Revolving Rifles

[Bentonville]

18.3k / 1,000,000 = a tip of the iceberg answer​

Between 1855 and 1864 Colt produced a total of 18,300 revolving long arms, of which only 1,100 were shotguns, with the balance being rifled arms. The rifled arms were available in a wide variety of calibers from . 36 through . 64 and were produced as Sporting Rifles, Carbines, and Military Rifles.
Source

Colt Revolving Military Rifle - Very Scarce .44 Variant

Colt Revolving Military Rifle Very Scarce 44 Variant

collegehillarsenal.com

Over 1,000,000 Model 1861 rifled muskets were produced, with the Springfield Armory increasing its production during the war by contracting out to twenty other firms in the Union. The number of Model 1861 rifled muskets produced by the Springfield Armory was 265,129 between January 1, 1861 and December 31, 1863.

Springfield Model 1861 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Revolving shotguns... the proto street sweeper.

 

[Nathan Stuart]

In his book Watkins wrote that the captain of his company had a revolving rifle and was a good shot too.

Early in Watkin's memoir (in the section titled, 'Warm Springs, Virginia'), he mentions the following event that occurred during Aug., '61:
..."Captain Field came running up with his seven-shooting rifle, and the first time he killed a Yankee. They broke and run. Captain Field did all the firing, but every time he pulled down he brought a Yankee. I have forgotten the number that he did kill, but if I am not mistaken it was either twenty or twenty-one,"...

From Watkin's description here, it sounds like Capt. Field was firing a seven-shot .52 cal. Spencer repeating rifle, with lever action. (This Northern manufactured repeating rifle was first made in 1860).

At this very early stage of the war, it seems Capt. Field might have privately acquired this weapon shortly before the commencement of hostilities.

 

[Bentonville]

An erroneous question on my part I'm thinking. Should have read the chapter!

 

[Nathan Stuart]

An erroneous question on my part I'm thinking. Should have read the chapter!

Given the timing, agree with the likelihood of it being a privately acquired weapon in this reported episode.

If one is to believe Watkin's claim, that's still an awfully large number of recorded 'kills' by the one rifleman in such a short duration. Am inclined to think his estimates of twenty or twenty one kills by Capt. Field are questionable. Exaggeration or embellishment perhaps?

 

[Lincoln56]

Guess my question is, what is a field officer doing with a long arm in his possession during battle?

Understanding from memoir references officers on occasion picked up dropped weapons and fired a couple shots but this sounds as though it was a regular occurrence and not an unusual practice for this particular captain.

Were officers carrying and using long arms in battle on a regular basis fairly common or is this unusual? I'm thinking unusual.

 

[6thMichCav]

I wonder how much the side blast and gas leakage compared to other period firearms? I have zero black powder experience, but I wouldn't put my face anywhere near a modern revolver due to the blast from the cylinder gap, and sometimes lead shaving that goes on (tiny particles of lead shaved as the bullet goes into the barrel and hurled sideways at near-bullet velocity).

 

[Joe Whitworth]

I wonder how much the side blast and gas leakage compared to other period firearms? I have zero black powder experience, but I wouldn't put my face anywhere near a modern revolver due to the blast from the cylinder gap, and sometimes lead shaving that goes on (tiny particles of lead shaved as the bullet goes into the barrel and hurled sideways at near-bullet velocity).

Think about your supporting hand in the event of a chainfire. I've had one or two like this....

 

[6thMichCav]

Think about your supporting hand in the event of a chainfire. I've had one or two like this....

One going off is bad enough sometimes. Six at once, less than a foot from your face and scorching your wrist or forearm? No, thank you!

 

[JackADriscoll]

Is there any record of the Confederacy trying to make revolving rifles?

 

[Old Soldier]

I wonder how much the side blast and gas leakage compared to other period firearms? I have zero black powder experience, but I wouldn't put my face anywhere near a modern revolver due to the blast from the cylinder gap, and sometimes lead shaving that goes on (tiny particles of lead shaved as the bullet goes into the barrel and hurled sideways at near-bullet velocity).

Apparently, they were just as bad, if not worse, than the pistol. The reason for this was that they were often given a larger - longer and thicker - cylinder for a higher BP charge which increased the likelyhood of gas escape. There was little or no provision for a forward hand grip on the rifles either and, given the relatively low power of the shot, most were issued as cavalry carbines - for 'single-hand' shooting.

Side note: At this time military thoughts were that revolvers of any type were considered useful only for those who had no need of a long arm and only one hand for a gun, the other hand holding a sword or reins. They were for short range personal defence. Their advantage was immediate, rapid weight of fire at that short distance. (Then came reloading!)

 

[Pollaco]

Is there any documentation or records of a soldier shooting his fingers off due to a chain fire? That seems to be the notoriety or bad publicity of the rifles "that it could happen". Did it?

