Where to Find This Information Online (Repeat)

Joined
Jun 7, 2021
Can anyone direct me to an online resource that would confirm the information below? I want to read the full agreement between the Federal and Confederate governments regarding the treatment of POWs as it existed in Oct of 1864. I'm not even sure what that document would be called - I've been looking online all morning and can't find anything. Thanks for any help!

Testimony by Col. George C. Gibbs, CSA at the trial of Henry Wirz:
"The commissary furnished the prison with supplies of all descriptions. The prisoners did not draw clothing at all; there was an agreement between both governments that each should clothe its own men."
 
Any agreement would appear in Series II of the Official Records, but that doesn't narrow things down much.

I would question whether there was such an agreement based on the following. On 1864-08-11, W. H. Winder proposed:

I would suggest that the Federal Government supply all the Confederate prisoners with all necessary supplies of clothing, &c., taking from each prisoner a receipt for whatever supplies may thus be furnished, on which receipt his name, regiment, and company shall be stated; that some Confederate officer shall attend to the delivery and receipting and certify to their correctness; that these accounts thus made out, whenever presented to the Confederate Government, shall forthwith be paid by it in cotton at a specified price - this would be pay equivalent to gold. The Federal Government to be allowed to send supplies to the Federal prisoners, to be distributed by a Federal officer, who can take receipts from the soldiers, to be charged against their pay.​

Hitchcock wrote (next page):

Nothing can be done of this kind without the consent of the rebel authorities, and all experience shows that no such consent can be obtained. Those authorities have systematically refused to relieve or suffer us to relieve our soldiers held as prisoners in the South. There is but one way by which relief can reach them, and that is through the success of the Federal armies.​

Later, Hitchcock would suggest that Winder's proposal be considered, even though Hitchcock remained of the opinion that the Confederates wouldn't accept it, writing in part:

I thought Mr. Winder was mistaken in supposing that the rebel authorities would consent to assume the expenses attendant upon the support of their troops in our hands when they know that their soldiers in our hands receive the treatment due to prisoners of war in civilized nations, to wit, clothing, food, and shelter, with both medicines and medical attendance whenever required, free of all charge to the rebel authorities. I further thought he was mistaken in supposing that the same authorities would consent to the relief of prisoners of war in their hands when we have so many evidences that it is a part of the policy of the South to act upon the sympathies of the North by distressing Northern men in their hands, though this is done in open violation of the laws of war and of humanity. One object of the rebel authorities is, through Popular opinion in the North, to induce the Government to send a whole army of rebels to General Lee for immediate service, when they know that within a few weeks past they were indebted to us, as shown by careful statements made by the Commissary-General of Prisoners, over 34,000 men, who ought now to be delivered to us, instead of being retained, as they are, prisoners in the South.​

So Hitchcock thinks that the side holding a prisoner of war is responsible for clothing the prisoner. He also thinks that the Confederacy does not expect, and would not allow, the Federal Government to provide clothing to prisoners of war held by the Confederacy. That said, negotiations surrounding prisoners of war were very contentious, so the Confederates wouldn't necessarily share Hitchcock's view of what had been agreed to.
 
On Dec. 11, 1863, the Confederate Government decided that the Federal Government could no longer send clothing to prisoners of war held by the Confederates. The letter is brief and to the point:

SIR: As the assent of the Confederate Government to the transmission by your authority and people of food and clothing to the prisoners at Richmond and elsewhere has been the subject of so much misconstructions and misrepresentation, and has been made the occasion of so much vilification and abuse, I am directed to inform you that no more will be allowed to be delivered at City Point. The clothing and provision already received will be devoted to the use of your prisoners. When they supply is exhausted they will receive the same rations as our soldiers in the field.​

Ould subsequently offers the following proposal which would have allowed the Federal Government to provide clothing, but the Federal Government rejected it:

