Surgeons

[dixie1861]

Would each regiment have their own surgeon or "medical team"? How close did the surgeons actually get the battlefield? I've heard the assistant surgeons were closer to actual fighting...is that true? And what is an "assistant surgeon," exactly? Is it more like a medic?

Thank ya'll so much...you're the best.

 

[CLoperfido]

Each regiment would have their own surgeons. An assistant surgeon would in fact be closest to the fighting and his day to day job was to be with his regiment. It was their job to go behind the firing line, usually a few hundred yards and find a spot in a depression or gulley that would afford some protection against stray lead. With the help of a hospital steward they would set up a dressing or aid station which would serve as the first point of care for a wounded soldier. He would be given alcohol or medicine to help counteract shock, the assistant surgeon would attempt to pick out pieces of lead if there was any, and the bleeding would attempt to be stemmed and bandaged. The wounded wounded would then be prepared for transport to a field hospital usually located a mile and a half or so away from the front lines which would be stop two. There you will have your Surgeon who perform your more complex procedures such as amputations. Final stop would be to a general hospital located in a larger city such as DC, Philadelphia, Baltimore.

You might be interested in this:

 

[dixie1861]

View attachment 181636 View attachment 181635 Each regiment would have their own surgeons. An assistant surgeon would in fact be closest to the fighting and his day to day job was to be with his regiment. It was their job to go behind the firing line, usually a few hundred yards and find a spot in a depression or gulley that would afford some protection against stray lead. With the help of a hospital steward they would set up a dressing or aid station which would serve as the first point of care for a wounded soldier. He would be given alcohol or medicine to help counteract shock, the assistant surgeon would attempt to pick out pieces of lead if there was any, and the bleeding would attempt to be stemmed and bandaged. The wounded wounded would then be prepared for transport to a field hospital usually located a mile and a half or so away from the front lines which would be stop two. There you will have your Surgeon who perform your more complex procedures such as amputations. Final stop would be to a general hospital located in a larger city such as DC, Philadelphia, Baltimore.

You might be interested in this:

Thanks so much! Yes, that looks really interesting and informative. So was the assistant surgeon actually a trained doctor, or more of a nurse?

Yikes, that just sounds rough. Those poor soldiers.

 

[CLoperfido]

Well thats an interesting question. The guy that I wrote about went to medical school but that really didn't mean much per say. Med school back then usually consisted of two years divided into 9 month blocks. Instruction was mostly lectures with very little hands on clinical work. Most surgeons at the beginning of the war had no actual surgical experience. They had to learn very quickly. Yes there were review boards for entrance as a surgeon thay consisted of an interview and test on various subjects but there were surgeons who slipped through the cracks and received appointments when they shouldn't have.

 

[dixie1861]

Hmm...interesting. Yeah, the medical school back then was not that great. Was it different in Europe, though? I guess just whoever was willing to go went. Or maybe the better surgeons were the "head surgeons"?

And I'm sure it wasn't the best organization of medical staffing either. I'm sure it was rather hectic, to say the least.

 

[CLoperfido]

Hmm...interesting. Yeah, the medical school back then was not that great. Was it different in Europe, though? I guess just whoever was willing to go went. Or maybe the better surgeons were the "head surgeons"?

And I'm sure it wasn't the best organization of medical staffing either. I'm sure it was rather hectic, to say the least.

Europe was definitely more advanced than the United States. 4 year medical studies were common and cities such as Vienna and Paris were educational hubs. They had a better understanding of how germs were spread and better medical practices.

The beginning of the war the medical department was extremely disorganized and under funded. As the war progresses and the wounds and battles piled up, medical advances had no choice but to keep up. Ambulance corps, battlefield triage systems, better record keeping, and the studies of best medical practices contributed to the modern systems we have in place today.

 

[dixie1861]

So would the ones in Europe have more "hands-on" stuff than the US did? Like you said earlier, it sounds like it was mostly lectures instead of actual surgeries in the US med school.


Thanks for all the info! I'll keep my eye out for the book.

 

[James N.]