 

[DixieRifles]

The Colts sent to Rosecrans' units were issued as follows: 294 to the 3rd Michigan Cavalry, 30 to the 2nd Iowa; and 500 to 7th Kansas.

These cavalry units operated out of Memphis in late 1863 & 1864. When did the 7th Kansas Cav get theirs?? Someone posted once that the 2d Iowa Cav had mixed weapons among the companies. A few companies had the Colt revolving rifles at the 2d Battle of Collierville as it is recorded in their history.
Also, about 2 years ago someone purchased a commercial property near the town square and he found a Colt bullet.

 

[johan_steele]

Is there any documentation or records of a soldier shooting his fingers off due to a chain fire? That seems to be the notoriety or bad publicity of the rifles "that it could happen". Did it?

I've never found a name or verifiable incident.

 

[Joe Whitworth]

Apparently, they were just as bad, if not worse, than the pistol. The reason for this was that they were often given a larger - longer and thicker - cylinder for a higher BP charge which increased the likelyhood of gas escape. There was little or no provision for a forward hand grip on the rifles either and, given the relatively low power of the shot, most were issued as cavalry carbines - for 'single-hand' shooting.

Side note: At this time military thoughts were that revolvers of any type were considered useful only for those who had no need of a long arm and only one hand for a gun, the other hand holding a sword or reins. They were for short range personal defence. Their advantage was immediate, rapid weight of fire at that short distance. (Then came reloading!)

Bull used this 1855 in "El Dorado". Note the forearm.


You can add this full stocked beauty to your collection for a mere $7,995.00.

https://www.collectorsfirearms.com/products/197207-martially-marked-colt-1855-military-rifle-ac1031.html

 

[limberbox]

These cavalry units operated out of Memphis in late 1863 & 1864. When did the 7th Kansas Cav get theirs?? Someone posted once that the 2d Iowa Cav had mixed weapons among the companies. A few companies had the Colt revolving rifles at the 2d Battle of Collierville as it is recorded in their history.
Also, about 2 years ago someone purchased a commercial property near the town square and he found a Colt bullet.

Yes, the Second Iowa Cavalry concentrated their Colt's revolving rifles (which they appear to have received during the 3rd Quarter of 1862, a few months after the Farmington and Burnsville, Mississippi fights) in two rifle battalions, leaving the third battalion (armed with Sharps carbines and sabers) to do more of the mounted fighting. Sgt. Lyman B. Pierce described this in the preface to his 1865 History of the Second Iowa Cavalry:

"Justice requires me to add here, that during the first term of service, the Third Battalion -- Companies E, K, L and M -- were armed with sabres and carbines, and hence did most of the charging, while the First and Second battalions being armed with Colt's revolving rifles , figured less in dashing exploits, but did more hard fighting. This remark will account for the saber-men being oftener spoken of in the following history in connection with fiery dashes, than the rifle companies, while these receive and repulse more of the charges of the enemy than do the sabre companies." (preface).

Pierce describes the Nov. 3, 1863 Collierville fight over several pages in chapter IX.

 

[Pollaco]

View attachment 508068
Bull used this 1855 in "El Dorado". Note the forearm.


You can add this full stocked beauty to your collection for a mere $7,995.00.

https://www.collectorsfirearms.com/products/197207-martially-marked-colt-1855-military-rifle-ac1031.html

Didn't Bull say he'd play "Marching Through Georgia" with that rifle by striking the church bells?

 

[DixieRifles]

Pierce describes the Nov. 3, 1863 Collierville fight over several pages in chapter IX.

I think that is the history I downloaded. You will see they captured Colonel J. Z. George, commander of 5th Mississippi Cavalry. Col. George was one of the famous sons of Mississippi and his statue sits in the US Capitol's Statuary Hall.

 

[DixieRifles]

Think about your supporting hand in the event of a chainfire. I've had one or two like this....

I never have and Ive owned a replica Colt .36 and the .45 Ruger Old Army— using conical & round balls that fit snugly.

 

[Joe Whitworth]

Didn't Bull say he'd play "Marching Through Georgia" with that rifle by striking the church bells?

Yup.

 

[Old Soldier]

Pistols at this time were not used with a 'supporting hand'. This stemmed from the days of the flintlock pistol and the flash from the pan. Military and naval flintlock pistols were often used with the lock towards the sky, mainly to ensure the intitiation of the charge. There was no sight on the barrel. For military use, often the 'other' hand was also doing or holding something else. There was also duel 'etiquette' which dictated that pistols be held in just one hand.
This tradition continued over the change to percusson and the gradual introduction of revolvers. Despite the provision of sights, it seems they were not often used and pistols remained a close-quarter weapon - "point it in the right direction". It is perhaps to maintain this tradition that the 'cylinder gap' theory was started. Without a doubt, there were some pistols that splattered hot gas and even lead fragments, given the state of poorly maintained or over-used pistols of the period, but I suspect that this did not apply to the better makes.