrifles.org

The Patrol — The Liberty Rifles

www.libertyrifles.org

I Hear the Distant Thunder — The Liberty Rifles

www.libertyrifles.org

This year will see a full scale artillery battalion from the Army of Tennessee Artillery Reserve recreated. I hope to be able to make it.

We Soon Got Proud — The Liberty Rifles

www.libertyrifles.org

 

[archieclement]

First Section and the Liberty Rifles regularly puts full batteries in the field.

1.5M views · 24K reactions | Returning to camp to rest and refit. This weekend 1st Section successfully portrayed the complete Battery C, 1st New York Light Artillery as it recuperated and resupplied in the weeks after the Battle of Antietam. | 1st

Returning to camp to rest and refit. This weekend 1st Section successfully portrayed the complete Battery C, 1st New York Light Artillery as it recuperated and resupplied in the weeks after the...

www.facebook.com

1st Section

1st Section. 16,710 likes · 2,049 talking about this. The First Section is an authentic horse-drawn artillery living history organization dedicated to accurately portraying the common soldier of the...

www.facebook.com

The Park — The Liberty Rifles

www.libertyrifles.org

The Patrol — The Liberty Rifles

www.libertyrifles.org

I Hear the Distant Thunder — The Liberty Rifles

www.libertyrifles.org

This year will see a full scale artillery battalion from the Army of Tennessee Artillery Reserve recreated. I hope to be able to make it.

We Soon Got Proud — The Liberty Rifles

www.libertyrifles.org

From the first video, they look well short. 2 guns 24 horses/mules.

If a 6 gun battery had minimum of 120 horses, their section is just about half of what a real section should had, as would been 40+ horses.

 

[1st Section]

From the first video, they look well short. 2 guns 24 horses/mules.

If a 6 gun battery had minimum of 120 horses, their section is just about half of what a real section should had, as would been 40+ horses.

That particular video doesn't show the entire group. The specific impression is Battery C, 1st New York Light Artillery as they were in October of 1862 and it was done entirely to scale.

 

[The Ninth Ohio]

In all fairness, with illness, injury and such also affecting animals, I would have a hard time believing many batteries were ever at that strength for long.

We have also very rarely seen full strength infantry companies portrayed by living historians, let alone full battalions. It's a big ask to get that many people together (or in this case, animals) for a situation that didn't happen often.

Edit/Add: My understanding is that groups like 1st Section and the Liberty Rifles choose their specific portrayals partially based on what they can reasonably expect from the hobby. i.e., if you can only expect to get 200 folks together who will be able to meet your authenticity standards, then you choose an impression for that weekend that encompasses 200 or fewer men. So when they say "full scale", what they mean is "to scale for the unit being portrayed at that particular time." At the reenactments i have attended where 1st Section was present, they portrayed an artillery regiment "to scale".

Now, whether they researched down to exactly how many animals were present in the section at the time? I don't know, but they do have a very good record with regard to how they perform and apply their research as far as living history goes.

 

[johan_steele]

Years ago I saw an add for an arty unit retiring. They had an original 3" ordnance rifle, carriage, cassion, tack & trailer etc went for something like $100k. Now add a minimum of 3 more plus the horses, trailers, vet bills, permits etc… you're looking at a healthy chunk of change before you even get to the men and material to move it and represent it.

New Ulm Battery has a complete battery sans the horses. Rock Island Arsenal has a complete 6 gun battery with all the sundries and they don't move it real often & that's the US Army.

 

[archieclement]

In all fairness, with illness, injury and such also affecting animals, I would have a hard time believing many batteries were ever at that strength for long.

We have also very rarely seen full strength infantry companies portrayed by living historians, let alone full battalions. It's a big ask to get that many people together (or in this case, animals) for a situation that didn't happen often.

Edit/Add: My understanding is that groups like 1st Section and the Liberty Rifles choose their specific portrayals partially based on what they can reasonably expect from the hobby. i.e., if you can only expect to get 200 folks together who will be able to meet your authenticity standards, then you choose an impression for that weekend that encompasses 200 or fewer men. So when they say "full scale", what they mean is "to scale for the unit being portrayed at that particular time." At the reenactments i have attended where 1st Section was present, they portrayed an artillery regiment "to scale".

Now, whether they researched down to exactly how many animals were present in the section at the time? I don't know, but they do have a very good record with regard to how they perform and apply their research as far as living history goes.

Actually what I see online 120 is rather minimum gave, with some saying upwards 180-200 horse.

Would assume variance could depend on number of caissons and if any supply wagon/s attached.

Your mentioning illness/lame would account for batteries having to have extra/spare horses with battery.

In the period wouldn't been unusual, actually a battery requirement would pale in comparison to cavalry or supply train requirements on horses/mules.

 

[archieclement]

I would love to see something like Prices Raid, where entire army was mounted. Some accounts have it traveling in 3 different columns each 2-3 miles long. Imagine doesn't include train.

Will never happen today though. Cav regt could be well over 1000 horse......not counting horses in attached batteries and train.

