Winchester, VA

Viper21

Brigadier General
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Location
Rockbridge County, Virginia
Who would dare to desiccate this or any other Confederate cemeteries or the monuments on those grounds? They may remove the statutes but dare not disturb this or any other Confederate soldiers final resting place. Inquiry; Who were the Ashby brothers and as to the Patton brothers and George Patton, any relation to OL Blood and Guts George Patton of WWII ?
If not for Ashby's death in June 1862 (Harrisonburg, VA), he may very well have become as famous as Nathan Bedford Forrest. Ashby was, "The Knight of the Valley". Well liked by citizens, & loved by his men. Fearless, & unafraid to fight. His command was too disorganized, or undisciplined for Stonewall Jackson's liking. Jackson tried to have him removed from command. Ashby hinted at challenging Jackson to a duel. Not wanting to lose Ashby's men, Jackson backed off, though he opposed his promotion to General.

He died shortly after being promoted to General. His horse was shot out from under him, & continuing on foot, he was shot in the chest. There's a monument at the place he fell, in Harrisonburg.

Here's a little bit on Patton's Grandfather: https://www.shenandoahatwar.org/history/george-s-patton/
 

Stone in the wall

2nd Lieutenant
Joined
Sep 19, 2017
Location
Blue Ridge Mountains, Jefferson County WV
Who would dare to desiccate this or any other Confederate cemeteries or the monuments on those grounds? They may remove the statutes but dare not disturb this or any other Confederate soldiers final resting place. Inquiry; Who were the Ashby brothers and as to the Patton brothers and George Patton, any relation to OL Blood and Guts George Patton of WWII ? Fauquier County Captain Richard Ashby was Turner's younger brother. He was killed early in the war, June 1861. When Turner examined Richards body he was convinced he had been bayoneted to death while trying to surrender. This would become bad news for any Yankee who would later become engaged with Turner and his 7th Va Cavalry
Capt. Richard Ashby was Turner's younger brother. He was struck down early in the war, June 1861. When Turner examined Richard's body he was convinced his younger brother had been bayoneted while trying to surrender. This would become bad news for any Yankee's he and his 7th Va Cavalry would face in the future.
Father; Col Turner Ashby 1789-1837
Grandfather; Capt. John Ashby 1740-1815
 

Joshism

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Joined
Apr 30, 2012
Location
Jupiter, FL
His command was too disorganized, or undisciplined for Stonewall Jackson's liking. Jackson tried to have him removed from command.

IIRC, Peter Cozzens in Shenandoah 1862 agreed with Stonewall that Ashby's command was bloated and under-trained mess. His personal popularity attracted a bunch of independent companies joining his command, resulting it something like 20 companies in what was supposed to be a regiment. While Ashby probably had the talent to warrant a brigadier's star (especially at that point in the war), the main hope was he would finally properly organize his men into multiple regiments and a real brigade structure that could be much less unwieldy.
 

Viper21

Brigadier General
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Location
Rockbridge County, Virginia
IIRC, Peter Cozzens in Shenandoah 1862 agreed with Stonewall that Ashby's command was bloated and under-trained mess. His personal popularity attracted a bunch of independent companies joining his command, resulting it something like 20 companies in what was supposed to be a regiment. While Ashby probably had the talent to warrant a brigadier's star (especially at that point in the war), the main hope was he would finally properly organize his men into multiple regiments and a real brigade structure that could be much less unwieldy.
My own opinion is, Ashby had swagger, with some arrogance thrown in. He wasn't Mr. ByTheBook, & his troops liked that. He got away with some unorthodox practices because his command was effective, & large. It helps when you are actually sweating & bleeding with your men too. Jackson was a procedure guy. Makes sense they would clash some.

I think the clash between them was similar to clashes in other fields we see today. Procedure (book) vs. Practical Application (field). I'm sure many of us have experienced folks who seem to "get away with murder" at work, while others are nit picked for the tiniest of infractions. Some owners/upper management types, are more focused on results than procedural processes. While others can't see past what is written in their operations manual.

