"Transition" Model 1841 (Harpers Ferry)

[kotkinjs1]

Hi all,
I've searched the forum, read over the various 1841 monographs, etc but can't find an answer. Did Harpers Ferry ever make an 1841 with Model 1855 features right before the 1855 would be adopted? Steel barrel bands, nose cap, and trigger guard in an 1855 stock (with brass patch box), type IIa slide pattern long distance rear sight, but an unaltered .54 1841 barrel (but stamped 1854 on the tang)?

To me this sounds like, if 'original,' and end-of-model lash up with whatever barrels were left in the bins at Harpers Ferry (but why the barrel would be '54 dated and still in .54 caliber seems odd to me) coupled to a model 55 stock, or some weird post war kluge of parts but that just seems odd too. But was there ever a true 'transition' model aside from the Type I through IV alterations? And that patch box looks....strange. Pics from the piece I'm looking at.

 

[OldSarge79]

I can't get in close enough with your photos, but is there a "U" stamped on the barrel bands? If not, I would say it is not a Harper's Ferry transition model. I've never seen anything like it.
Confederate-assembled piece from captured parts? More likely, perhaps. If there is a "U" on the bands but they don't line up with the springs, that would indicate Confederate.
Is there a letter stamped in the wood forward of the trigger guard?

 

[Jeff in Ohio]

The barrel is shorter than a Model 1851, and the inletting of that patchbox is not professional work. The barrel bands look like those on the Springfield musketoons.

The Model 1841 Mississippi rifle was smaller in the various parts compared to the Model 1855 rifle. That's based on memory, not current measurement.

I don't know what this is, but if my belief that none of the parts of a Model 1841 will interchange with parts of the Model 1855 is correct, there could be no "transition" model between the two!

 

[johan_steele]

You have what I believe is a genuine frankenmusket. The workmanship and mix of parts are not done by Harpers Ferry or a CS Arsenal. And Whitney would have marked it. My thoughts are that it's a put together for the centennial from a mix of Bannerman parts.

 

[Grayrock Volunteer]

This musket is a cut down rifled and sighted M1842 Musket with a non-military patchbox added to it.

 

[johan_steele]

This musket is a cut down rifled and sighted M1842 Musket with a non-military patchbox added to it.

That was my first thought as well but the OP states still in .54... which throws out the Special model M1842 as that was only done in .69. That's why I went with calling it a frankenmusket. I think you'd be right if it was in .69 as the lock and hammer are off a 42. The ramrod appears to be a cut down 42 rod as well someone putting a 61 nosecap on her.

@kotkinjs1 are we certain it is in .54?

 

[Grayrock Volunteer]

That was my first thought as well but the OP states still in .54... which throws out the Special model M1842 as that was only done in .69. That's why I went with calling it a frankenmusket. I think you'd be right if it was in .69 as the lock and hammer are off a 42. The ramrod appears to be a cut down 42 rod as well someone putting a 61 nosecap on her.

@kotkinjs1 are we certain it is in .54?

The barrel is Springfield Armory manufacture. You can tell this by the lack of the three initial combo found in front of the VP eagle stamps on Harpers Ferry barrels. It is a M1842 barrel, rifled and sighted, and later cutdown. This gun sold at an auction a month or two ago and was misidentified there, and has since been listed on another online platform with the same incorrect ID.