SIR: In view of the present difficulties attending the exchange and release of prisoners I propose that all such on each side shall be attended by a proper number of their own surgeons, who, under rules to be established, shall be permitted to take charge of their health and comfort. I also propose that these surgeons shall act as commissaries, with power to receive and distribute such contributions of money, food, and clothing and medicines as may be forwarded for the relief of the prisoners. I further propose that these surgeons shall be selected by their own Government, and that they shall have full liberty at any and all times through the agents of exchange to make reports not only of their own acts, but of any matters relating to the welfare of the prisoners.​

There is further discussion on pages 956-958, 973-974, and 983-985, but my notes don't reference anything that would reverse the Dec. 11, 1863 policy. So the two sides may not have agreed on much, but they agreed that the Federal Government was not expected to provide clothing to prisoners of war held by the Confederates. As you say, it appears Col. Gibbs was mistaken.
 
The more I think about the proposals made by the two sides, the more cumbersome and impractical they seem. Given the unmet needs of the Confederate troops in the last part of the war, it seems unlikely that any supplies for Union soldiers could be shipped through their lines and reach the Federal POWs intact. These Rebel troops would be hard pressed not to help themselves to food and clothing for their own benefit.

Agreeing to the proposals of Ould and Winder would have the effect of getting the North to provide much needed supplies to their enemy.
 
The answer to the O.P.s original question lies in the Southern Historical Society Papers, Vol. 10. Pages 321 - 326.

There was an agreement reached by Lee and Grant in October 1864 after negotiations by government exchange agents that in effect placed the responsiblility for food, clothing, etc. on the prisoner's government. This agreement continued to the end of the war.

Read all about it here:

 
The answer to the O.P.s original question lies in the Southern Historical Society Papers, Vol. 10. Pages 321 - 326.

There was an agreement reached by Lee and Grant in October 1864 after negotiations by government exchange agents that in effect placed the responsiblility for food, clothing, etc. on the prisoner's government. This agreement continued to the end of the war.

Read all about it here:

@Kenneth Almquist - your comments would be most appreciated on this thread!

The legal implications are beyond my scope, so any help in unraveling this mystery would be great. It is my understanding that individual agreements between commanders, I believe called a cartel, could be put in place, but I'm not clear on whether that required approval by high government officials.

I have noticed that there is a considerable disagreement on this subject in what can be found online. Defenders of the Lost Cause in earlier publications seem to put all the blame on the Yankees and the Yankees, of course, put all the blame on the Rebels.
 
The answer to the O.P.s original question lies in the Southern Historical Society Papers, Vol. 10. Pages 321 - 326.

There was an agreement reached by Lee and Grant in October 1864 after negotiations by government exchange agents that in effect placed the responsiblility for food, clothing, etc. on the prisoner's government. This agreement continued to the end of the war.

Read all about it here:

The problem with this is that it only shows the Southern letters proposing the North start sending supplies again. It is written as a defense that the South was not insensitive to the suffering of Northern prisoners. But without the letters showing the replies of the Federal authorities agreeing to the proposals it doesn't prove anything other than the fact the proposals were made.

I'm not trying to be difficult, but I'm looking for proof of an agreement to back up Col. Gibbs belief.
 
The problem with this is that it only shows the Southern letters proposing the North start sending supplies again. It is written as a defense that the South was not insensitive to the suffering of Northern prisoners. But without the letters showing the replies of the Federal authorities agreeing to the proposals it doesn't prove anything other than the fact the proposals were made.

I'm not trying to be difficult, but I'm looking for proof of an agreement to back up Col. Gibbs belief.
I don't agree. Read carefully Lee's Oct. 19th letter to Grant below (bold added). Lee acknowledges Grant's letter of October 18th , endorsed by Stanton in which the Union government in Lee's mind at least, agrees to the Judge Ould proposition regarding relief of prisoners. The Ould proposition may be found in the pages I cited in my post #6.