The military is still this way today. Some officers & NCO's are extremely focused on the by the book, letter of the regulation. Others are more focused on results. Which do you think are more favored by their men..? (painting with a broad brush of course). Who do you think comes across as legitimately caring for the men in their service..? There's always been a huge difference between respecting the rank, & respecting the man.
 

Viper21

Brigadier General
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Location
Rockbridge County, Virginia
Capt. Richard Ashby was Turner's younger brother. He was struck down early in the war, June 1861. When Turner examined Richard's body he was convinced his younger brother had been bayoneted while trying to surrender. This would become bad news for any Yankee's he and his 7th Va Cavalry would face in the future.
Father; Col Turner Ashby 1789-1837
Grandfather; Capt. John Ashby 1740-1815
Great tid bit ...! I'm sure that would affect ones attitude towards Yankees.

Ashby's Grandfather fought in the American Revolution, & his Father fought in the war of 1812, if my memory serves me correctly.
 

Stone in the wall

2nd Lieutenant
Joined
Sep 19, 2017
Location
Blue Ridge Mountains, Jefferson County WV
Ashby was a good choice and he knew the valley. How many other men ever made Stonewall back down. Early in the war (July 1861) Turner was organized enough to fool Patterson into believing Johnson's whole army was in his front.Turner may well have been the best recruiter the Confederacy ever had. Every young man in the Valley wanted to ride along with Turner Ashby and his 7th Cavalry, and they come in flocks to join up. Disorganization was not all his fault, as his ranks swelled with NEW and UNTRAINED troopers. Valley people are a rowdy bunch. Being a semi-independent regiment there were really no limits on the size.
 

James N.

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... I believe one could easily spend a couple days in Winchester, & still not see everything worth seeing. We spent an afternoon, & didn't even come close to seeing it all. Was a great day, & will most likely be followed up with another trip. Highly recommend it to anyone even remotely considering the destination.
Especially if you devote the entire day HERE as we did on our visit (actually a whole afternoon and then the following morning):

https://civilwartalk.com/threads/th...d-winchester-sept-19-1864.127249/post-1389330
 

Trooper "D"

Private
Joined
May 20, 2018
Had a little taste of Winchester yesterday on two wheels. A couple buddies & I, rode up there & took in a few sites. We certainly didn't see it all, & will definitely be back. I left my house at 9:00 am, & got back home at 9:00 pm.

After lunch (50/50 Tap House), we walked across the street to George Washington's Office:

View attachment 407609

The $5 spent to enter the office was money well spent. I was blown away how much of the original structure was intact, including the flooring that we walked on. Was pretty amazing. I could kick myself for not taking more pictures of the place but, I was just captivated by it, & focused on seeing, it all.

After walking some of George Washington's previous steps, we rolled down to Stonewall Jackson's HQ (The Moore House).
View attachment 407610

While in the home, I actually had the thought to take some pics, & was quickly told, photography wasn't allowed. I'll say this, they have some amazing artifacts in this home. They have some original flags, some furniture of Jackson's, some uniforms, various weapons, etc. I was pretty impressed with their displays. It was way more than I was expecting.

View attachment 407624

Honestly, it was so cool that, it screwed our day up, as we spent too much time there...lol. We didn't have time to hit the museum, although we did make a stop at the Cemetery (Hebron).

View attachment 407611

I did take a few pics here. Although, I believe I could've spent an entire day, just in the Confederate section of this cemetery.

View attachment 407612

View attachment 407613

There's a few here y'all might've heard of....

View attachment 407614

View attachment 407615

Right next to the Ashby brothers, is another set of brothers....

View attachment 407616

View attachment 407617

Every state had a monument in this cemetery. I didn't have time to approach/photograph them all..... maybe next time.
Here's Virginia's:

View attachment 407618

View attachment 407619

Monument to the Unknown:

View attachment 407620

View attachment 407621


Last photo is of a marker on a number of buildings in downtown Winchester:

View attachment 407622

I believe one could easily spend a couple days in Winchester, & still not see everything worth seeing. We spent an afternoon, & didn't even come close to seeing it all. Was a great day, & will most likely be followed up with another trip. Highly recommend it to anyone even remotely considering the destination.
Nice photos. Thanks.
 

