Need some help sorting out some items

[east_beast]

Found another picture of Edward here in a really cool old... well, something. It's very small, maybe roughly 4"x3". Almost like a jewelry case. It's definitely Edward.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

Found another picture of Edward here in a really cool old... well, something. It's very small, maybe roughly 4"x3". Almost like a jewelry case. It's definitely Edward.

That looks like a Federal uniform, not a Confederate one.….

 

[east_beast]

That looks like a Federal uniform, not a Confederate one.….

It's definitely not. It's definitely him. Very similar to the picture of him held by the American Civil War Museum. I think the picture was just overexposed or something. Look how dark his hands are. Everything looks darker and bluer than it should.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

No, that one above is Confederate. I meant this one - it's the shoulder insignia. Confederate uniforms put it on the collar.

 

[east_beast]

No, that one above is Confederate. I meant this one - it's the shoulder insignia. Confederate uniforms put it on the collar.

View attachment 466506

Hmmm... no clue.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

The face is an absolute match so this is pretty amazing. We need to call in some experts. Maybe @lupaglupa could help?

 

[east_beast]

The face is an absolute match so this is pretty amazing. We need to call in some experts. Maybe @lupaglupa could help?

It couldn't be pre-war because he wasn't in the military pre-war. He didn't join until late 1862.

My best guess is he could be wearing a pre-war frock of an ancestor for a photo op. Basically the entire family was military dating back to the Revolutionary War.

 

[east_beast]

Made it down to Lincolnton the other day and swung by to visit the gravesites.

Their parents are buried beside them. I have several letters from the mother written to them.

View attachment 466010

In the plot right next to them is Maj. Gen. Ramseur.

View attachment 466011

The 49th NC spent considerable time serving under Ramseur and being from prominent families of the same small town it's highly likely they were at minimum familiar with each other.

More on this. Turns out the maiden name of their mother was Elizabeth Caroline Ramseur. They weren't familiar. They were family.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

More on this. Turns out the maiden name of their mother was Elizabeth Caroline Ramseur. They weren't familiar. They were family.

So this is is half brother? One fought for the north and one for the south? They sure look like twins- except for the uniforms.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

More on this. Turns out the maiden name of their mother was Elizabeth Caroline Ramseur. They weren't familiar. They were family.

And that is why the cemetery plots are next to each other.

 

[east_beast]

So this is is half brother? One fought for the north and one for the south? They sure look like twins- except for the uniforms.

No. The mother of the three brothers was a Ramseur. All three fought for the Confederacy. Edward was a Captain in the NC 49th Infantry and his older brother George was a Lieutenant. Edward was the youngest, George was the oldest. William was the middle brother and he was in the cavalry. George was the only survivor of the war and he barely made it. He was wounded multiple times, once severely. By the end of the war he was battling chronic infections and so sickly that he was made aide de camp to Maj. Gen. Hoke.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

My best guess is he could be wearing a pre-war frock of an ancestor for a photo op. Basically the entire family was military dating back to the Revolutionary War.

Not buying that - it doesn't look pre-war to me and it's not a cadet uniform-

You should post your questions on the uniforms forum https://civilwartalk.com/forums/ranks-uniforms-clothing-gear.296/

or the ancestry forum https://civilwartalk.com/forums/researching-civil-war-records-ancestry.38/
and let the folks who know these things help you out.

 

[east_beast]

Not buying that - it doesn't look pre-war to me and it's not a cadet uniform-

You should post your questions on the uniforms forum https://civilwartalk.com/forums/ranks-uniforms-clothing-gear.296/

or the ancestry forum https://civilwartalk.com/forums/researching-civil-war-records-ancestry.38/
and let the folks who know these things help you out.

Done.

Question about pic. Known Confederate appears to be wearing Union frock? | Ranks, Uniforms, Clothing, & Gear

Capt. Edward Phifer, NC 49th. Below is a picture of him held by the American Civil War Museum, clearly in a Confederate frock: But then here is a pic I found of him in family belongings in what appears to be a Union frock: Any ideas? See this thread for a LOT more info...

civilwartalk.com

 

[lupaglupa]

It could be a case of a doppelganger - they say we all have one out there.