This marker above in the woods at Stony Hill just north of Gettysburg's Wheatfield indicates where one such Union field dressing station was located. The Black Horse Tavern below was the location of the hospital for McLaws' Division of Longstreet's Corps for the same part of the battle's the second day. Like CLoperfedo says, the dressing station was actually ON the battlefield and subject to both rifle and shell fire, whereas the tavern was a couple of miles behind Confederate lines in an area that saw no fighting and was therefore a much safer location.

 

[James N.]

... Most surgeons at the beginning of the war had no actual surgical experience. They had to learn very quickly. Yes there were review boards for entrance as a surgeon thay consisted of an interview and test on various subjects but there were surgeons who slipped through the cracks and received appointments when they shouldn't have.

One of my favorite accounts concerned a college student - NOT a medical student at all - who accompanied his medical student friend who was traveling to take the oral exam for assistant contract surgeons and passed based solely on what his friend had told him during the train trip to the exam location. He apparently served successfully for the duration of the war, having absolutely no previous experience!

 

[Tom Elmore]

By mid-war, each regiment usually had one, more senior, surgeon (with the equivalent rank of major) and one, more junior, assistant surgeon (with the rank of captain), although early in the war two assistant surgeons might be assigned, especially in Union regiments. The most senior surgeons could be detached from their regiment and placed in charge of a brigade, division or corps hospital(s). Even an assistant surgeon would have a medical degree, or close to it. Something equivalent to a medic was the regiment's Hospital Steward. Even a few privates might be pressed into service as nurses in regiments that sustained mass casualties after a large battle.

Some of the better surgeons augmented their medical degrees with additional training in European medical schools, which were widely believed to be at the cutting edge of the medical profession. A handful had even served in a war zone. I know of 24 medical colleges or schools, north and south, that had turned out surgeons and assistant surgeons for both sides.

A few examples:
(CSA) Surgeon John Thompson Darby, Maj. Gen. Hood's staff. Attended Medical College of South Carolina; obtained M.D. from University of Pennsylvania, Medical Department, 1858; graduated from Jefferson Medical College with honors.
(CSA) Assistant Surgeon Alexander Rives, Jr., 15th Alabama. Attended University of Virginia, Medical School, 1857-1859; graduated from New York University, Medical College in 1861.
(CSA) Surgeon Erwin James Eldridge, Cobb's Georgia Legion. Jefferson Medical College, 1854, M.D.; studied in Vienna; served in the Crimean War.
(CSA) Brigade Surgeon George Rogers Clark Todd (brother of Mary Todd Lincoln). Transylvania University, Medical Department, M.D., 1850.
(CSA) Surgeon William Riddick Whitehead, 44th Virginia. VMI graduate, attended University of Virginia, Medical School, 1851-1852; obtained M.D. from University of Pennsylvania, Medical Department, 1853; M.D. from School of Medicine, Paris, France, 1860; Professor of Clinical Medicine, New York Medical College, 1860-1861.
(CSA) Assistant Surgeon Samuel Taylor Holliday, 27th Virginia. Obtained M.D. from University of Pennsylvania, Medical Department, 1860.
(CSA) Surgeon-in-Charge of Third Corps hospitals, Henry DeSaussure Fraser. Medical College of South Carolina, 1851, M.D.; afterwards worked at a hospital in Paris.

(USA) Assistant Surgeon Edgar Parker, 13th Massachusetts. Harvard College, Medical School, 1863, M.D.
(USA) Surgeon Nelson Isham, 97th New York. Graduated 1828 from Yale, School of Medicine.
(USA) Assistant Surgeon Richard Powell, 88th New York. Graduated from Licentiate Royal College of Surgeons, Ireland.
(USA) Assistant Surgeon John Ryan, 9th Massachusetts. Harvard College, Medical School, 1860, M.D.
(USA) Division Surgeon Daniel Garrison Brinton, Fifth Corps. Graduated from Jefferson Medical College in 1860; student in Paris and Heidelberg, 1861.
(USA) Division Surgeon Elias W. H. Beck, 19th Indiana. Attended Ohio Medical College; New York University, Medical College, 1848, M.D.