HEADQUARTERS ARMY OF NORTHERN VA. , 19th October, 1864.
Lieutenant- General U. S. Grant, Commanding Armies of the United States :

General, —I have received your letter of the 18th instant accompanying letters from Judge Ould , Commissioner of Exchange of prisoners on the part of the Confederate States, and the Honorable E. M. Stanton, Secretary of War, and Lieutenant- Colonel Mulford, Assiant Commissioner of Exchange of United States. I understand your letter to be an acceptance of the general proposition submitted by Judge Ould for the relief of the prisoners held by both parties, and shall transmit it to him that arrangements may be made for carrying it into effect. The necessary details will be submitted to you through Colonel Mulford for agreement. In order to simplify the matter and to remove, so far as possible, causes of complaint, I suggest that the articles sent by either party should be confined to those necessary for the comfort and health of the prisoners, and that the officer selected from among them to receive and distribute the articles, should be given only such a parole while so engaged, as to afford him the necessary facilities to attend properly to the matter. I have the honor to be, Very respectfully your obedient servant, (Signed) R. E. LEE, General.


The Southern Historical Society Papers immediately follow the letter above with the statement:

From this date, after an interruption of nearly eight months, deliveries of food and clothing to prisoners on both sides were made, continuing until nearly the close of the war.
 
I don't agree. Read carefully Lee's Oct. 19th letter to Grant below (bold added). Lee acknowledges Grant's letter of October 18th , endorsed by Stanton in which the Union government in Lee's mind at least, agrees to the Judge Ould proposition regarding relief of prisoners. The Ould proposition may be found in the pages I cited in my post #6.

HEADQUARTERS ARMY OF NORTHERN VA. , 19th October, 1864.
Lieutenant- General U. S. Grant, Commanding Armies of the United States :

General, —I have received your letter of the 18th instant accompanying letters from Judge Ould , Commissioner of Exchange of prisoners on the part of the Confederate States, and the Honorable E. M. Stanton, Secretary of War, and Lieutenant- Colonel Mulford, Assiant Commissioner of Exchange of United States. I understand your letter to be an acceptance of the general proposition submitted by Judge Ould for the relief of the prisoners held by both parties, and shall transmit it to him that arrangements may be made for carrying it into effect. The necessary details will be submitted to you through Colonel Mulford for agreement. In order to simplify the matter and to remove, so far as possible, causes of complaint, I suggest that the articles sent by either party should be confined to those necessary for the comfort and health of the prisoners, and that the officer selected from among them to receive and distribute the articles, should be given only such a parole while so engaged, as to afford him the necessary facilities to attend properly to the matter. I have the honor to be, Very respectfully your obedient servant, (Signed) R. E. LEE, General.


The Southern Historical Society Papers immediately follow the letter above with the statement:

From this date, after an interruption of nearly eight months, deliveries of food and clothing to prisoners on both sides were made, continuing until nearly the close of the war.
That is the intriguing part! There was a back and forth on the terms, as I understand it. As Kenneth says in first post "That said, negotiations surrounding prisoners of war were very contentious, so the Confederates wouldn't necessarily share Hitchcock's view of what had been agreed to." Col. Gibbs was very sincere in his testimony, I believe, and I'm trying to find the disconnect.

I've been looking for the letter Lee referred to of the 18th, and letters subsequent to that from Grant. Numerous websites mention the breakdown of the October agreement because of the issue of the treatment of Black soldiers and that seems to have happened after both sides thought they had an agreement. So maybe communications were such that not everyone got the memo that the deal was off?

If I can find the entire paper trail I think it will make it clear. Your sleuthing is much more productive than mine and I truly appreciate the help! The sources Kenneth provided look very promising but the entries are not in chronological order so it's been a bit of a slog.
 
It does look as if both sides recognized an urgency regarding the prisoners and a more simple deal of exchange was worked out in November 1864. This agreement, however, had nothing to do with providing clothing, food, etc. It was a straightforward agreement regarding exchange. - again, that is how I understand it. I am a rank amateur at this. As an aside, the extremely polite way some of the correspondents seem to be telling each other to "go to !!!!" would be amusing, if it weren't such a sad subject.

The poignancy of this for me is the lack of clothing for the Union prisoners because the Confederate administrators, in good faith, are following orders under the belief it is the responsibility of the Federal government to clothe them.
 

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