Trooper "D"

Private
Joined
May 20, 2018
Who would dare to desiccate this or any other Confederate cemeteries or the monuments on those grounds? They may remove the statutes but dare not disturb this or any other Confederate soldiers final resting place. Inquiry; Who were the Ashby brothers and as to the Patton brothers and George Patton, any relation to OL Blood and Guts George Patton of WWII ?
I think you desecrate. Dessicate is what instant potatoes are.
 

Trooper "D"

Private
Joined
May 20, 2018
Had a little taste of Winchester yesterday on two wheels. A couple buddies & I, rode up there & took in a few sites. We certainly didn't see it all, & will definitely be back. I left my house at 9:00 am, & got back home at 9:00 pm.

After lunch (50/50 Tap House), we walked across the street to George Washington's Office:

View attachment 407609

The $5 spent to enter the office was money well spent. I was blown away how much of the original structure was intact, including the flooring that we walked on. Was pretty amazing. I could kick myself for not taking more pictures of the place but, I was just captivated by it, & focused on seeing, it all.

After walking some of George Washington's previous steps, we rolled down to Stonewall Jackson's HQ (The Moore House).
View attachment 407610

While in the home, I actually had the thought to take some pics, & was quickly told, photography wasn't allowed. I'll say this, they have some amazing artifacts in this home. They have some original flags, some furniture of Jackson's, some uniforms, various weapons, etc. I was pretty impressed with their displays. It was way more than I was expecting.

View attachment 407624

Honestly, it was so cool that, it screwed our day up, as we spent too much time there...lol. We didn't have time to hit the museum, although we did make a stop at the Cemetery (Hebron).

View attachment 407611

I did take a few pics here. Although, I believe I could've spent an entire day, just in the Confederate section of this cemetery.

View attachment 407612

View attachment 407613

There's a few here y'all might've heard of....

View attachment 407614

View attachment 407615

Right next to the Ashby brothers, is another set of brothers....

View attachment 407616

View attachment 407617

Every state had a monument in this cemetery. I didn't have time to approach/photograph them all..... maybe next time.
Here's Virginia's:

View attachment 407618

View attachment 407619

Monument to the Unknown:

View attachment 407620

View attachment 407621


Last photo is of a marker on a number of buildings in downtown Winchester:

View attachment 407622

I believe one could easily spend a couple days in Winchester, & still not see everything worth seeing. We spent an afternoon, & didn't even come close to seeing it all. Was a great day, & will most likely be followed up with another trip. Highly recommend it to anyone even remotely considering the destination.
Oh, and I suggest feeding those horses you folks rode. They are mightily thin.
 

NH Civil War Gal

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Hey, @Viper21 I finally got to visit the Jackson House! On a last minute whim, my niece and I had time and we went to Winchester and got to see the George Washington office that was closed the last time I was there AND got to the Jackson House 20 minutes before it closed. It was just the two of us and the docent gave us a WONDERFUL tour. Because they were almost closing, he was only going to give us a downstairs tour but somehow, my “polar redneck Yankee charm” worked and without even asking we both charmed him into the upstairs tour too! He even said, “both you ladies talked me into it :giggle: “. What a TREASURE house!

I did ask him why we couldn’t take pictures and he told me that Time-Life owns the copyright on photos for three objects in the house so if anyone takes pictures and the wrong ones get put up online, they get sued.

However, in about six months, they are putting out a book, it will be $10.00 or less, with pictures of their treasures. He gave me his card and told me to call or email him in six months and I can order it.

I especially liked the kitchen story, (after Jackson’s time) where the husband, being married 3.5 hours, orders the new bride to cook over an open fire (and this is the late 1860s now) and she firmly tells him “I want a stove.” He tries to order her, and she firmly tells him that if he wants a honeymoon night, he will buy her a STOVE. He makes her a WHOLE NEW KITCHEN with a STOVE.
 

Trooper "D"

Private
Joined
May 20, 2018
Hey, @Viper21 I finally got to visit the Jackson House! On a last minute whim, my niece and I had time and we went to Winchester and got to see the George Washington office that was closed the last time I was there AND got to the Jackson House 20 minutes before it closed. It was just the two of us and the docent gave us a WONDERFUL tour. Because they were almost closing, he was only going to give us a downstairs tour but somehow, my “polar redneck Yankee charm” worked and without even asking we both charmed him into the upstairs tour too! He even said, “both you ladies talked me into it :giggle: “. What a TREASURE house!