 

[east_beast]

Took a better look at the pic this morning and those shoulder insignias aren't actually part of the pic. Someone drew them on. It's a black and white pic but the insignia and buttons are clearly gold and clearly drawn on. Was the drawing tracing something that was there in the pic or just added for who knows what reason? No clue.

 

[Reconstructed Rebel]

Took a better look at the pic this morning and those shoulder insignias aren't actually part of the pic. Someone drew them on. It's a black and white pic but the insignia and buttons are clearly gold and clearly drawn on. Was the drawing tracing something that was there in the pic or just added for who knows what reason? No clue.

That was a standard enhancement sometimes added to those type of pictures- putting a little color in the cheeks and highlights on the buttons and insignia. You can find more about it at https://civilwartalk.com/forums/period-photos-examinations.94/

 

[Package4]

Took a better look at the pic this morning and those shoulder insignias aren't actually part of the pic. Someone drew them on. It's a black and white pic but the insignia and buttons are clearly gold and clearly drawn on. Was the drawing tracing something that was there in the pic or just added for who knows what reason? No clue.

Taking a stab here that one of the brothers was most likely in a militia unit prior to the war; very little is known of the NC militia uniforms, but what is known is that they did wear blue. I imagine that the uniform pictured is one that was left at home and utilized by Edward when he went to have his picture taken upon enlistment, when uniforms were in short supply. His hands are dark, but his face is not and the coloring of buttons and shoulder straps were common place. Double breasted uniforms were regulation for line officers in the US Army up until 1851 and it would make sense that militia units would conform as they saw fit.

I believe the coat to be blue and militia, owing to the shoulder straps, it was most likely pre war. There was a similar coat unearthed recently belonging to an Alabama militia officer, who wore it during the war. The Phifers appeared to have some pre war military training, owing to the rank upon enlistment. Could be that he wore the coat while at home on leave later in the war, but I believe it to be a mid to late 1850's militia coat.

 

[east_beast]

Taking a stab here that one of the brothers was most likely in a militia unit prior to the war; very little is known of the NC militia uniforms, but what is known is that they did wear blue. I imagine that the uniform pictured is one that was left at home and utilized by Edward when he went to have his picture taken upon enlistment, when uniforms were in short supply. His hands are dark, but his face is not and the coloring of buttons and shoulder straps were common place. Double breasted uniforms were regulation for line officers in the US Army up until 1851 and it would make sense that militia units would conform as they saw fit.

I believe the coat to be blue and militia, owing to the shoulder straps, it was most likely pre war. There was a similar coat unearthed recently belonging to an Alabama militia officer, who wore it during the war. The Phifers appeared to have some pre war military training, owing to the rank upon enlistment. Could be that he wore the coat while at home on leave later in the war, but I believe it to be a mid to late 1850's militia coat.

Yeah, this makes as much sense as anything I can come up with. Thanks.

 

[Package4]

Video of first cartridge box:

Apologies, I lost track of this thread. Your cartridge box with the three tiers is a rare Merrill's Patent carbine cartridge box, in exceptional shape!

 

[east_beast]

Apologies, I lost track of this thread. Your cartridge box with the three tiers is a rare Merrill's Patent carbine cartridge box, in exceptional shape!

I've been in contact with Larry Hicklen per your recommendation. We had a good 30+ minute conversation a couple weeks ago. I'm having him do a full appraisal for the insurance rider. This was the item that interested him the most too. He said the belt has the highest monetary value of all the items, but this is the most interesting item in terms of the historical perspective in his opinion. He said he's never seen another one quite like this one, specifically mentioning how the tiers were angled. It was his opinion that this was likely a custom-made version made to specific specifications per person ordering it. Presumably Lt. Edward Phifer but unless I can find it specifically mentioned in a letter we'll never know for sure. There's still dozens of letters I haven't read through yet.