6 pdr's

[archieclement]

How effective would 6pdrs be against prepared earthworks? Would 4-8 guns have much an effect?

 

[UCVRelics]

Only if they fired a BUNCH of rounds

 

[Belfoured]

Only if they fired a BUNCH of rounds

For certain. The M1841 fired solid shot which weighed half as much as that used by the M1857 Napoleon and used half the powder charge.

 

[archieclement]

reading the last hurrah a newer work on Price's raid, its a breath of fresh air saying some things I always have......but it falls somewhat into repeating the same old same old as to Price should have just bombarded the fort into submission from Shepherds mountain.........which I've felt is false

A-Price only had 12 guns present, all 6 pdrs....
B- Price did get 2 of the guns on top of Shepherds mountain.....it took teams of 8 horses and 6 mules each to get them up there in 2 1/2 hrs. 2 others turned back, and least one of the four broke carriage and gun was abandoned on mountain.

If he had got 6-8 guns up there, they would still be rather puny 6 pdr's and if took 8 horses and 6 mules to get one gun up there..........thinking keeping them supplied with a bunch of ammo rather unlikely.

If they weren't atop the mountain, they faced counter battery fire from guns bigger then 6pdr, which limits that........

 

[Rhea Cole]

Force is equal to mass times the velocity squared. The six pound shot would have been going something just under the speed of sound when it struck the target. Brick or stone is brittle. It was possible to bang away at a masonry wall & make a breach. There are many examples of that happening during the age of blackpowder warfare.

Dirt is an excellent shock absorber. Which is why forts built in the artillery age have large earthen berms.

The earthen berms of Fortress Rosecrans in Murfreesboro TN were built to this design.
​

The glacis, exterior slope & superior slope are designed to deflect a cannon ball. The mass & shape of the berms could absorb a large number of impacts by low trajectory six pounder cannon fire. The only vulnerable area of the design is the very top edge of the interior slope. That is where a head log would have been installed. The circular error of a smoothbore six pounder at 800 yards is about the size of a barn door. Even at closer ranges, an 1841 model six pounder which was ubiquitous in the frist years of the war, was not accurate enough to strike the headlong with regularity.

It was Mr. Newton's laws that gave the 12 pound gun-howitzer Napoleon its wallop. Once again, banging away at earthen fortifications would be a largely futile exercise. Smoothbore siege guns are huge in order to bring the second law of motion into effect. Rifled guns could strike a target with exponentially greater pounds per square inch of force. They were also accurate. At the 800 yard range, a rifled gun could hit the window in the six pounder's barn door over & over again.

 

[Belfoured]

Force is equal to mass times the velocity squared. The six pound shot would have been going something just under the speed of sound when it struck the target. Brick or stone is brittle. It was possible to bang away at a masonry wall & make a breach. There are many examples of that happening during the age of blackpowder warfare.

Dirt is an excellent shock absorber. Which is why forts built in the artillery age have large earthen berms.

View attachment 364541
The earthen berms of Fortress Rosecrans in Murfreesboro TN was built to this design.
​

The glacis, exterior slope I superior slope are designed to deflect a cannon ball. The mass & shape of the berms could absorb a large number of impacts by low trajectory six pounder cannon fire. The only vulnerable area of the design is the very top edge of the interior slope. That is where a head log would have been installed. The circular error of a smoothbore six pounder at 800 yards is about the size of a barn door. Even at closer ranges, an 1841 model six pounder which was ubiquitous in the frist years of the war, was not accurate enough to strike the headlong with regularity.

It was Mr. Newton's laws that gave the 12 pound gun-howitzer Napoleon its wallop. Once again, banging away at earthen fortifications would be a largely futile exercise. Smoothbore siege guns are huge in order to bring the second law of motion into effect. Rifled guns could strike a target with exponentially greater pounds per square inch of force. They were also accurate. At the 800 yard range, a rifled gun could hit the window in the six pounder's barn door over & over again.

Great points regarding the composition of the target and the basic issue of deflection/angle, which became central to the design of warships in the 20th century. As an aside, the only practical use for bolts by the rifles in field artillery was against solid/stationary targets. Hunt's prescribed chest for field artillery rifles did not include bolts - as opposed to including solid shot for the M1857 Napoleon. Try ricochet firing with a bolt. Ultimately the M1841 6 pounder was obsolete by 1861 for several reasons - despite its impressive and successful use in the War with Mexico.

 

[TerryB]

Force is equal to mass times the velocity squared. The six pound shot would have been going something just under the speed of sound when it struck the target. Brick or stone is brittle. It was possible to bang away at a masonry wall & make a breach. There are many examples of that happening during the age of blackpowder warfare.

Dirt is an excellent shock absorber. Which is why forts built in the artillery age have large earthen berms.

View attachment 364541
The earthen berms of Fortress Rosecrans in Murfreesboro TN was built to this design.
​

The glacis, exterior slope I superior slope are designed to deflect a cannon ball. The mass & shape of the berms could absorb a large number of impacts by low trajectory six pounder cannon fire. The only vulnerable area of the design is the very top edge of the interior slope. That is where a head log would have been installed. The circular error of a smoothbore six pounder at 800 yards is about the size of a barn door. Even at closer ranges, an 1841 model six pounder which was ubiquitous in the frist years of the war, was not accurate enough to strike the headlong with regularity.

It was Mr. Newton's laws that gave the 12 pound gun-howitzer Napoleon its wallop. Once again, banging away at earthen fortifications would be a largely futile exercise. Smoothbore siege guns are huge in order to bring the second law of motion into effect. Rifled guns could strike a target with exponentially greater pounds per square inch of force. They were also accurate. At the 800 yard range, a rifled gun could hit the window in the six pounder's barn door over & over again.

Somewhere I read that arty damage done to forts in the ACW was usually repaired overnight. A lot of trial and error went into getting the trajectory right for inflicting maximum damage. I'm talking earthen forts of course.

 

[Rhea Cole]

Somebody might have a citation, but I do not recall a classic siege bombardment to create a breach of an earthen wall during the CW. Fort Pulaski's breaching by rifled 30 lb Parrotts is the only one that comes to mind. Perhaps it is just my sampling error, but I do not know of a formal siege with saps leading to a forlorn hope charging into a breach.

 

[Belfoured]

Somebody might have a citation, but I do not recall a classic siege bombardment to create a breach of an earthen wall during the CW. Fort Pulaski's breaching by rifled 30 lb Parrotts is the only one that comes to mind. Perhaps it is just my sampling error, but I do not know of a formal siege with saps leading to a forlorn hope charging into a breach.

And by comparison to earthen walls, there is the mess that was Fort Sumter by 1865.