1860 US Navy Cutlass

[Frank1959]

Hello all,

I recently acquired this USN marked Ames cutlass. Inspected by Daniel Reynolds in 1861. I don't see a serial number which worries me. It was from a collection of a serious military collector. He had a REAL Colt 1847 Walker! Is this cutlass genuine? The blade is NOT sharp at all. I'm guessing I should not sharpen it or polish it. I might get a new leather scabbard made for it unless someone on here knows where to get a metal one. The length is 32" overall.
Did these weapons get any real use in the civil war? In my opinion, most the fighting was on land. Let me know if I am wrong. Thanks again everyone.

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[bobinwmass]

Unfortunately, this appears to be a reproduction. They were made with these exact stampings, which while somewhat similar, are not exactly like the originals. At one time you could get through places like Dixie Gun Works

 

[R. Porter]

The cutlass looks ok to me. The blade looks old. The 1861 looks like it comes from a single stamp and not individual digits. The DR is not the same size as the U.S.N. The lack of serial number is not a problem when coupled with the 1861 date since the first 600 were not stamped with a serial number originally. They were supposed to be stamped later but I don't know if that was done or partially done or not done at all. The original scabbard was leather with copper rivets down the back and a brass button for a frog on front.

My disclaimer is that l'm not an expert, the cutlass expert is Richard E. Schenk.

Some links:

Ames US Navy M1860 Civil War Naval Cutlass Over 25000 produced in Use for Over 80 Years - Historical, Identification, Technical Information

M1860 Naval Cutlass Produced for the Union US Navy During the Civil War by Ames MFG. Co. Chicopee

www.thepirateslair.com

Fake Reproduction Navy Naval Cutlass - M1860, M1833, M1917 Ames Mfg Co Chicopee, Mass

Reproductions and Fakes - Naval Cutlass or Sword, M1860, M1917

www.thepirateslair.com

From a previous thread:

M1861 Cutlass | Edged Weapons

In 2017 I wrote an article on the M1861 cutlass which was published in “Man-at-Arms” magazine. Since then, considerable new information has come to light, especially that regarding late-date cutlasses and the cutlasses used by the Revenue Cutter Service. With Stuart Mowbray’s permission, Mark...

civilwartalk.com

 

[JackADriscoll]

give it a light cleaning in that i mean stop the active rust. Do not sharpen it if you want to retain value. The worst things you can do are deep clean or sharpen if you want to retain value but ultimately it is your sword. Original scabbards for these are rare as hens teeth but they can be found with some patience. Some of them would have had some practical use but classic ship to ship boarding actions were not something one would call common in the civil war. I think its nice I would be proud to have it.

 

[bobinwmass]

The cutlass looks ok to me. The blade looks old. The 1861 looks like it comes from a single stamp and not individual digits. The DR is not the same size as the U.S.N. The lack of serial number is not a problem when coupled with the 1861 date since the first 600 were not stamped with a serial number originally. They were supposed to be stamped later but I don't know if that was done or partially done or not done at all. The original scabbard was leather with copper rivets down the back and a brass button for a frog on front.

My disclaimer is that l'm not an expert, the cutlass expert is Richard E. Schenk.

Some links:

Ames US Navy M1860 Civil War Naval Cutlass Over 25000 produced in Use for Over 80 Years - Historical, Identification, Technical Information

M1860 Naval Cutlass Produced for the Union US Navy During the Civil War by Ames MFG. Co. Chicopee

www.thepirateslair.com

Fake Reproduction Navy Naval Cutlass - M1860, M1833, M1917 Ames Mfg Co Chicopee, Mass

Reproductions and Fakes - Naval Cutlass or Sword, M1860, M1917

www.thepirateslair.com

From a previous thread:

M1861 Cutlass | Edged Weapons

In 2017 I wrote an article on the M1861 cutlass which was published in “Man-at-Arms” magazine. Since then, considerable new information has come to light, especially that regarding late-date cutlasses and the cutlasses used by the Revenue Cutter Service. With Stuart Mowbray’s permission, Mark...

civilwartalk.com

If you look at the link about fake Ames Cutlasses from the Pirates Lair that you gave us, you will this one identifed as a fake.

 

[bobinwmass]

In addition to the unusually deep Ames stamping on the cutlass presented here (the stamping is typically much lighter on originals), on an original 1860 cutlass, you can typically count 18 wire wrapped grooves on the hilt. I only count 15 wire wraps on this one. It just seems wrong to me, but admittedly a good copy. Just my humble opinion, but enough to make me avoid it.

 

[Frank1959]

Thanks for all the info guys. I'm only in this thing for $375 w/ auction fees. I think its just too cool! But keep the comments coming, I love learning.

 

[Frank1959]

give it a light cleaning in that i mean stop the active rust. Do not sharpen it if you want to retain value. The worst things you can do are deep clean or sharpen if you want to retain value but ultimately it is your sword. Original scabbards for these are rare as hens teeth but they can be found with some patience. Some of them would have had some practical use but classic ship to ship boarding actions were not something one would call common in the civil war. I think its nice I would be proud to have it.

Hi Jack, Thanks for the reply. Would Rem-oil on a rag be a good cleaning process? Any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[Richard E. Schenk]

I agree with bobinwmass this is a reproduction. In addition to the "tells" he pointed out, the fuller is noticeably narrower than the original. Most likely a product of the notorious House of Swords.

 

[bayonet]

Interesting, first I heard of serial #s on ACW era swords. Guess you learn something everyday!

 

[Richard E. Schenk]

In August 1861, the Navy requested Ames stamp serial numbers on the guard and scabbard of each future cutlass produced, using "M" to designate 1000, e.g. cutlass 12,345 would be marked "12M/345". Since 600 cutlasses had already been delivered, Ames started such numbering at601; those cutlasses already delivered were to be retro-marked by the Navy. Serial numbers do not always appear on the scabbards, but when they do they are stamped on the obverse of the scabbard just above the frog knob using the same format as on the guard. In addition to the Navy, the Revenue Cutter Service (RCS), the predecessor to the Coast Guard, purchased over one thousand M1861 cutlasses from Ames to outfit its cutters, including a major purchase of 600 in 1864. These RCS cutlasses were identical to the Navy swords but, since they were procured by RCS and not Navy contracts, Ames was not required to serial number them. It is believed that most, if not all, Civil War vintage M1861 cutlasses found with no serial number stamped on the quillon are RCS cutlasses

 

[Frank1959]

In August 1861, the Navy requested Ames stamp serial numbers on the guard and scabbard of each future cutlass produced, using "M" to designate 1000, e.g. cutlass 12,345 would be marked "12M/345". Since 600 cutlasses had already been delivered, Ames started such numbering at601; those cutlasses already delivered were to be retro-marked by the Navy. Serial numbers do not always appear on the scabbards, but when they do they are stamped on the obverse of the scabbard just above the frog knob using the same format as on the guard. In addition to the Navy, the Revenue Cutter Service (RCS), the predecessor to the Coast Guard, purchased over one thousand M1861 cutlasses from Ames to outfit its cutters, including a major purchase of 600 in 1864. These RCS cutlasses were identical to the Navy swords but, since they were procured by RCS and not Navy contracts, Ames was not required to serial number them. It is believed that most, if not all, Civil War vintage M1861 cutlasses found with no serial number stamped on the quillon are RCS cutlasses

Thats very good info!