 

[1st Section]

Edit/Add: My understanding is that groups like 1st Section and the Liberty Rifles choose their specific portrayals partially based on what they can reasonably expect from the hobby. i.e., if you can only expect to get 200 folks together who will be able to meet your authenticity standards, then you choose an impression for that weekend that encompasses 200 or fewer men. So when they say "full scale", what they mean is "to scale for the unit being portrayed at that particular time." At the reenactments i have attended where 1st Section was present, they portrayed an artillery regiment "to scale".

Now, whether they researched down to exactly how many animals were present in the section at the time? I don't know, but they do have a very good record with regard to how they perform and apply their research as far as living history goes.

Correct. We base our impressions on very specific times and places. Even in cases where you may not know the exact number of serviceable draft and saddle horses they had available, you can usually determine whether they were using teams of six or were reduced to four. You also know if they had all, some, or none of their guns and caissons with them.

As an example, here we are portraying Johnston's Bedford Artillery (Virginia), as they were at Sharpsburg, MD, September 1862. They were a three gun battery deficient in men, animals and equipment. We matched the gun types, caissons, wagons, teams, and number of men on the exact spot of ground they occupied during the battle.

 

[PrivateBrooke]

Like I've said before, regardless of branch, there's a huge difference between regulation strength and actual field strength. "There were a thousand of us then. There are less than three hundred of us now."

 

[RedRover]

New Ulm Battery has a complete battery sans the horses. Rock Island Arsenal has a complete 6 gun battery with all the sundries and they don't move it real often & that's the US Army.

Nothing new... From 1821 to 1838, they Army supplied no horses for artillery service. The artillerymen served as fortress troops or infantry. When field pieces had to occasionally be employed on the frontiers, the artillerymen got the horses from the quartermaster's department evidently.

 

[archieclement]

Years ago I saw an add for an arty unit retiring. They had an original 3" ordnance rifle, carriage, cassion, tack & trailer etc went for something like $100k. Now add a minimum of 3 more plus the horses, trailers, vet bills, permits etc… you're looking at a healthy chunk of change before you even get to the men and material to move it and represent it.

New Ulm Battery has a complete battery sans the horses. Rock Island Arsenal has a complete 6 gun battery with all the sundries and they don't move it real often & that's the US Army.

Several reenactments I been to they apparently had Toyota pickups for the guns

 

[The Ninth Ohio]

Several reenactments I been to they apparently had Toyota pickups for the guns

Just like any hobby, there's a spectrum. You've got the folks who haul the guns in with pickups and pound a case in the truck bed every night. You've got the folks who want to do it right but can only afford the gun. You've got people dedicated enough to incorporate, train, research, and do everything by the book, and get it all paid for to boot.

 

[TallTallMan]

Yesterday, while trying to type a response to something on this forum, the keyboard wouldn't capitalize. I took the battery out and put in a new one. That was when I saw, and used, ACW batteries.

 

[John Winn]

Actually what I see online 120 is rather minimum gave, with some saying upwards 180-200 horse.

Would assume variance could depend on number of caissons and if any supply wagon/s attached.

Your mentioning illness/lame would account for batteries having to have extra/spare horses with battery.

In the period wouldn't been unusual, actually a battery requirement would pale in comparison to cavalry or supply train requirements on horses/mules.

Several years ago I wrote an article about field artillery and in it I estimate the minimum number of horses and mules needed for both six- and four-gun batteries. For a six-gun battery I determined the absolute minimum is 74 horses and 14 mules. Fewer than that and the battery couldn't be moved.

While the manuals called for 150 horses in practice that rarely happened. I've got a number of reports from the AOP that said between 109 and 122 were common (for a six-gun battery). Confederate batteries usually had fewer horses and typically used four-horse teams for that reason.

 

[Dan Kohli]

The calculation given by the Hand-Book of Artillery for a Federal six piece battery of the configuration commonly used in the war was 91 draught horses. But this excludes the horses used by the sergeants, officers, and the teams used for the wagons. If the 11 saddle horses, for the officers and sergeants, and six mules/ horses for the wagon are included it would be 108 of those critters. And for some batteries that had ambulances attached there should have been two horses to pull that vehicle. This would bring the total to 110 horses.

I was going with the assumption that the battery was not a flying battery or had an additional six caissons that some batteries might have been equipped with.

 

[Cavalier]

I've always wanted to see how a battery limbered and unlimbered on the battlefield. I was told to check the Queen's Troop, Royal Horse Artillery on you tube. Not sure if that's exactly how a U.S or C.S. battery would have done that but it was very interesting. Quite a bit going on.

John

 

[1st Section]

I've always wanted to see how a battery limbered and unlimbered on the battlefield. I was told to check the Queen's Troop, Royal Horse Artillery on you tube. Not sure if that's exactly how a U.S or C.S. battery would have done that but it was very interesting. Quite a bit going on.

John

The Royal Horse mounted drill is actually quite similar to 1860s US/CS at least as far as maneuvering from column into line into battery. I share their videos with the guys in my group a lot.

 

[Cavalier]

@1st Section Thanks, I'm glad to hear that. Its a great video. Its fascinating to see how they did that.

John

 

[redbob]

This is what a "Horse " Artillery battery would have looked like with everyone mounted. A standard battery would probably had half as many horses.