 

[dixie1861]

One of my favorite accounts concerned a college student - NOT a medical student at all - who accompanied his medical student friend who was traveling to take the oral exam for assistant contract surgeons and passed based solely on what his friend had told him during the train trip to the exam location. He apparently served successfully for the duration of the war, having absolutely no previous experience!

Wow, talk about a good memory! I wonder how good of a doctor he was though...

 

[dixie1861]

This marker above in the woods at Stony Hill just north of Gettysburg's Wheatfield indicates where one such Union field dressing station was located. The Black Horse Tavern below was the location of the hospital for McLaws' Division of Longstreet's Corps for the same part of the battle's the second day. Like CLoperfedo says, the dressing station was actually ON the battlefield and subject to both rifle and shell fire, whereas the tavern was a couple of miles behind Confederate lines in an area that saw no fighting and was therefore a much safer location.

View attachment 181651

That's pretty neat! Thanks for posting those pictures.

 

[dixie1861]

By mid-war, each regiment usually had one, more senior, surgeon (with the equivalent rank of major) and one, more junior, assistant surgeon (with the rank of captain), although early in the war two assistant surgeons might be assigned, especially in Union regiments. The most senior surgeons could be detached from their regiment and placed in charge of a brigade, division or corps hospital(s). Even an assistant surgeon would have a medical degree, or close to it. Something equivalent to a medic was the regiment's Hospital Steward. Even a few privates might be pressed into service as nurses in regiments that sustained mass casualties after a large battle.

Some of the better surgeons augmented their medical degrees with additional training in European medical schools, which were widely believed to be at the cutting edge of the medical profession. A handful had even served in a war zone. I know of 24 medical colleges or schools, north and south, that had turned out surgeons and assistant surgeons for both sides.

A few examples:
(CSA) Surgeon John Thompson Darby, Maj. Gen. Hood's staff. Attended Medical College of South Carolina; obtained M.D. from University of Pennsylvania, Medical Department, 1858; graduated from Jefferson Medical College with honors.
(CSA) Assistant Surgeon Alexander Rives, Jr., 15th Alabama. Attended University of Virginia, Medical School, 1857-1859; graduated from New York University, Medical College in 1861.
(CSA) Surgeon Erwin James Eldridge, Cobb's Georgia Legion. Jefferson Medical College, 1854, M.D.; studied in Vienna; served in the Crimean War.
(CSA) Brigade Surgeon George Rogers Clark Todd (brother of Mary Todd Lincoln). Transylvania University, Medical Department, M.D., 1850.
(CSA) Surgeon William Riddick Whitehead, 44th Virginia. VMI graduate, attended University of Virginia, Medical School, 1851-1852; obtained M.D. from University of Pennsylvania, Medical Department, 1853; M.D. from School of Medicine, Paris, France, 1860; Professor of Clinical Medicine, New York Medical College, 1860-1861.
(CSA) Assistant Surgeon Samuel Taylor Holliday, 27th Virginia. Obtained M.D. from University of Pennsylvania, Medical Department, 1860.
(CSA) Surgeon-in-Charge of Third Corps hospitals, Henry DeSaussure Fraser. Medical College of South Carolina, 1851, M.D.; afterwards worked at a hospital in Paris.

(USA) Assistant Surgeon Edgar Parker, 13th Massachusetts. Harvard College, Medical School, 1863, M.D.
(USA) Surgeon Nelson Isham, 97th New York. Graduated 1828 from Yale, School of Medicine.
(USA) Assistant Surgeon Richard Powell, 88th New York. Graduated from Licentiate Royal College of Surgeons, Ireland.
(USA) Assistant Surgeon John Ryan, 9th Massachusetts. Harvard College, Medical School, 1860, M.D.
(USA) Division Surgeon Daniel Garrison Brinton, Fifth Corps. Graduated from Jefferson Medical College in 1860; student in Paris and Heidelberg, 1861.
(USA) Division Surgeon Elias W. H. Beck, 19th Indiana. Attended Ohio Medical College; New York University, Medical College, 1848, M.D.

