Orderly Sergeant = First Sergeant?

[Mr.Wackelpudding]

The rank structre says they are on the same level, but whats then the differnt between these two? Or is ist just another term for the First Sergeant?

 

[captaindrew]

They are one in the same. The 1st sergeant handles most of the paperwork/reports at the company level hence AKA orderly sergeant.

 

[Stryker65]

What rank structure did you use? I'm trying to find where QM Sgt and Comm Sgt fit in, and I can't find anything...

 

[captaindrew]

What rank structure did you use? I'm trying to find where QM Sgt and Comm Sgt fit in, and I can't find anything...

Those are very specific jobs that require their full attention, they are sergeants but don't carry any field authority if that's what you mean.

 

[Package4]

What rank structure did you use? I'm trying to find where QM Sgt and Comm Sgt fit in, and I can't find anything...

Depending upon branch, infantry had one QM Sgt per regiment or battalion and was part of the regimental staff. Cavalry (US) had one per company as the demands of this branch were necessarily greater than infantry (horse equipments and forage).

The Commissary Sgt., likewise was a one of the three sergeants of the regimental staff (Sgt. Major, QM Sgt. & Commissary Sgt.)

 

[Dan Kohli]

Depending upon branch, infantry had one QM Sgt per regiment or battalion and was part of the regimental staff. Cavalry (US) had one per company as the demands of this branch were necessarily greater than infantry (horse equipments and forage).

The Commissary Sgt., likewise was a one of the three sergeants of the regimental staff (Sgt. Major, QM Sgt. & Commissary Sgt.)

The cavalry and artillery still had the quartermaster and commissary sergeants on the regimental/battalion staff. They just have the company grade of quartermaster and commissary sergeants to supplement the additional logistics for those arms.

 

[Jack7171]

They are one in the same. The 1st sergeant handles most of the paperwork/reports at the company level hence AKA orderly sergeant.

What would the 2nd and 3rd Sgt's do?

 

[Stryker65]

Those are very specific jobs that require their full attention, they are sergeants but don't carry any field authority if that's what you mean.

I have seen, though, in the Appomattox campaign and other smaller orders of battle, in which the QM Sgt ranks the Sgt in commanding the remnants of a regiment. I think I saw it in GWC Lee's division...

 

[captaindrew]

What would the 2nd and 3rd Sgt's do?

They had specific positions in the company alignment. In a battalion line they would be behind the main lines as file closers. The 2nd Sergeant would be on the left flank. He would be the left guide if the company was alone or on the left flank of the battalion line.

 

[captaindrew]

What would the 2nd and 3rd Sgt's do?

To break it down further each company is split into 2 platoons, at full strength each would have 2 sergeants and 2 corporals. The 2nd Sergeant's job on the field is one of the busiest going from guide to file closer as the alignment demands.

 

[captaindrew]

I have seen, though, in the Appomattox campaign and other smaller orders of battle, in which the QM Sgt ranks the Sgt in commanding the remnants of a regiment. I think I saw it in GWC Lee's division...

In dire circumstances you have to do what you have to do, they were most likely the senior guys that were capable of doing it.

 

[Package4]

I have seen, though, in the Appomattox campaign and other smaller orders of battle, in which the QM Sgt ranks the Sgt in commanding the remnants of a regiment. I think I saw it in GWC Lee's division...

From Petersburg to Appomattox nothing was usual for CS forces, so those would not be very good examples, some regiments were surrendering with aggregate numbers in the teens. I would imagine seniority would play a huge role in command at this juncture.

 

[SgtDarby8OVI]

In both theory and practice, each enlisted rank should be able to do the job one rank above them. A veteran private should be able to perform a corporal's job, 2nd and 3rd sergeants should know one another's tasks and be able to serve as 1st sergeant in a pinch. This not only came in handy in case of battle losses, but would cover the company's needs in case of sickness, field promotions, reassignments, and detached duty by one or more non-coms.

 

[thomas aagaard]

The rank structre says they are on the same level, but whats then the differnt between these two? Or is ist just another term for the First Sergeant?

Orderly sergeant / covering sergeant is a "job" in the drill books. He covers the captain. that is, stand behind him and take over his position in the formation when he moves to the front or rear of the company.

1st sergeant is a rank.
In the infantry he is responsible for all the paperwork and that the day to day life in the company work as it should.
In the cavalry and artillery they also have a quartermaster sergeant and a Commissary Sgt. So they had 3 men to do the same work.
(with all the extra company gear, like guns, and all the horses it makes sort of sense)

Similar the rest of the sergeants got the same rank.
but the 2nd sergeant in combat/drill is the left guide of the company and got a different job than the rest of the sergeants.

But the rest of the time they all have the same jobs.


So one is a job during drill and in combat.
The other is a rank and administrative position that that have a long list of tasks to make sure gets done every day.

Part of this difference might very well be the fact that the drill books are word for word translations of the French 1845 drill.
The number of corporals and sergeants and even number of companies in the battalion might also not fit, depending on if we are talking Hardee, Casey's or other drill books. (and if we are talking a US volunteer regiment or a regular one)