45-70?

[Patrick H]

When you acquire it, I hope you will post some photos of it.

 

[Rebforever]

I know a guy who competes in BPCR Silhoutte and Long range matches. He paper patches and puts 82g in the 45-70 case. With compression and seating depth it can be done. And BTW, he's won and placed in a number of matches. I'm using 75g in my 50-70 with minimal compression.

Bet he uses a longer shell. You start compressing black powder it will blow. Eventually. 1/16" compression is recommended for BP loading.
Also could cause case bulge.

 

[Story]

I may have a chance to buy a 1879 trapdoor Springfield carbine.

What are they a$king?

 

[poorjack]

Bet he uses a longer shell. You start compressing black powder it will blow. Eventually. 1/16" compression is recommended for BP loading.
Also could cause case bulge.

Uhmm, no. There are guys compressing as much as .370, nearly 3/8in. I compress 1/16 for 50-70 and get 75gr in the case with a 400gr bullet in Starline brass.

 

[archieclement]

What are they a$king?

It's going to be at a local auction.

 

[archieclement]

The only period gun I have is the over under we found. I keep thinking I'd like to have another period piece to hang with it.......willing to include old west lol

 

[Booner]

I have an original trapdoor 45/70, the 1884 rifled musket model. I've shot both factory ammo (the 405 grain bullet) and handloaded ammo with the 405 grain bullet and around 60 some grains of 2f goex black powder. The original case for the 45/70 was made of copper and could hold more powder than the modern brass cases, thus my reduced load. The 1884 model had a stronger breach block design than previous models, so commercial ammo of the proper pressure was used. the accuracy was pretty good, despite some barrel pitting. I reloaded those fired cases with black powder and pure lead bullet and accuracy was horrible. I suspect the pitted barrel along with a pure lead bullet was the problem. If I were to work on the loads for this gun again, I'd add some tin to harden the bullet, (the factory loads had a harder bullet), or try a paper-patched bullet.
I also have a 1874 Sharps Pedersoli repro model in 45/70 that shoot a 500 grain bullet, cast with a 30/1 lead/tin bullet. I first shot it with factory ammo with a 405 grain bullet and was disappointed with the results. I reloaded the factory brass with 2f black powder and a 500 grain bullet cast 30/1 and was still disappointed. I had a fellow that was very experienced in shooting black powder cartridge guns tell me that the chamber in the Pedersoli was rather long and the bullet needed to be jammed into the rifling for better accuracy. I loaded the bullet long in the case so it was jammed into the lands and accuracy was improved greatly. I then purchased some Starline 45/90 cases, and trimmed them back so the fit into the chamber and with the same 500 grain bullet, a fiber wad and 68 grains Goex 2f compressed about 1/4 inch and accuracy is excellent.

Be advised that the recoil of a 45/70 is rather stout.
And author Paul A Matthews has a number of books out concerning reloading and shooting the 45/70.

If you get the chance to inspect the bore of this carbine, (take a flashlight), I wouldn't be surprised if it was rather dark with some pitting. As long as it's not real bad, it shouldn't effect accuracy too much.

Lastly, at a gun show in Colorado Springs years ago, there was a guy who had a both and his specialty was converting trap door rifles into carbines. He was really good at his craft. At that time a good trapdoor rifle was going for around $600 but a carbine was probably worth twice that, so I imagine his business was pretty good.

 

[Stone in the wall]

I bought my trapdoor while deer hunting in Sugar Grove WV with my 45-70 Shikari in the early 1990's. That gun took a lot of deer. While at the little country store I saw a trapdoor hanging behind the counter. The stock had been cut down, and missing the rear sight, $200 with a box of ammo. I cast 450 grain bullets, and my buddy loved that gun. Shooting it while sitting in a lawn chair, every shot that chair rocked way back until it almost tipped over backwards. Bobby just laughed and reloaded it. I dropped back to casting 405 grain bullets from 450 grain to reduce the kick back.
I also have a 14" pistol barrel 45-70 for my Thompson and it's not fun to shoot, but that's another story.

 

[poorjack]

Just to clear up a bit of incorrect info in a previous post.

The reason modern brass has smaller case capacity is due to the original cases being "balloon head" v solid head in a modern case. Look the term up to get an illustration of the difference.

 

[Rebforever]

Just to clear up a bit of incorrect info in a previous post.

The reason modern brass has smaller case capacity is due to the original cases being "balloon head" v solid head in a modern case. Look the term up to get an illustration of the difference.

They were also copper.

 

[archieclement]

Another one I didn't win......it sold for $1200..not counting auction commission........when I was a kid in the 80's there was a general store that had literally 100's of used guns lining the aisles, we kids would buy and trade WW2 surplus guns every year to deer hunt for $60-80..........wishing I had bought em all up and sit on them from the auctions I see today.

 

[Stone in the wall]

Another one I didn't win......it sold for $1200..not counting auction commission........when I was a kid in the 80's there was a general store that had literally 100's of used guns lining the aisles, we kids would buy and trade WW2 surplus guns every year to deer hunt for $60-80..........wishing I had bought em all up and sit on them from the auctions I see today.

I was in a place like that in Kingstown Maine while hunting mid 1990's. A whole aisle of old Winchesters 1876,1886 and so on. My buddy needed cartridges, I was using my muzzle loader, and then lady asked "how many do you want?" We had never seen anybody sell less than a box. Seems up there it was common to buy 3 or 4 at a time.