Oh, thank you so much! So would the highest-up surgeon be just regular "surgeon," or would brigade surgeon or division surgeon be higher? Just wondering.

 

[Tom Elmore]

The official title is still Surgeon, but a brigade or division surgeon would be a nominal recognition of increased responsibility. Those with good surgical skills were put to work with constant operations after a major battle, and were referred to as operating surgeons. Even an Assistant Surgeon might find himself being tapped to focus on operations if his peers acknowledged his abilities. Typically the operating surgeons handled the more complicated cases at a level above the regiment. Perhaps the pinnacle for a senior surgeon in the field would be a Medical Director of a division or corps, but this position appears to have been more administrative or managerial in nature, and might be a respected position for an older doctor who was no longer capable of personally performing operations.

When Maj. Gen. Sickles had his leg taken off by a solid shot at Gettysburg, he specifically asked for Surgeon James T. Calhoun, who served as both Medical Director and Chief Surgeon of his Second Division, to work on him. Even a private came to recognize a good surgeon from a bad one. The latter might include a surgeon who was known to drink a little too freely on the job.

At Gettysburg, a division surgeon in the Union First Corps instructed his operating surgeons to submit injuries at or near the shoulder joint to Dr. John Henry Beech of the 24th Michigan, who served as surgeon of the Iron brigade, because of his "skill and good judgment in managing" those particular kind of cases. Other surgeons were admired because of their ability to make a nice stump from an amputated arm or leg, especially by their patients who had to live with it for the remainder of their lives.

 

[dixie1861]

The official title is still Surgeon, but a brigade or division surgeon would be a nominal recognition of increased responsibility. Those with good surgical skills were put to work with constant operations after a major battle, and were referred to as operating surgeons. Even an Assistant Surgeon might find himself being tapped to focus on operations if his peers acknowledged his abilities. Typically the operating surgeons handled the more complicated cases at a level above the regiment. Perhaps the pinnacle for a senior surgeon in the field would be a Medical Director of a division or corps, but this position appears to have been more administrative or managerial in nature, and might be a respected position for an older doctor who was no longer capable of personally performing operations.

When Maj. Gen. Sickles had his leg taken off by a solid shot at Gettysburg, he specifically asked for Surgeon James T. Calhoun, who served as both Medical Director and Chief Surgeon of his Second Division, to work on him. Even a private came to recognize a good surgeon from a bad one. The latter might include a surgeon who was known to drink a little too freely on the job.

At Gettysburg, a division surgeon in the Union First Corps instructed his operating surgeons to submit injuries at or near the shoulder joint to Dr. John Henry Beech of the 24th Michigan, who served as surgeon of the Iron brigade, because of his "skill and good judgment in managing" those particular kind of cases. Other surgeons were admired because of their ability to make a nice stump from an amputated arm or leg, especially by their patients who had to live with it for the remainder of their lives.

Oh ok, thank you! You are a wealth of information.

 

[Harris]

A good topic to brag about my GGG Grandfather- William C Shurlock ; Surgeon of the 51st Pennsylvania

Copied and pasted from a bio of his, with a mention of being an asst. surgeon 1st, before becoming the Surgeon of another regiment