I did ask him why we couldn’t take pictures and he told me that Time-Life owns the copyright on photos for three objects in the house so if anyone takes pictures and the wrong ones get put up online, they get sued.

However, in about six months, they are putting out a book, it will be $10.00 or less, with pictures of their treasures. He gave me his card and told me to call or email him in six months and I can order it.

I especially liked the kitchen story, (after Jackson’s time) where the husband, being married 3.5 hours, orders the new bride to cook over an open fire (and this is the late 1860s now) and she firmly tells him “I want a stove.” He tries to order her, and she firmly tells him that if he wants a honeymoon night, he will buy her a STOVE. He makes her a WHOLE NEW KITCHEN with a STOVE.
So he was a WISE man.
 

Viper21

Brigadier General
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Joined
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Location
Rockbridge County, Virginia
Hey, @Viper21 I finally got to visit the Jackson House! On a last minute whim, my niece and I had time and we went to Winchester and got to see the George Washington office that was closed the last time I was there AND got to the Jackson House 20 minutes before it closed. It was just the two of us and the docent gave us a WONDERFUL tour. Because they were almost closing, he was only going to give us a downstairs tour but somehow, my “polar redneck Yankee charm” worked and without even asking we both charmed him into the upstairs tour too! He even said, “both you ladies talked me into it :giggle: “. What a TREASURE house!

I did ask him why we couldn’t take pictures and he told me that Time-Life owns the copyright on photos for three objects in the house so if anyone takes pictures and the wrong ones get put up online, they get sued.

However, in about six months, they are putting out a book, it will be $10.00 or less, with pictures of their treasures. He gave me his card and told me to call or email him in six months and I can order it.

I especially liked the kitchen story, (after Jackson’s time) where the husband, being married 3.5 hours, orders the new bride to cook over an open fire (and this is the late 1860s now) and she firmly tells him “I want a stove.” He tries to order her, and she firmly tells him that if he wants a honeymoon night, he will buy her a STOVE. He makes her a WHOLE NEW KITCHEN with a STOVE.
Awesome..! I'm glad that you not only got to see it, but liked it as well. I know I thoroughly enjoyed my trip there, & will definitely go back again. That's a hike from NH..!

So, did you like the wallpaper..?
 

NH Civil War Gal

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I will ask my physicist husband tonight, when I get back to NH about the optics. I think it was amazing and amazingly beautiful.

I really loved seeing the little bible Jackson carried. I’m amazed it survived as well as it did with the purple velvet cover.

His uncle was a piece of work though.
 

Viper21

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Rockbridge County, Virginia
Loved it but can’t figure out the trick of why it changes from gold to silver. Do you know how the optical illusion works?
I think it's the thickness, or "layers" of the colored material. Which makes it appear different from different angles. I believe the word is, "iridescent". I've seen similar color reflections in paint jobs, on various cars, trucks, motorcycles.
 

NH Civil War Gal

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@Viper did you get the talk about the small exercise chair the old lady in Winchester developed and had made? For those that don’t know, in the Jackson House is a small chair with a rounded back and arms. There is a lever on each side that you can use kind of like a genteel rowing machine.

An older lady in town invented it for herself, because she had severe lower back trouble and needed to develop her muscles in her back. She used it for 45 minutes a day, three times a day. The key to this story though was she was a tobacco chewer.

She looked like a sweet, little old lady and would be on the porch rowing, smiling and chewing. She certainly was a curiosity. Remember, Winchester changed hands around 72 times during the war. If you chew, you have to spit. She would smile at the Union soldiers and they would come closer and closer and suddenly! She would nail them with her spitting! Now, I don’t approve in the least of spitting OR chamber pots being emptied on anyone’s heads and as a lady she knew better.

BUT…. what a hoot and I have to give her A+++ for ingenuity!

Edited: I asked what happened and she was eventually removed out of town - tobacco and all!
 
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