Were Lee & Jackson really close friends ?

[Pima]

Today I listened to a lecture by Dr. Christian Keller entitled: "The Partnership that Almost Won the Civil War: Lee and Jackson". I enjoyed it immensely and I am planning to buy the book about this very interesting story. My question is... were they really close friends ? Was Lee heavily affected by Jackson's death in 1863 ? Primary sources about personal reletionship are usually not the best but do you happen to know any of those (letters written during the civil war & also after it for example) ? The author seems to think that they were very close because they both were very religious and belived in the divine Providence.

Thank you ^^

 

[JeffFromSyracuse]

Had they met before June 1862? Not saying a relationship couldn't have been forged in a year, just not sure if they crossed paths before then.

 

[jackt62]

I would not characterize the relationship between Lee and Jackson as one of "friendship," but rather as a high regard for each other's military abilities. More like respected professional colleagues.

 

[Pollaco]

It is generally accepted by myth, legend , and history that they were close friends so I'll leave it at that.I'd like to think they were. Having something in common seems to bring some people closer together and from what I gather they were both very religious.

 

[Bruce Vail]

Close friendship? No. More like a father-son relationship, with the son full of devotion and deference to the father.

Jackson was 36 years old at the outset of the war, closer in age to Lee's oldest son that to Lee himself.

 

[RedRover]

General Lee and General Jackson had a professional relation of senior and junior officer. The officers corps were something like a military "family" with the commander at the head of the table.

Background wise, General Lee was from Stratford Hall, on the Potomac, born to a family of some landholding and modest/declined wealth. Jackson was from a back-country family in Clarksburg, western Virginia. Although the terms were not widely used by the 1860s, the Virginians had been earlier divided between the so-called "Tuckahoes" (the eastern and tidewater planting folks, especially the Episcopalians) and the "Cohees," or the western mountain district people, especially the Presbyterians. In that light, Lee was a "Tuckahoe" and Jackson a "Cohee."

However, both were citizens of the State of Virginia. Both were graduates of the United States Military Academy at West Point, New York. Both served in the small regular army of the United States in peace and war, and both determined in 1861 to follow the fortunes of their State, and repel its invasion by serving as Confederate generals. Jackson said of Lee:

 

[GwilymT]

I haven't seen anything that would lead me to believe there was any sort of personal friendship between the two. As @RedRover pointed out above, they certainly respected each other but a personal friendship between the scion of the landed Virginia elite and a backwoods "Cohee" seems a little too much to ask in the short years they knew each other in light of nineteenth century southern notions of station and propriety.

Respect between commander and subordinate? Absolutely. Friendship? No way.

 

[GwilymT]

General Lee and General Jackson had a professional relation of senior and junior officer. The officers corps were something like a military "family" with the commander at the head of the table.

Background wise, General Lee was from Stratford Hall, on the Potomac, born to a family of some landholding and modest/declined wealth. Jackson was from a back-country family in Clarksburg, western Virginia. Although the terms were not widely used by the 1860s, the Virginians had been earlier divided between the so-called "Tuckahoes" (the eastern and tidewater planting folks, especially the Episcopalians) and the "Cohees," or the western mountain district people, especially the Presbyterians. In that light, Lee was a "Tuckahoe" and Jackson a "Cohee."

However, both were citizens of the State of Virginia. Both were graduates of the United States Military Academy at West Point, New York. Both served in the small regular army of the United States in peace and war, and both determined in 1861 to follow the fortunes of their State, and repel its invasion by serving as Confederate generals. Jackson said of Lee:

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Also, @RedRover what work is this you are citing? I'm wondering where they got all of these quotes.

 

[RedRover]

Also, @RedRover what work is this you are citing? I'm wondering where they got all of these quotes.

Principally Gamaliel Bradford's "Lee the American" 1912. Same quotes can be found elsewhere.

Lee the American: Google Books

 

[Jamieva]

A business relationship is how I would classify it. Personal friends would generally travel together. Lee generally traveled with Longstreet

 

[Sheltowee]

I think a lot depends on how one would define "close friends".

Open to education here- but from what little I have read on Lee, I'm not so certain he had any "close friends"?

 

[RedRover]

I haven't seen anything that would lead me to believe there was any sort of personal friendship between the two. As @RedRover pointed out above, they certainly respected each other but a personal friendship between the scion of the landed Virginia elite and a backwoods "Cohee" seems a little too much to ask in the short years they knew each other in light of nineteenth century southern notions of station and propriety.

Respect between commander and subordinate? Absolutely. Friendship? No way.

I seem to recall reading one of Lee's staff officers, either Marshall or Taylor, stating Gen. Lee was not inclined to letting down his guard, or at least keeping council with others besides his wife.

Given both Lee and Jackson were professing Christians, besides the professional relationship, a sense of Christian brotherhood was likely, but there were lots of "yoke-fellows" among the officer corps, and in the ranks.

 

[JeffFromSyracuse]

Given both Lee and Jackson were professing Christians, besides the professional relationship, a sense of Christian brotherhood was likely, but there were lots of "yoke-fellows" among the officer corps, and in the ranks.

I really don't buy the religious angle - it feels like a post-war idealization more than a functional bond.