He was a graduate of the class of 1858 of the Jefferson Medical College, of Philadelphia. He then returned to Darlington, Beaver County, Pennsylvania, and entered upon the practice of his profession. There he stayed until the echo of the first gun fired at Fort Sumter reverberated through Beaver county. He then thought it his duty to offer his services to his country. He raised a company of one hundred and ten men for the three-months service, but they were not accepted as the state's quota was filled. He kept his company together and when the time arrived he entered the service as captain of Company D, of the "Roundheads," or the One Hundredth Pennsylvania Volunteers. He was in the taking of Port Royal and Beaufort, South Carolina, after which he was stricken down with disease with no prospect of recovering his health in that climate. On the recommendations of the surgeons of his regiment he was induced to resign the 16th day of December, 1861. He went home and the change restored him to health and he again entered the service as assistant surgeon in the One Hundredth Pennsylvania Volunteers; his commission dated July 15, 1862. He served with his regiment until December 28, 1863, when he was promoted to surgeon and ordered to report for duty to the Fifty-first Pennsylvania Veteran Volunteers on the 9th day of March, 1864, and remained on duty as surgeon at the division hospital in the field, where he remained on duty until April 24, 1865, when he returned to his regiment and remained with it till June 6, 1865, when he was mustered out of service under orders of the war department for the reduction of the army dated May 17, 1865.
Battles in which he participated were Port Royal, second Bull Run, Chantilly, South Mountain, Antietam, Fredericksburg, Vicksburg, Jackson, Blue Springs, Campbell's Station, siege of Knoxville, Wilderness, Spotsylvania Court House, Cold Harbor, North Anna, front of Petersburg, June 17th and 18th, Burnside's Mine, Welding Railroad, Ream's Station, Poplar Grove, Church, Hatchie's Run, Fort Steadman, capture of Petersburg and fall of Richmond.

Shurlock is seated, 2nd from the left

 

[dixie1861]

A good topic to brag about my GGG Grandfather- William C Shurlock ; Surgeon of the 51st Pennsylvania

Copied and pasted from a bio of his, with a mention of being an asst. surgeon 1st, before becoming the Surgeon of another regiment

He was a graduate of the class of 1858 of the Jefferson Medical College, of Philadelphia. He then returned to Darlington, Beaver County, Pennsylvania, and entered upon the practice of his profession. There he stayed until the echo of the first gun fired at Fort Sumter reverberated through Beaver county. He then thought it his duty to offer his services to his country. He raised a company of one hundred and ten men for the three-months service, but they were not accepted as the state's quota was filled. He kept his company together and when the time arrived he entered the service as captain of Company D, of the "Roundheads," or the One Hundredth Pennsylvania Volunteers. He was in the taking of Port Royal and Beaufort, South Carolina, after which he was stricken down with disease with no prospect of recovering his health in that climate. On the recommendations of the surgeons of his regiment he was induced to resign the 16th day of December, 1861. He went home and the change restored him to health and he again entered the service as assistant surgeon in the One Hundredth Pennsylvania Volunteers; his commission dated July 15, 1862. He served with his regiment until December 28, 1863, when he was promoted to surgeon and ordered to report for duty to the Fifty-first Pennsylvania Veteran Volunteers on the 9th day of March, 1864, and remained on duty as surgeon at the division hospital in the field, where he remained on duty until April 24, 1865, when he returned to his regiment and remained with it till June 6, 1865, when he was mustered out of service under orders of the war department for the reduction of the army dated May 17, 1865.
Battles in which he participated were Port Royal, second Bull Run, Chantilly, South Mountain, Antietam, Fredericksburg, Vicksburg, Jackson, Blue Springs, Campbell's Station, siege of Knoxville, Wilderness, Spotsylvania Court House, Cold Harbor, North Anna, front of Petersburg, June 17th and 18th, Burnside's Mine, Welding Railroad, Ream's Station, Poplar Grove, Church, Hatchie's Run, Fort Steadman, capture of Petersburg and fall of Richmond.

View attachment 181768
Shurlock is seated, 2nd from the left

Wow--that's so amazing! That's so great you have so much documented about him. Thanks for sharing!

 

[PTFreeman]

A good topic to brag about my GGG Grandfather- William C Shurlock ; Surgeon of the 51st Pennsylvania

Copied and pasted from a bio of his, with a mention of being an asst. surgeon 1st, before becoming the Surgeon of another regiment

