Nathan Bedford Forest

[TheJohnnyReb1861]

I know in later life he finally turned to God, but before then was he still a Christian? Just a sinful one, or was he something else. His momma was Godly, same for his wife. He attended Church during the war and asked folk to pray for him. Its also said that he held reverence for Christians. It sounds to me like he believed in God, but was just more sinful.

 

[Andersonh1]

I believe Forrest had a conversion experience late in his life, probably a couple of years before he died, and became a believer in Christ. Most of his life he was not a believer, though his wife was, and Forrest showed respect for Christian belief while not holding to them himself. It was a sermon from Matthew 7 by a Reverend George Stainback that got through to Forrest.

"Forrest suddenly leaned against the wall and his eyes filled with tears. 'Sir, your sermon has removed the last prop from under me,' he said, 'I am the fool that built on the sand; I am a poor miserable sinner."​

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[bamaman]

I know in later life he finally turned to God, but before then was he still a Christian? Just a sinful one, or was he something else. His momma was Godly, same for his wife. He attended Church during the war and asked folk to pray for him. Its also said that he held reverence for Christians. It sounds to me like he believed in God, but was just more sinful.

He was a violent man. Godly?

 

[7th Mississippi Infantry]

I know in later life he finally turned to God, but before then was he still a Christian? Just a sinful one, or was he something else. His momma was Godly, same for his wife. He attended Church during the war and asked folk to pray for him. Its also said that he held reverence for Christians. It sounds to me like he believed in God, but was just more sinful.

You may enjoy this thread:

Member Review - Nathan Bedford Forrest's Redemption by Shane Kastler | Civil War Books, Stories, & Media

Nathan Bedford Forrest's Redemption by Shane E. Kastler Published by Pelican Publishing 176 pages ISBN- 1589808347 This won't be a long review, but then again this wasn't a long book. As the title suggests this book focuses on Forrest's redemption, or rather his journey to Christ, which should...

civilwartalk.com

 

[Desert Kid]

More or less, between his father's death and a few years before his own death, Forrest was an agnostic.

 

[nc native]

N. B. Forrest married a Christian wife named Mary Montgomery who was very patient with him and probably had some influence on him finally seeing the light, so to speak. Mary had an uncle who was her guardian after her father's death. He was a Presbyterian minster and wanted no part of N.B. Forrest marrying Mary. Mary's uncle asked Forrest why he wanted to marry Mary. "It's because she's a Christian" was his response. Forrest's behavior was anything but the Christian ideal until the last three years of his life but his conversion was apparently genuine. One of the last things he was recorded as saying was " There are no clouds that now separate me from my Heavenly Father."

 

[7th Mississippi Infantry]

N. B. Forrest married a Christian wife named Mary Montgomery who was very patient with him and probably had some influence on him finally seeing the light, so to speak. Mary had an uncle who was her guardian after her father's death. He was a Presbyterian minster and wanted no part of N.B. Forrest marrying Mary.

Thus another paradox about this man.

 

[Nathan Stuart]

I know in later life he finally turned to God, but before then was he still a Christian?

Undoubtedly, from all reports, Forrest was a strong character with a fierce reputation and a propensity for violence. He also generally practiced total abstinence, being rigidly opposed to the use of any type of liquor.

Despite these personal characteristics, several of his reliable and close contemporaries described him as being religious with Christian values.

Fellow Confederate cavalry commander, B-G John Tyler Morgan, who later became a U.S. Senator from Alabama and Forrest's legal adviser, recalled a conversation he had with Forrest in the last year or so of the latter's life in which Forrest said to him, …"I have seen too much of violence, and I want to close my days at peace with all the world, as I am now at peace with my Maker"… Apparently, Forrest also told Morgan that he had for some time been attached to the Cumberland Presbyterian Church, and that he intended to live a peaceful and a better life for the remainder of his days.

(Source - 'Life of General Nathan Bedford Forrest' by John Wyeth at pp 622-23)

Col. David Campbell Kelley, a Minister of the Methodist Episcopal Church who led a cavalry regiment under Forrest (he was known as 'Forrest's fighting preacher') and later served as a pastor of several large Methodist Churches in Tennessee, in the postwar period described Forrest as, …"a thorough believer in Christianity, and was as fully persuaded of the efficacy of prayer in times of danger or in battle……Throughout the war he always gave me the fullest opportunities for preaching in camp, courteously entertaining at his mess-table all preachers whom I might choose to invite. He was always present at such service when it was practicable. While we were messmates there was always family prayer in his tent at night, conducted alternately by the chaplain and myself."…

(Source – Ibid., at page 630)

Dr. James Benjamin Cowan, who was Medical Director of Forrest's Cavalry Corps during most of the conflict, said of Forrest after the war, …"He had always the most profound respect for religion, always had preaching at his headquarters on Sundays if there was a minister at hand, and had prayers in his tent at night. In those days we never started on an expedition but what the men were drawn up in line, and the chaplain, while the heads of all were uncovered, evoked God's blessing on our cause. Nothing called down his ire quicker or brought surer punishment than for a man to disturb religious service in any part of the camp."…