(Edit: I do mean idealization, not idolization.)

 

[jackt62]

I really don't buy the religious angle - it feels like a post-war idealization more than a functional bond.

Agreed. While both men made no secret of their religious devotion, Lee was first and foremost a career officer who would recognize military ability regardless of a person's faith. Anyway, there are other differences between Lee and Jackson that would tend to negate any religious affiliation. Jackson was a known eccentric, whereas Lee had a more down to earth view of things.

 

[RedRover]

I really don't buy the religious angle - it feels like a post-war idealization more than a functional bond.

(Edit: I do mean idealization, not idolization.)

I would imagine both were familiar, perhaps, with Micah 7: "Trust ye not in a friend, put ye not confidence in a guide..." From the quotes above by Gen. Jackson, I gather he had implicit trust in General Lee as a military commander, irregardless of any personal attachment.

Gen. Longstreet noted in a post-war interview that he loved General Lee like a brother.

 

[GwilymT]

Principally Gamaliel Bradford's "Lee the American" 1912. Same quotes can be found elsewhere.

Lee the American: Google Books

Thanks!

 

[gjpratt]

I would not characterize the relationship between Lee and Jackson as one of "friendship," but rather as a high regard for each other's military abilities. More like respected professional colleagues.

Ditto

 

[Pima]

Thank you all for your kind answers !!! I can't help but think that I should also read: "The Great Partnership: Robert E. Lee, Stonewall Jackson, and the Fate of the Confederacy". After listening to the lecture I was very interested in his reasoning and so I looked online for reviews and interviews. The author in particular seemed to possess a very good argument. I think I will buy the book anyway. Frankly I am a bit intrigued. Of course the book may have some big flaws (slavery for example is not mentioned at all) but it may still provide an interesting read (and review here?). Sometimes some of his arguments may be pretty near to those of the Lost Cause; in general the author is said to have done a really good job in balancing things while still providing his opinion but his love for "Stonewall" Jackson is still evident:

"...He does a pretty good job navigating that fine line in his chapter about Gettysburg, but chooses to close his book with an imagined vignette of "what did not happen," where a one-armed Jackson rides with Lee and crosses the Mason-Dixon line on their way towards Harrisburg, PA (247-248). While it is a more compelling narrative, it would have been stronger to end on a more scholarly note instead of playing into fantasies that are usually held by Lost Causers."... (review)

You are probably right. I was not able to find any letter by Lee that expressed grief for Jackson's death. I could only find this:

"At army headquarters, where the Reverend Lacy conducted a prayer service, some 1,800 soldiers attended. Afterwards, General Lee took the chaplain aside. "When you return, I trust you will find him better," Lee said. "When a suitable occasion offers, tell him that I prayed for him last night as I never prayed, I believe, for myself." (Excerpt from "The Last Days of Stonewall Jackson" here)

 

[GwilymT]

Thank you all for your kind answers !!! I can't help but think that I should also read: "The Great Partnership: Robert E. Lee, Stonewall Jackson, and the Fate of the Confederacy". After listening to the lecture I was very interested in his reasoning and so I looked online for reviews and interviews. The author in particular seemed to possess a very good argument. I think I will buy the book anyway. Frankly I am a bit intrigued. Of course the book may have some big flaws (slavery for example is not mentioned at all) but it may still provide an interesting read (and review here?). Sometimes some of his arguments may be pretty near to those of the Lost Cause; in general the author is said to have done a really good job in balancing things while still providing his opinion but his love for "Stonewall" Jackson is still evident:

"...He does a pretty good job navigating that fine line in his chapter about Gettysburg, but chooses to close his book with an imagined vignette of "what did not happen," where a one-armed Jackson rides with Lee and crosses the Mason-Dixon line on their way towards Harrisburg, PA (247-248). While it is a more compelling narrative, it would have been stronger to end on a more scholarly note instead of playing into fantasies that are usually held by Lost Causers."... (review)

You are probably right. I was not able to find any letter by Lee that expressed grief for Jackson's death. I could only find this:

"At army headquarters, where the Reverend Lacy conducted a prayer service, some 1,800 soldiers attended. Afterwards, General Lee took the chaplain aside. "When you return, I trust you will find him better," Lee said. "When a suitable occasion offers, tell him that I prayed for him last night as I never prayed, I believe, for myself." (Excerpt from "The Last Days of Stonewall Jackson" here)

Likely an apocryphal quote, but I see why the author needed to include it.

 

[wausaubob]

Agreed. While both men made no secret of their religious devotion, Lee was first and foremost a career officer who would recognize military ability regardless of a person's faith. Anyway, there are other differences between Lee and Jackson that would tend to negate any religious affiliation. Jackson was a known eccentric, whereas Lee had a more down to earth view of things.

This is my view. Jackson was a very intense man. I don't know if anyone felt close to him.
Lee was older than most of the highly ranked Confederates. And he was better educated than most of them, which helped his West Point record and his advancement in the US Army. I don't think Lee felt any personal attachment to Jackson. I think JEB Stuart was closer to Lee. General Lee genuinely missed Stuart when he was out of touch and after Stuart became a casualty. He was Lee's best subordinant.