He was a graduate of the class of 1858 of the Jefferson Medical College, of Philadelphia. He then returned to Darlington, Beaver County, Pennsylvania, and entered upon the practice of his profession. There he stayed until the echo of the first gun fired at Fort Sumter reverberated through Beaver county. He then thought it his duty to offer his services to his country. He raised a company of one hundred and ten men for the three-months service, but they were not accepted as the state's quota was filled. He kept his company together and when the time arrived he entered the service as captain of Company D, of the "Roundheads," or the One Hundredth Pennsylvania Volunteers. He was in the taking of Port Royal and Beaufort, South Carolina, after which he was stricken down with disease with no prospect of recovering his health in that climate. On the recommendations of the surgeons of his regiment he was induced to resign the 16th day of December, 1861. He went home and the change restored him to health and he again entered the service as assistant surgeon in the One Hundredth Pennsylvania Volunteers; his commission dated July 15, 1862. He served with his regiment until December 28, 1863, when he was promoted to surgeon and ordered to report for duty to the Fifty-first Pennsylvania Veteran Volunteers on the 9th day of March, 1864, and remained on duty as surgeon at the division hospital in the field, where he remained on duty until April 24, 1865, when he returned to his regiment and remained with it till June 6, 1865, when he was mustered out of service under orders of the war department for the reduction of the army dated May 17, 1865.
Battles in which he participated were Port Royal, second Bull Run, Chantilly, South Mountain, Antietam, Fredericksburg, Vicksburg, Jackson, Blue Springs, Campbell's Station, siege of Knoxville, Wilderness, Spotsylvania Court House, Cold Harbor, North Anna, front of Petersburg, June 17th and 18th, Burnside's Mine, Welding Railroad, Ream's Station, Poplar Grove, Church, Hatchie's Run, Fort Steadman, capture of Petersburg and fall of Richmond.

View attachment 181768
Shurlock is seated, 2nd from the left

Hi, I am trying to find out if my grandmother Emma Shurlock is related to William C. Shurlock. Her father was Robert Shurlock..also of

 

[PTFreeman]

A good topic to brag about my GGG Grandfather- William C Shurlock ; Surgeon of the 51st Pennsylvania

Copied and pasted from a bio of his, with a mention of being an asst. surgeon 1st, before becoming the Surgeon of another regiment

He was a graduate of the class of 1858 of the Jefferson Medical College, of Philadelphia. He then returned to Darlington, Beaver County, Pennsylvania, and entered upon the practice of his profession. There he stayed until the echo of the first gun fired at Fort Sumter reverberated through Beaver county. He then thought it his duty to offer his services to his country. He raised a company of one hundred and ten men for the three-months service, but they were not accepted as the state's quota was filled. He kept his company together and when the time arrived he entered the service as captain of Company D, of the "Roundheads," or the One Hundredth Pennsylvania Volunteers. He was in the taking of Port Royal and Beaufort, South Carolina, after which he was stricken down with disease with no prospect of recovering his health in that climate. On the recommendations of the surgeons of his regiment he was induced to resign the 16th day of December, 1861. He went home and the change restored him to health and he again entered the service as assistant surgeon in the One Hundredth Pennsylvania Volunteers; his commission dated July 15, 1862. He served with his regiment until December 28, 1863, when he was promoted to surgeon and ordered to report for duty to the Fifty-first Pennsylvania Veteran Volunteers on the 9th day of March, 1864, and remained on duty as surgeon at the division hospital in the field, where he remained on duty until April 24, 1865, when he returned to his regiment and remained with it till June 6, 1865, when he was mustered out of service under orders of the war department for the reduction of the army dated May 17, 1865.
Battles in which he participated were Port Royal, second Bull Run, Chantilly, South Mountain, Antietam, Fredericksburg, Vicksburg, Jackson, Blue Springs, Campbell's Station, siege of Knoxville, Wilderness, Spotsylvania Court House, Cold Harbor, North Anna, front of Petersburg, June 17th and 18th, Burnside's Mine, Welding Railroad, Ream's Station, Poplar Grove, Church, Hatchie's Run, Fort Steadman, capture of Petersburg and fall of Richmond.

View attachment 181768
Shurlock is seated, 2nd from the left

Harris, My grandmother Emma Shurlock was born in 1877. Her father was Robert Shurlock. I think he may have been Robert J Shurlock. I wonder if he was a brother to William C. Shurlock the Civil War Surgeon? Emma married Arthur Ormston . Emma and Arthur were married near or at Darlington or Big Beaver, PA. Patti