(Source – Ibid., at pp 631-32)

Also liked this story told by Kelley (and reproduced by Wyeth at page 631) about Forrest, which perhaps says something about his views on religion. On one of his expeditions, a chaplain of the Union Army was captured and taken to Forrest's headquarters. The chaplain was understandably deeply anxious and expected to be killed. Instead, Forrest treated him cordially and considerately. Forrest invited the chaplain to share supper and asked the chaplain for the blessing before eating. The following day, Forrest arranged an escort for the grateful and relieved chaplain through the lines and told him he did not make war on non-combatants. As he bade farewell to the chaplain, Forrest reportedly humorously remarked to him, …'Parson, I would keep you here to preach for me if you were not needed so much more by the sinners on the other side"…

 

[7th Mississippi Infantry]

I doubt anyone will ever know if Forrest experienced a religious conversion or not.
But the written documentation suggests that he did.

As he was married to a minister's niece (who was also her legal guardian) .
Theres no doubt in my mind that religion did eventually influence this man.

 

[TheJohnnyReb1861]

Undoubtedly, from all reports, Forrest was a strong character with a fierce reputation and a propensity for violence. He also generally practiced total abstinence, being rigidly opposed to the use of any type of liquor.

Despite these personal characteristics, several of his reliable and close contemporaries described him as being religious with Christian values.

Fellow Confederate cavalry commander, B-G John Tyler Morgan, who later became a U.S. Senator from Alabama and Forrest's legal adviser, recalled a conversation he had with Forrest in the last year or so of the latter's life in which Forrest said to him, …"I have seen too much of violence, and I want to close my days at peace with all the world, as I am now at peace with my Maker"… Apparently, Forrest also told Morgan that he had for some time been attached to the Cumberland Presbyterian Church, and that he intended to live a peaceful and a better life for the remainder of his days.

(Source - 'Life of General Nathan Bedford Forrest' by John Wyeth at pp 622-23)

Col. David Campbell Kelley, a Minister of the Methodist Episcopal Church who led a cavalry regiment under Forrest (he was known as 'Forrest's fighting preacher') and later served as a pastor of several large Methodist Churches in Tennessee, in the postwar period described Forrest as, …"a thorough believer in Christianity, and was as fully persuaded of the efficacy of prayer in times of danger or in battle……Throughout the war he always gave me the fullest opportunities for preaching in camp, courteously entertaining at his mess-table all preachers whom I might choose to invite. He was always present at such service when it was practicable. While we were messmates there was always family prayer in his tent at night, conducted alternately by the chaplain and myself."…

(Source – Ibid., at page 630)

Dr. James Benjamin Cowan, who was Medical Director of Forrest's Cavalry Corps during most of the conflict, said of Forrest after the war, …"He had always the most profound respect for religion, always had preaching at his headquarters on Sundays if there was a minister at hand, and had prayers in his tent at night. In those days we never started on an expedition but what the men were drawn up in line, and the chaplain, while the heads of all were uncovered, evoked God's blessing on our cause. Nothing called down his ire quicker or brought surer punishment than for a man to disturb religious service in any part of the camp."…

(Source – Ibid., at pp 631-32)

Also liked this story told by Kelley (and reproduced by Wyeth at page 631) about Forrest, which perhaps says something about his views on religion. On one of his expeditions, a chaplain of the Union Army was captured and taken to Forrest's headquarters. The chaplain was understandably deeply anxious and expected to be killed. Instead, Forrest treated him cordially and considerately. Forrest invited the chaplain to share supper and asked the chaplain for the blessing before eating. The following day, Forrest arranged an escort for the grateful and relieved chaplain through the lines and told him he did not make war on non-combatants. As he bade farewell to the chaplain, Forrest reportedly humorously remarked to him, …'Parson, I would keep you here to preach for me if you were not needed so much more by the sinners on the other side"…

Thank you, you were the only one who actually answered my question. Some of the other folk even claimed that he wasnt even a Christian in later life. So from what I can tell unless I misunderstood. He was always a Christian, even though the civil war. He just wasnt as religious, as in he didnt practice the teachings, but he believed in God. But it was after the war that he truly became a devout Christian. Is this correct?

 

[Nathan Stuart]

Thank you, you were the only one who actually answered my question.

You're most welcome.

But it was after the war that he truly became a devout Christian. Is this correct?

Based on the cited recorded observations by prominent and reliable witnesses (Morgan, Kelley and Cowan), Forrest seemed to display behaviors that indicated he had a commitment to Christian religious beliefs – e.g. admitting attachment to the Presbyterian Church, believing in prayer during battle, providing and supporting preachers in camp, regularly personally attending preacher's services, conducting regular nightly group prayers in his own tent, enforcing uninterrupted strict religious services throughout his camp . (Methodist pastor, Kelley, also definitively described Forrest as, ' a thorough believer in Christianity'.).

It appears that many of these descriptions relate to Forrest's behavior during the war. It seems that after the war, and closer to death, Forrest perhaps focused more on his pre-existing religious beliefs, when he had more time and opportunity to reflect on his life (without being distracted by the fighting). In summation, it appears from this evidence that there was a demonstrated pattern of consistent behavior, emanating from at least the wartime period, to suggest that Forrest maintained, and adhered to, Christian religious beliefs.

 

[bamaman]

I believe Forrest had a conversion experience late in his life, probably a couple of years before he died, and became a believer in Christ. Most of his life he was not a believer, though his wife was, and Forrest showed respect for Christian belief while not holding to them himself. It was a sermon from Matthew 7 by a Reverend George Stainback that got through to Forrest.

"Forrest suddenly leaned against the wall and his eyes filled with tears. 'Sir, your sermon has removed the last prop from under me,' he said, 'I am the fool that built on the sand; I am a poor miserable sinner."

​

Forrest massacring helpless people at Ft. Pillow makes me wonder about his religious conversation

 

[Rebforever]

Forrest massacring helpless people at Ft. Pillow makes me wonder about his religious conversation

He didn't massacre anybody himself. When he was able, he stopped the shooting. There was a hearing on his activity and found not guilty.

 

[Andersonh1]

Forrest massacring helpless people at Ft. Pillow makes me wonder about his religious conversation

Leaving aside the question of whether or not a massacre happened, the conversion came years after Fort Pillow. And it's the man aware of his sin who feels the need to repent, so the events at Fort Pillow could well have contributed to Forest's realization.

 

[bamaman]

Leaving aside the question of whether or not a massacre happened, the conversion came years after Fort Pillow. And it's the man aware of his sin who feels the need to repent, so the events at Fort Pillow could well have contributed to Forest's realization.

If shooting my piano teacher caused me to be aware of my sin that would be helpful to me but not helpful to my teacher or their family. Especially if it was years later. Forrest never paid for it.

 

[RedRover]

It is said that Gen. Forrest was a member of the International Order of Odd Fellows from 1847 to his death (many brethren attended his funeral). The rules of that order require of its fraternal brethren:

The first degree of that order noted:

+

General Basil Duke of Kentucky wrote after Forrest's death he understood he became "deeply" religious before his death.

From the general's obituary, he was evidently still in good standing with the Odd Fellows:

As regards Fort Pillow, Forrest, by his own account, cut the halyard to the federal flagstaff to make clear the fort had capitulated. From the committee on the conduct of the War report on the massacre, Pvt. Elias Falls, Co. A, 1st Alabama Artillery (C):

Capt. T.F. Berry, CSA, claimed Forrest whacked so many of his men with his sword to get them to stop shooting, they practically had to fall in to protect themselves, and threatened him... which is mutinous insubordination. It was said by some of his compatriots he shot one of his own men to regain authority.

General Dick Taylor, Forrest's commanding officer in the last months of the war says he spent alot of time with him.

 

[Andersonh1]

If shooting my piano teacher caused me to be aware of my sin that would be helpful to me but not helpful to my teacher or their family. Especially if it was years later. Forrest never paid for it.

I don't have a lot of sympathy with the wish that members of the long-dead wartime generation should have been given some sort of payback. If the people who lived through the war didn't see the need, we certainly shouldn't be second guessing them.

 

[7th Mississippi Infantry]

Leaving aside the question of whether or not a massacre happened, the conversion came years after Fort Pillow. And it's the man aware of his sin who feels the need to repent, so the events at Fort Pillow could well have contributed to Forest's realization.

Well, whatever happened at Fort Pillow will always be used against Forrest by his many modern day opponents.
But that's a different discussion.

There are many well documented conversations on this forum about the details of Fort Pillow.
But I doubt NBF had a religious epiphany after Fort Pillow.

However, I do think he had a change of heart toward the end or after the War.

None of us will ever know what NBF thought.

 

[bamaman]

I don't have a lot of sympathy with the wish that members of the long-dead wartime generation should have been given some sort of payback. If the people who lived through the war didn't see the need, we certainly shouldn't be second guessing them.

People from 158 years ago should not be judged by todays standards. I feel that some posts are quoting horrible events as a reason for Forrest finding religion. I never met him.

 

[Louisiana Jayhawker]

I support the notion that Bedford had a "religious epiphany" but very late in life and shortly before death. He certainty had a large amount of murderous blood on his hands and a mountain of guilty about it. I have read a source which claimed late in life he attended church with both his white offspring and his biological black offspring from negro slave(s). Who can deny him his worry of judgement in the afterlife and eternal damnation.

The business about him cutting short the time period allowed to murder unarmed black and white Federal soldiers at Fort Pillow (to make his warning point to all not to enroll in the Federal Army) is easily explained. Once enough killing was done to make his point, he stopped it, because he knows the high value of slaves, due to being a Slaveholder and Slave Trader himself. Thus, not wanting to destroy such valuable property, especially since many of them belong to local Slaveholders. He had no right in destroying their property.